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live baiting for perch


oneillbox

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Very true, if worms and maggots had recognisable eyes, mouths etc I'm sure that would be in for some stick too!

 

Different waters respond to different baits but I do think lures can't touch lives in terms of effectiveness

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I have never taken to pike fishing because of this, the trauma for both the angler and the fish is too much for me to take when unhooking a deep hooked fish.

 

 

No trauma at all mate.....once you know how to do it! Im sure every non pike angler/novice pike angler is sick of me saying ity but the answer is to go ouit with an experienced/capable piker initially and learn the ropes from him. I aim these comments at people intentionaly catching pike.Im not that worried about "accidental" captures as enevitably tyhese are on reletavly small single hooks.It would be just as wrong for me (or any other piker) to chastise these guys who catch one by mistake as it is the people who intentionasly set out to catch them but dont make the effort to learn how to deal with them safely.

 

Never been easier to learn how to do it properly than it is now.LOads of competent pikers ouit there who are prepared to help,loads of good " how to" guides in both magazines,on the telly,DVD's and of course the internet.Even some idiots out there who run free to attend teach ins for anyone who bothers to turn up!

Edited by BUDGIE

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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You can only do your best to avoid the problems with deep hooking and the principles are pretty simple

 

1. Good bite indication....best of all floats, watched at all times!

2. promt striking at any indication of a bait being taken.

 

As above though, don't be put off, go out with an experienced pike fisherman and have a go, it's very addictive.

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Tigger If I get the time this year and there is enough interest I will put on a Pike Teach In just for AN members.Had a couple of these for both AN and Fishing Magic members over the years and theyve always been good fun. If anyones interested take a quick look at the past fish in posts on both sites to see how the weekend is scheduled but basicly there is tuition on pike unhooking and handling as well as general tactics and methods to catch them.Fishing on the complexs water,overnight accomodation on the complex (around thirty foot from the waters edge) food etc...............and all I ask in return is thatyou make a donation (what ever you are happy with) to Les Webbers Angling Projects and JCA(UK) ventures.

 

Its an annual thread this re livebaiting but it normally doesnt come up untill later in the tear as the traditional pike season gets closer.As Ivesaid before Ive wrote a lot over the years on this subject but for those who are interested here is a summary of my thoughts on the subject-

 

For or against? Sadly this decision is made by a lot of people on purely emotive and sentimental reasons. It is therefore very hard to reason with anti live baiters as they refuse to see the facts. Many don’t actually fish for predators so in practical terms it doesn’t affect them. They use old clichéd pseudo scientific arguments to try and back up their emotional argument. As I said very hard to reason using hard facts against emotion.

 

A lot of people say that live baiting is cruel because you are sticking hooks into a live fish. I thought that was what we do every time we catch a fish? The whole business of whether fish feel pain or not is an often argued subject with many scientific studies having been carried out. Sadly none of these seem to be in agreement! The issue of is it cruel or not is one that each angler has to personally decide for them self, much as you have to make your decision in the early days of your angling career as to whether angling or not is cruel. This is a personal choice and one which I respect each individuals choice. If live baiting is not for you then fine but please also respect the choice of others who wish to do so. For me there is no difference in casting out and sticking a hook in a fish and sticking a hook in a fish then casting out.

 

Many say that they think it would be a good idea for angling to ban live baiting as it would appease the antis. I feel by doing this we would be simply falling into their hands and admitting that we accept sticking a hook into a fish is cruel. Make no mistake these people will never be on our side. It would pay to remember that they want angling banned in all its forms regardless of bait used. On the subject of bait what is live bait? After all maggots and worms are alive, should these be banned to?

 

At least to their credit the antis are consistent in there belief that angling in general is cruel. Sadly consistency is some what lacking in many anglers arguments! What sort of message does it send out when some anglers will happily use live bait but say they only lip hook them? Same as the angler who will quite happily use a roach for bait but not a carp! For the angler who thinks it is acceptable to lip hook a live but not hook it in the body (and for that matter all anglers who think it is ok to hook fish in the mouth when catching them but not to use them as bait) I will ask one question, where would be more sensitive the lip area or the back? I think we all know the answer! At this point let me point out that I made my decision a long time ago and I’m happy enough in the belief that fish don’t feel pain as we do regardless of where they are hooked. Once again if it is not for you then say so and I will respect your view. What I will not respect is some one making false statements to support their decision or trying to remove my right to choose.

 

Common examples of this are the often made remark that live baiting is unnecessary to catch pike. Yes I agree that on most waters pike can be caught on dead baits or lures but not on all! Some trout reservoirs I could take you to you could fish with deads all year and you wouldn’t get a take! Deads also catch on my local river but at a ratio of around 1 fish on a dead to every 30+ on lives! Nothing wrong with deads they are a valuable part of a pikers armoury but they aren’t the be all and end all. Catch at any cost? No certainly not but why should I have to restrict myself so much? Cheese catches roach but how would the average roach fisher feel if maggots and casters were banned and cheese was all he was allowed?

 

Some say it is unsporting. Well I can’t really comment on this one as I don’t understand the argument at all!

 

Live baiting spreads diseases. Well I won’t go in to the rights or wrongs of transporting fish as this is another personal choice as to whether you accept the rules on this issue. Let it be enough to say that the law says you must not do it and that it is quite legal to use fish you have caught as bait on the same water. Also it is a simple fact that no proven case of fish translocation or spread of disease has ever been put down to anglers live baiting. That said it pays to be sensible and only use healthy fish, after all no pike angler I know would want to be responsible for the spread of disease or translocation of a species.

 

Taking fish for live bait spoils other anglers sport. A bit of common sense and consideration does need to be shown here. A group of regular pike anglers taking 20 baits or so each every week over the winter season could have an effect on a small water with low stocking densities, but then it’s a lot easier to get baits from a large water with loads in so it is in effect a drop in the ocean! Worth bearing in mind though. Rainbow trout from your local hatchery won’t affect your local ponds stocks! They are cheap enough and make strong baits you can even get all the correct paper work in theory but in practice most local EA offices will say not to bother!

 

Using 1lb roach as baits. No way is this acceptable it would get up my nose let alone a dedicated roach anglers! Totally unnecessary as well. Over large baits are merely a waste of quality fish. Big baits are harder to use and harder to set the hooks with. They certainly don’t necessarily attract bigger fish but if you feel you need a large visual bait then why not use a skimmer? Maybe not as strong but plenty of them and wont be missed in the ecosystem as much as a 1lb roach. Anyway I wish I knew a water where I could go and catch a tub of 1lb roach that easily! In reality I don’t think it happens as much (if at all) as some anti live baiters would have us believe.

 

To sum up I made my choice a long time ago and I’m quite happy that live baiting is a perfectly acceptable tactic and no crueller (if cruel at all) than any other angling. For people who aren’t happy to do it then fine that is your choice and I would never pressure you to do so. In these days of the antis growing campaign to get angling banned full stop I feel that all anglers regardless of their personal views on live baiting should stick together and make no concessions to them at all. Like I said what is the difference between casting out and hooking a fish and hooking a fish and casting it out? I’m sure the antis won’t see any.

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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personally i hook the fish once just under the dorsal fin, this seems to be the strongest area to withstand casting etc...

 

i will try some lip hooking and tail hooking and see how i get on.

 

just another opinion, but......people who are anti livebaiting...is there any evidence that fish have more 'feeling, emotions and sentiment' than maggots or worms?? which are also a kind of livebait after all !!

 

so come on all of you 'tree huggers, get real, livebaiting is here to stay, there is simply no substitute for it, nothing comes close..... !!!

 

and hey, the predators fight well this time of year, the pike are even jumping clear of the water !!!

 

Best bit of live baiting i do is mackerel lip hooked with a treble over the wrecks for bass, brilliant bit of sport, don't knock it till u tried it. superb fun.

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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Guest tigger
Tigger If I get the time this year and there is enough interest I will put on a Pike Teach In just for AN members.

 

 

 

Budgie i've nothing against livebaiting bud.

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Budgie i've nothing against livebaiting bud.

 

 

Oooops sorry mate I meant Rabbit! Im do that a lot when replying to you guys! Well regardless all are most welcome!

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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Guest tigger
Oooops sorry mate I meant Rabbit! Im do that a lot when replying to you guys! Well regardless all are most welcome!

 

 

 

Come on Budgie, is that Cider home made m8 ? :wacko:;):lol:

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Good post Budgie, have read much literature along the same lines.

 

Serious predator anglers won't be giving up livebaiting in a hurry

 

 

couldn't agree more it is one of the most effective ways to catch a predator. :fish:

cpranim.gif

15/06/12 PB Perch 3 lb 10 oz 03/03/11 Common Carp 23lb 6 oz 05/06/12 Sturgeon 7 lb 13 oz 06/06/12 Mirror Carp 21 lb 2 oz

09/03/13 PB PIKE 27 lb 9 ozARNO3010CustomImage1086535.gif

 

 

 

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