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Mouth damage


shooter

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Has anyone ever considered how much damage is caused to a carps mouth when it is ''safely'' in the net. If the weight or clip gets caught in the meshing then the fish is pulling with all its strength against a very short, taut hooklink. I think this is going to exert pressures on the hook hold area that is far in excess of what pressure is on during the fight and initial run.

Thinking about it more and more I am coming to the opinion that ALL mouth damage is caused within the landing net. I'm probably wrong but even so I am now very careful landing fish but the problem of the weight and clip snagging on the net is pretty much impossible to overcome.

 

Any thoughts???

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Morning matey !!

 

Tricky subject this, IMO the fish shouldnt be in the net long enough for this to happen. The clip ( i presume safety clip) shouldnt really have anythign to catch on, if there is a rubber sleave over the top of it?? the weight shouldnt get caught in the net unless it has spikes on it (lol) the damage comes down to poor fish care (unhooking whilst on the mat) and probably down to the great debate on barbed v barbless !! i have seen first hand the damage a barlbess hook can do compared to a barbless. But i am not goign there as its probably been covered b4 already :D

www.stoneyandfriends.co.uk

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Morning!!

 

I'm still not convinced, what about when youve got a hook hold thats outside or near the fishes lips, the hook can certainly get caught in meshing, and then the carp will be pulling straight against the hook, and thats going to be some sort of huge pressure, Its also stopped me ever thinking about using braid for mainline, the stretch in the line and bend in the rod will account for any big lunges the carp puts in during the fight, with braid, no stretch, bigger forces, more damage????

 

I know this subject has been covered before but its the only big worry I have left in Carp fishing, I think most other safety issues surrounding the sport have been resolved but this one wont go away, it isnt nice seeing 'hoover' carp with a pee sized mouth.

 

By the way, how do barbed hooks cause more damage than a barbless? It doesnt make sense that a tiny extra appendage could add significantly to damage in the hook hold area, is there any written evidence or any studies carried out into this phenomenon, if it was proved to be the case then surely there should be no more barbed hooks (for coarse fishing anyway) on sale, similar to lead shot.

 

This probably bores people to death, but its imperative to continue to further the safety aspect of our sport non-stop to guard against future attempts to ban it.

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On the contrary Barbless hooks cause more damage in Carp fishing and that's something I have first hand experience of. They have a tendency to bite deeper and move about during the fight and they end up causing a deep gash on some occasions.

 

IMO Barbless hooks have no place in the armoury of a competent specialist.

 

Barbless hooks are OK in the smaller sizes but are usually only insisted on by day ticket fisheries that are full of noddys. I'd be insulted if a club or syndicate I was a member of brought in a barbless rule.

 

Microbarb hooks don't move about during the fight and are easy to remove.

 

If you make sure any parts of your rig that are likely to catch on your net are covered with a sleeve you will minimise the risk. The risk of the hook catching is still there but imo it's a small one. You could always unhook the fish in the net before lifting it from the water if you're that worried. Another alternative would be to go for a wider mesh net like those used by lure anglers that have mesh that hooks won't penetrate.

 

On the subject of braid you have to adjust your fish playing style accordingly, even with mono I never strike at a run - you need do no more than lean into the fish. If your rig mechanics are right the fish will have hooked itself anyway. When playing a fish with braid you're best letting it tire itself away from the bank and then drawing it in. There's always the odd pig-headed fish that comes in like a wet rag and then goes ballistic under the rod tip so I tend to back the clutch right off and let them run if they're close in.

 

[ 27. April 2004, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: Rob Ward ]

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Shooter - If you are convinced you are doing mouth damage with your net, why use it? Fish to the water's edge, good grip on the hook, a quick motion to remove it, deed done.

 

With the rare exception of a fish where I really want to get a pic or a tiddler that is going to become live bait, most of mine are released that way. Never even out of the water except the head and that just long enough to unhook.

" My choices in life were either to be a piano player in a whore house or a politician. And to tell the truth, there's hardly any difference!" - Harry Truman, 33rd US President

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I think most Carp Anglers in the UK photograph their fish out of habit Newt.

 

Although if I'm Carp Fishing and having problems with Bream and Tench I generally unhook them in the water without netting them.

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I stopped using barbed hooks because I became sick of the damage inflicted by them, especially when they turn and double hook. Twice in a row, I had to spend far too long trying to remove a barbed hook (and one with a small barb) that had become embedded in the cartilege. I once hooked a chub on a barbed hook when only the eye was still visible. I have never had a hook with a squashed barb cause more than minimal damage, and they simply slide out, sometimes without the need to use forceps. Nothing will ever convince me to use barbed hooks again so I refuse to fish waters where their use is enforced.

English as tuppence, changing yet changeless as canal water, nestling in green nowhere, armoured and effete, bold flag-bearer, lotus-fed Miss Havishambling, opsimath and eremite, feudal, still reactionary, Rawlinson End.

 

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I am still convinced that almost all the damage is caused by the weight of the lead swinging about a couple of inches from the fish's mouth.

 

Never seemed to happen before carpers started to use weights over 2ounces.

 

 

I have caught LOADS of carp/barbel/tench/roach on barbless and noticed no damage. But it is a great deal easier to unhook the fish.

 

And most commercial fisheries insist on barbless because they have seen the damage that poor unhooking can do.

 

Den

"When through the woods and forest glades I wanderAnd hear the birds sing sweetly in the trees;When I look down from lofty mountain grandeur,And hear the brook, and feel the breeze;and see the waves crash on the shore,Then sings my soul..................

for all you Spodders. https://youtu.be/XYxsY-FbSic

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I totally agree with you on that point. All this talk about barbed or barbless is fairly inconsequential compared to the damage caused by the heavy leads. It makes me shudder to think of people using 5oz leads. Thanks for reminding me Poledark. I had temporarily forgotten about that, even though I have mentioned it myself in previous posts. I wonder if any of these extremist fishery owners who insist on barbed hooks will take the lead by banning heavy leads. Somehow I don't think so.

English as tuppence, changing yet changeless as canal water, nestling in green nowhere, armoured and effete, bold flag-bearer, lotus-fed Miss Havishambling, opsimath and eremite, feudal, still reactionary, Rawlinson End.

 

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How many waters do you know where you will need 5oz leads??? realistically unless your fishing a big water (Wrasbury springs to mind) when you need a big chuck (150yds) you shouldnt really need anything over 3oz :D 3oz isnt going to cause that much trouble IMO. Last year i saw a casting demonstration by Frank "casting King" Warwick, he easily managed 120 yards with a 3oz lead, with a standard set up, nothing flash !!

 

and to say "extremist fishery owners" is a bit harsh i think. These people/owners want the best for there fish stocks, and enough research has been done by the sounds of it, even tho theres been nothing published etc... banning big leads will never happen as you need to adapt to the situation your fishing in :D i have never used a lead bigger than 3oz and thats got me to where i need to be fishing in the lake :D

 

Education not Condemnation

www.stoneyandfriends.co.uk

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