Greenpeace

[Leon Roskilly]

Jaffa,

 

Will you please stop posting before I've finished!

 

Tight Lines - leon

[Leon Roskilly]

Jaffa:

Aye, thats all great stuff, but which earns more for Scotland plc?

er,

 

All 'my' figures on Angling relate only to England and Wales (the commercial figures include Scotland) - need to factor that in!!

 

There is no Scottish study on the value of Sea Angling - that is a National Disgrace!

 

(though the Scottish freshwater studies are impressive - I can't see how a salmon can be worth thousands simply because it is caught on a rod and line and a tastier cod is worth so little!)

 

TL - leon

 

[ 29. September 2005, 12:53 AM: Message edited by: Leon Roskilly ]

[Jaffa]

I'm bored and i missed you

 

Even if you are always wrong

[wurzel]

whats it all got to do with the price of chips anyway, who gives a stuff whose worth more or less we are all part of a whole.

 

The striper bass fishery is nothing like the UK bass fishery, for a start it has not got a French fleet working 6 miles from the shore.

 

leon

Any business who uses fuel as a exspence can cliam the duty back,

 

Ok I was given a licence which has now of some value, not of my doing and I will have to pass it on to my son for him to carry on in the business.

 

Being under ten metres I have never had any quota given me, I have to fish to a megre monthly quota given out by DEFRA, I was given the option to take up the larger boat quota system, at a cost of well over £100,000 I declined.

 

What do you mean "and the rest"?

[Captain Black]

There might not be a French fleet working six miles offshore, Wurzel. But there is a healthy homegrown commercial fleet which has benefitted from stringent controls on it fishing effort (starting originally with a moratorium).

quote:

---

The recent status of the striped bass fishery in the Chesapeake Bay tells a relative success story, after more than 10 years of steep decline. Commercial landings in Maryland and Virginia portions of the Bay generally increased from the early 1930s, culminating in a record commercial catch in 1973 of 14.7 million pounds. Thereafter the striper harvest fell steadily to 1.7 million pounds by 1983. Sport fishermen reported a similar pattern. The decline translated into a loss of about 7,000 jobs and $220 million in 1980.

In response to this dramatic downturn, Congress passed the Atlantic Striped Bass Conservation Act in 1984. Maryland and Delaware imposed fishing moratoria from 1985 to 1989, and Virginia imposed a one-year moratorium in 1989. Although the fishery reopened in 1990 following three successful spawning years, it remains tightly restricted.

---

I'm heading out to the East Coast of the USA later this month.

 

I used to fish my area at least three times a week, all year round, until about seven years ago, when the winter fishing for cod became so dire it simply wasn't worth the expenditure of time, money and effort. Now I fish only during the spring, summer and autumn (bass, mullet & smoothounds). Once or twice a year I'll head somewhere for a week. Up until last year it was Ireland in the Autumn for the bass fishing. Last year I splashed out and went to Tobago for a week. This year, as I've said it's the USA.

 

My point. Last years Tobago trip cost me somewhere in the region of £1500 this years trip is going to be at least £2000. That is cash I'd far rather spend in this country because it would enable me to have more trips but with less travelling. But the fishing in this country is going downhill and until angling starts to be recognised for its 'value' to UKplc then it will continue to haemorrhage cash as anglers head 'abroad' for decent sized fish to catch.

 

I'm fed up with commercial fisherman holding up their hands in horror at the mere suggestion that they are in any way responsible for any part of the decline in any fishery; and at the same time pooh poohing the suggestion that RSA has more value than commercial angling does.

 

sam-cox said

quote:

---

Now Im not saying we area at the point yet, but there must reach a point where there are so few commercial fisherman that the fishery becomes substainable.

---

If that's what we're waiting to happen then God help us. No, I don't think that's what happens sam-cox. What happens is that the fishery crashes and cannot recover - look at the Newfoundland cod fishery. And what will the commercial fishermen do? Well, they'll turn their attentions to another species(see the Lowestoft chap who wanted to target Tope & smoothound).

 

Believe it or not there are actually commercial fishermen not only arguing against the increase in the mls for bass but seriously suggesting that the mles should be reduced because there is a better market for small plate sized bass. I really cannot get my head around such total shortsightedness.

 

John

p.s. There are six of us in total going to the USA - that's £12,000 (admittedly that's including flights)

 

[ 02. October 2005, 06:24 PM: Message edited by: Captain Black ]

[wurzel]

Hello Captain Black

Would the stiper bass fishery be the same if the Fench were fish up to 6 miles off shore?

You should try cod fishing on the Whitby charter boats they are still catching plenty, or even from the shore with Jaffa he says the fishing is quite good in his part of Scotland. The Bass fishing around the channel Iles seems to be getting better all the time with plenty of large bass.

I don't have any truck with any of the financial figures quoted and you go abroad because you want to and can aford to not because you have to.

I see you are another misguided person who thinks the grand Banks cod fishery so called collapse was due to over fishing.er what other fishery is going to er crash?

The lowestoft chap wanted and is selling tope and smooth hound that the local fleet have been catching for years, the only difference now is they are getting more money for them.

As it happens I agree to lower the mls on bass would be maddness, I would be happy to see an increase in the lms for all spesies.

[Ian Burrett]

wurzel:

or even from the shore with Jaffa he says the fishing is quite good in his part of Scotland.

The trouble is we have short memories What is quite good, going out and catching half a dozen codling to 5 pounds?

 

Quite good in my opinion should be gauged against 20 years ago, When with the right conditions shore fishing would produce many times more fish and plenty of double figure fish.

 

A double figure cod is a rare event from boat or shore now

[big_cod]

Going wrecking tommorow for the elusive cod hope there is is some left post tommorow night with sp.

[sam-cox]

A cod in the Thames Estuary now becomes a cod at 3.5lb, when I was a lad a cod wasnt a cod until it was 6lb. Im NOT LOOKING FORWARD TO THIS YEARS CODING.

[Jaffa]

Ian Burrett:

Ian Burrett:

or even from the shore with Jaffa he says the fishing is quite good in his part of Scotland.

The trouble is we have short memories What is quite good, going out and catching half a dozen codling to 5 pounds?

 

Quite good in my opinion should be gauged against 20 years ago, When with the right conditions shore fishing would produce many times more fish and plenty of double figure fish.

 

A double figure cod is a rare event from boat or shore now

Its a fair point about memory Ian; in my mind this coast fishes (from the shore anyway) pretty much as good as it did when I was 20 years younger, but that does not mean im right.

 

So much has changed over those years: The commercial fleet is only a shadow of what it was when i was a kid (not just in boat numbers but in catching power), the weather (and this is just my opinion, has been weird for a few years now; regardless of the size of the cod stock we need gales to bring them tight inshore).

 

Its hard to sort out one element from the other, though theres plenty of poeple that appear to have all the answers.

 

All i know is that the local fleet now consists of a couple of prawn trawlers, a few creel boats, no netters, and nothing much that i can see would effect anglers one way or the other.

 

Meanwhile the whole north sea ecosystem seems to be doing a major change (take your pick from manmade or natural causes) in which the biggest fishery (sandeels) collapses, without anyone being able to come up with a rational explanation that pins the blame on the commercials (though of course everyone from greenpeace to the commercial fishermens organisations plays the blame game because its in their interests to do so.. )

 

Memory is indeed dangerous imho. I think theres much more going on here and this whole blame game is just getting in the way