Greenpeace

[Jaffa]

quote:

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A friend who tries to earn a living as a haulier is always whinging that fishermen pay no duty on fuel, as he does. He has to pay hundreds for tachographs to be fitted to his vehicles, whereas the public purse pays for satellite monitoring equipment to be fitted to fishing boats!

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The point of this whinge is what? Fishing and haulage are totally different industries, with totally different histories.

 

The goverment laid any tarmac out to the viking bank? or rockall ?(forget that; they gave rockall away without telling anyone )

 

But, FWIW I think the whole tachograph thing is an enormous scam too

 

It all comes out of the cod end.

 

BTw my stepfather is a haulier and has a lot of strong opinions but i've never heard him blame fishermen for anything

[Leon Roskilly]

LOL Jaffa

 

But I'd still like to be able to describe and quantify 'The Industry' contribution to the public purse, especially these 'sly taxes' (REAlly!!).

 

(All I'm seing at the mo' is red herrings!)

 

Help!

 

TL - leon

 

[ 28. September 2005, 10:55 PM: Message edited by: Leon Roskilly ]

[Jaffa]

Nice "Red Herring" swerve there Leon

 

Not able to compare the value of RSA vs Commercial exports then ?

 

Like to take a guess as to which brings in more?

[Leon Roskilly]

Jaffa:

Nice "Red Herring" swerve there Leon

 

Not able to compare the value of RSA vs Commercial exports then ?

 

Like to take a guess as to which brings in more?

I'm told that the striper fishing on the USA East Coast is getting better and better.

 

I know three UK anglers who have fished there in the last three years, and it looks highly likely that I'll be there come late July next year

 

Too bad it's revenue that we are exporting rather than income.

 

Now do you really want to talk about the amount of fish products that we export versus those we import?

 

Tight Lines - leon

[Leon Roskilly]

http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/cgi-bin/ubb/ul...=2&t=005828&p=8

 

"In 2003 the fishing industry in the UK had 6735 fishing vessels, with a further 548 vessels registered in the Channel Islands and the Isle of

Man.

 

Some 631 thousand tonnes of sea fish were landed into the UK and abroad by the UK fleet with a total value of £521 million.

 

(The direct spend of Recreational Anglers is £538 million! http://statistics.defra.gov.uk/esg/reports...ing/default.asp )[

 

In addition the UK imported some £1437 million of fish. (So most of those inshore jobs depend on imports - see below!)

 

The UK also exported fish and fish products to the value of £891 million.

 

The UK has a substantial fish processing industry of around 563 businesses, which employ some

18,480 people.

 

(Angling - In terms of first round impacts on the spending translates into 18,889 jobs - http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/cgi-bin/ubb/ul...0284;u=00000007 Note that's from UK angling, not imports!)

 

At the retail level there were approximately 1.4 thousand fishmongers in the year 2003.

 

87.3 percent in volume and 88.2 percent in value, excluding canned produce was sold through supermarkets.

 

Fish is also consumed in restaurants and in take away form, from fish and chip shops.

 

A small proportion of the catch is used to make fish oils and animal feeds.

 

Some of the species caught by UK fishing vessels find a better market abroad and these species are usually exported or landed directly abroad.

 

In 2003, UK vessels landed directly into non-UK ports 187 thousand tonnes of sea fish with a value of £129 million."

 

What would really be interesting is the amount of revenue that relates to each fish killed by each sector; commercial versus recreational angling

 

 

Now about that contribution of the UK fishing industry to the public purse (versus the public expenditure on the fishing industry!)

 

 

TL - leon

 

ps Most of the value of the UK catch comes from non-finfish species - shellfish and crustaceans.

 

Many of the finfish on which the Industry depends is of no or little interest to anglers - angler fish, meagrim, haddock etc.,

 

Many of the fish that is of interest to anglers is of no interest to commercials (except as pot bait!)

 

Wrasse, flounder, tope, mullet etc

 

We CAN live and work together!!

 

[ 29. September 2005, 12:02 AM: Message edited by: Leon Roskilly ]

[Jaffa]

East CoastUS striper fishing sounds great and I've love to give it a shot

 

I can think of a lot more than three boats that are landing thousands of tonnes of fish for export though, so yes i would like to know how all these fancy statistics boil down as far as a plus or minus for Scotland plc mean Sadly we have major social problems that won't be solved by a few of us getting to go fishing overseas.

[Jaffa]

Nice figures but they only refer to the price at landing, before they are turned into "product". Given the way the fishery office, at least in my day, used to collect such data, I reckon you could fairly give it a 50% plus or minus for accuracy

[Leon Roskilly]

Jaffa:

Nice figures but they only refer to the price at landing, before they are turned into "product". Given the way the fishery office, at least in my day, used to collect such data, I reckon you could fairly give it a 50% plus or minus for accuracy

OK I was being modest in only citing the angling direct spend of £538 million.

 

http://statistics.defra.gov.uk/esg/reports...ing/default.asp

 

"Using the full range of estimates, we derived a total value for the angling experience of between £600m and £1,300m per year" (the Prime Minister's Strategy Unit also gave a worth to the Recreational Angling Sector of £1.3 billion)

 

BUT

 

http://investinfish.org/documents/TheMotiv...lSeaAnglers.pdf

 

"The Defra report found that the total expenditure by sea anglers in England and Wales was £538 million per annum, with a total of 1.1 million households containing at least one person who participates in sea angling.

 

This translates to an average spend of £489 per participating household p.a.

 

In contrast, our study derived an average spend of £1028 per participating household p.a. –

more than double the previous estimate."

 

TL - leon

 

[ 29. September 2005, 12:34 AM: Message edited by: Leon Roskilly ]

[Leon Roskilly]

er,

 

I'd really like to know the type and amount of the contribution of the 'Fishing Industry' to the public purse!

 

- No duty on Fuel

- Valuable fishing licenses given free

- Valuable quota given free

- and the rest!

 

Demands from the Bradley report that inshore boats make a significant contribution to costs.

 

http://www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/consult/...onsultation.pdf

 

It's fun to swap banter and compare RSA and commercial, but in all seriousness we really do need to have a convincing argument that the commercials do pay their way to put before the less knowledgeable (but influential!).

 

Convince me, and the case is made!!

 

Tight Lines - leon

 

[ 29. September 2005, 12:45 AM: Message edited by: Leon Roskilly ]

[Jaffa]

Aye, thats all great stuff, but which earns more for Scotland plc? Expenditure means what? ; according to the news i see we are all spending more than we earn.

 

I can understand how a fishing boat, landing say herring, is a good thing. The herring gets processed, transported and sent abroad - the Uk makes money.

 

How does an angler spending all his spare cash on foreign made kit, then using a a foreign car and petrol, to get to his venue (which will cost in road use, emergency services etc should an analyst care to look at it ) actually contribute to bringing money into the country?

 

I struggle to understand this stuff but would love a simple explanation.