Is it the end for charter skippers and fishing clubs? No time to bury your heads

[Steve Coppolo]

Hi Glenn

As far as I know, this whole thing hasn't come about purely for bass and bass anglers. I know that Cod are your fish, they used to be ours. I also know that there are things about current fisheries management that you are not happy with. Can you outline them for me please? From the things that you are unhappy with, can you think of any that would be impossible to change given a government with the will to do so, and the backing of every sea angler in the country?

 

It's no good looking at things as they are and saying this or that doesn't apply to me. You've got to look at how things might be if you were able to impose you own wish list, and the only way you are ever going to do that is by making a noise about the things you aren't happy with. Paying for a licence and fishing to bag limits gives you more credibility and a louder voice. Succesive governments have become sick and tired of hearing all the whining and whinging from a sector who refused to shoulder any of the blame for the state we are in, and who have steadfastly resisted any change. We really don't need to follow the commercial fishing sectors example.

[Sharkbyte]

Having taken a bit of time to read through the Florida based website Steve was kind enough to post up, surely a workable model can be used for UK species.

 

With slot sizes, minimum sizes, bag limits, closed seasons, special licenses, there are enough tools at are disposal to construct a suitable formula.

 

So how many Cod does a Whitby charter need to retain for business to flourish? What mls / possible slot size would be appropriate?

 

Are there any other areas around the Uk where extra consideration would be needed?

[Ian Burrett]

Having taken a bit of time to read through the Florida based website Steve was kind enough to post up, surely a workable model can be used for UK species.

 

With slot sizes, minimum sizes, bag limits, closed seasons, special licenses, there are enough tools at are disposal to construct a suitable formula.

 

So how many Cod does a Whitby charter need to retain for business to flourish? What mls / possible slot size would be appropriate?

 

Are there any other areas around the Uk where extra consideration would be needed?

 

The way it works in Florida is each species is taken on individual merit. The limits are changed monthly and posted throughout Florida. If there is an abundance of one type of fish then limits are lifted to perhaps 10 fish per angler, When they are in short supply it might be a 2 fish or even no fish limit.

 

The system has to flexible enough to make this workable

[glennk]

Steve,

 

How long have you got ?

 

Its nice to see someone whoose glass is half full rather than half empty like mine. I admire your positivity. My thoughts on the commercial sector and what it has done and continues to do in these parts is known to you all and I do not ever see a time when we will get any change from DEFRA and the UK legal system on that. I do not wish to go into more detail as im sure it will only provide binatone with enough information to give me a real hard time when he comes in from his 10 hour trip tonight.

 

Like I say I admire your positivity and hope things work out for you down there. I just wonder if your glass will remain half full or suddenly become half empty if DEFRA turn round and say to you all "well we thought about your MLS proposals but we thought we wouldnt bother changing anything. "

I guess the first test of this governments comittment to RSA comes in a month or so's time. Would you still be happy with bag limits and licence fees if you werent to get that little incentive your all waiting for ?

Edited May 21, 2006 by glennk

[clem]

What's wrong with bag limits? Suggesting that charters don't impact fish stocks is just stupid, of course they do. Every fish taken out of the see has SOME impact, even if it small. A charter can wipe out most of a shoal of large bass on a good day.

 

All takers of fish, commercials and recreational should be managed as they seem incapable of restraint. 1 rule for all.

 

If anglers use charters to fill their freezers then they are not anglers, they are commercials so good bloody ridence that they go 'bust'. If an angler is not happy with C&R and keeping a couple for the pot they should grow up.

 

JRT

Whats wrong with bag limits JRT?? More ridiculous beurocracy ,Impossible to enforce without having shifts of saddos stood on the quayside counting fish. It would put a hell of a lot of anglers off both the serious and the occasional this would have a knock-on impact to the local economy a big one at that in certain ports.I could go on but dont have the time.

Anyway my friend if you just take time to think you can soon work out that charter fishing from boats has NO IMPACT WHATSOEVER on fish stocks. Fish are constantly moving around often over great distances ,hunting and being hunted the angler is just one very,very small part of the equation (insignificant).

I know a couple of (very good) anglers who have been trying to fill their freezers its cost them thousands over the years and the freezers have never been any where near half full But I can assure you that every fish they caught within the appropiate size was carefully filleted and stored away to give the family many meals-no waste.

Can I ask you JRT should these guys have gone out and bought this fish from the supermarket where it would have been dragged up from a decimated seabed along with by-catch and discards by the thousand?

[Steve Coppolo]

Don't run away with the idea that I'm happy with things Glenn. Far from it. What I am saying is that sea angling licences are coming and we should be doing everything we can to ensure we get something worthwhile in return, now. It's no good waiting until they are in place and then moaning about things.

 

I also happen to believe that if we were to get something like what they have in Florida for our money, then the licences and bag limits would be worth having. When you look at the fishing over there you can see that licences and bag limits are not necessarily a bad thing IF they are managed properly. The only problem I can see with it happening over here is the incompetence and dishonesty of our politicians. The only way to sort that out is to use our votes to make sure they lose their cushy, well paid jobs if they fail to deliver. Perhaps that is the biggest difference between the states and here?

[Ian Burrett]

When a guy pays for a days deer stalking he accepts he is paying for the privelege of the shoot and must pay for the carcase if he wants to take it home.

 

I can't see alot of difference in Sea fishing.as the fish belong to the people of Britain. What right has anyone got to take bin bags full of fish home. Because it has always been that way doesn't make it right. You can't go on to the moorland and help yourself to the rabbits

[Steve Coppolo]

Whats wrong with bag limits JRT?? More ridiculous beurocracy ,Impossible to enforce without having shifts of saddos stood on the quayside counting fish. It would put a hell of a lot of anglers off both the serious and the occasional this would have a knock-on impact to the local economy a big one at that in certain ports.I could go on but dont have the time.

 

You're theories have been disproved in a big way in countries that have imposed such measures. In fact, the results are the exact opposite of what you say.

[glennk]

Do those countries have

1. A catch now pay later charter fleet wanting to take every last fish for their own.
   
2. A Department like DEFRA willing to let no 1 happen
   
3. A Legal system like ours where if you get caught breaking the rules you get a slap on the wrist and a fine so small you are left well in pocket from your illegal activities.
   

You say Licences and bag limits are a definate that may well be the case but I hate the way this has been done. Its slid through the back door whilst everyone else is looking out the front. The whole thing stinks and I am not willing to accept this pile of shite without a fight. There is not 1 incentive for people in my area to sign up to this not 1. Our accpetance of a licence and bag limits should only come about when that shower in Londen show us they mean business and not untill.

 

Hi adambroadley I see your name at the bottom of the screen there

[sam-cox]

Charter boats in NO WAY would be ruined! that would be foolish.

Our commercial fleet has shrunk and will continue to shrink for a while yet.

 

Some commercial skippers are turning to charter skippers, the last thing DEFRA or any govement would want to be seen doing is putting charter boats out of business.

 

Today with the few anglers shouting for more from govement for anglers growing I cant see anything but good to be gained by charter skippers buy thepossabilerty of good fishery managment.