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HOW TO SIMPLY IMPROVE YOUR HOOKUP RATE


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#1 fishfingers

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 04:51 PM

I like the progressive nature of this Kayak forum, and having never actually been a member of any forum before Iím finding the whole experience enlightening.

It has just occurred to me that my first topic on catching bass is just how easy things can be misinterpreted, guess this is the limit of written English. Itís funny but reading the piece again I can see how it would sound a little Ďpreachyí. I assure anyone whoís read it that this was not the intent. Anyway this a second stab at a different topic, provoked by a question asked by yakerbass, donít bite my head off!

Now, thanks in most part to the Japís, modern hooks, the materials they are made from and quality of the finishes, mean that if you by a good reputable brand you canít go wrong.

Come to think of it, I canít remember the last time I had a packet of duff hooks, must be at least 15 years.

Anyway, some of these slick bits of computer manufactured technology do however miss a an important features that less Ďperfectedí hooks did have.

As my grandfather pointed out to me, all hooks, this is the seventies remember, had a certain amount of offset. Offset was cause predominantly by heat treatment of the hooks, or in by some manufactures deliberately.

Now, take a look at your hooks. How many of then have an offset ?

I would recommend that you take a pair of pliers to those that do not. This used to be hit and miss in the old days but now hooks always seem to bend rather than snap.

Any hook that snaps rather than bends, regardless of how much they cost or were hyped, you do not want to fish with !

Put a serious offset in all your hooks, I canít think of a situation were not having one will not improve the hook-up rate. I have proven this to myself, when lure fishing with rubber eels. An offset hook will out-fish a flat hook every time.

The only drawbacks are that they no longer sit flat in your rig wallets and you have a tendency to hook yourself more, but this is a small price to pay for boated fish.

The only reason I can think of, and I have given this a lot of thought over the years, why modern hooks have gone away from this is that you canít sell them safely in flat plastic packets. They used to come in small card boxes?

Give me your thoughts, Fishfingers
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#2 SpeciMan

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 05:10 PM

I agree storage could be the reason why we don't see many offset hooks being sold.

Only a slightly different note, I've been using Veal Semi Circle hooks and they do seem to encourage lip hooking whilst making hooking worm baits easier compared to circle hooks.
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#3 GB

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 08:35 PM

O.K here are my thoughts.

Without being rude m8 but have you thought about what you are saying before hitting the keys.

There are many hooks that come in boxes and packets that are offset.

Yes we used to put an offset in some hooks and sometimes still do, but if you want an offset hook try and find the correct hook for the situation. Put an offset in a hook that is not supposed to have one and you risk losing fish.

Straight hooks are made for certain bait presentation situations, offsets are made for other presentations.

You wrote "Put a serious offset in all your hooks, I canít think of a situation were not having one will not improve the hook-up rate. I have proven this to myself, when lure fishing with rubber eels. An offset hook will out-fish a flat hook every time."
On what basis can you make such a bold statement, what are your methods of proof, what are your findings and over how long a period is your study????

Sorry to sound so negative but such single mindedness on one subject is not good teaching to novice anglers.
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#4 fishfingers

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 09:35 PM

I had always wondered about circle hooks. I knew about their so-called Ďlip hookingí features and this is not in doubt. I assumed that their ubiquitous use on long lines was down to that trait alone. Then I actually met a commercial long line fisherman, who happened to be beach casting (bit of a busmanís holiday if you ask me) in SA he set me straight. My motto is Ďif you donít ask you donít get.í

Anyway, after listening for the first half hour about how the Asian fishing fleets are plundering their waters, he enlightened me on circle hooks. Apparently the ability to lip hook is useful in getting fish to market in better condition as they donít bleed so much when hooked (i.e. Not eaten by the sharks!), but the main reason they are used is that once hooked its very hard for a fish to throw a circle hook on a slack line, in fact almost impossible. Also the circle hook will catch both smallish and large fish with a large hook. This probably explains why they are so difficult to get hold of in small sizes.

As anglers we never have slack line on a hooked fish, as we all know how that ends.
The only possible use I can see for these hooks in UK waters would be for flatfish sessions, or possibly drifting for sharks. Both these fishing styles usually entail some slack line, though the slack in a shark bite isnít there for long!

Flatfish invariably sit still and eat you bait right down. I donítí know about you but I have lost count of the times I have reeled in to change bait and found a small flatfish attached. As I doubt I loose a lot of these flatties to hook shape, and you canít seem to get small circle hooks I can see no real benefit to circle hooks in UK sport fishing. I may be wrong, as I havenít tried them for myself.

Has anyone used true circle hooks? I would love to know if Iím right or wrong?



Talking of sharks I did read a topic on the forum yesterday about a guy who claims to have hooked a shark on 20lb mono, Ďaccidentallyí on a kayak, and then taken a very dodgy photo as evidence (convenient!). I would check it out if you havenít seen it. It made me chuckle.

I would suspect that he is one of those very strange people who practices his humour for his own gratification, nothing wrong with that, just strange. Some small probs with the hoax thou, you donít accidentally catch blue shark, no 20lb mono will stand up to the first run, and the Ďclincher', you wouldnít dare to hold your rod with one hand to take that picture on an aircraft carrier let alone a kayak.

Fishfingers.
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#5 SpeciMan

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 09:47 PM

Talking of sharks I did read a topic on the forum yesterday about a guy who claims to have hooked a shark on 20lb mono, Ďaccidentallyí on a kayak, and then taken a very dodgy photo as evidence (convenient!). I would check it out if you havenít seen it. It made me chuckle.

I would suspect that he is one of those very strange people who practices his humour for his own gratification, nothing wrong with that, just strange. Some small probs with the hoax thou, you donít accidentally catch blue shark, no 20lb mono will stand up to the first run, and the Ďclincher', you wouldnít dare to hold your rod with one hand to take that picture on an aircraft carrier let alone a kayak.

Fishfingers.


I could write a longer reply to your recent thread but I suspect a troll is at work. :schmoll:
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#6 Simon Everett

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 09:55 PM

Fishfingers,
nice to know that yoyu are also making judgements on people you have never met.

Zzippy happens to be a friend of mine and his picture of the blue shark (which isn't what he said it was - he was asking if anyone had another explanation. We told him we reckoned it was a blue) I am quite happy to believe was one of those genuine fishing occurances.

You are totally wrong about not being able to catch a blue shark on 20lb mono - I suppose the 25lb tope that Martin Hurst boated on a bream rig was also a hoax. I measred and tagged that fish. He caught it on 12lb mono and a size 2 hook, on a spinning rod and light fixed spool reel - if you keep your eyes on Boat Fishing Monthly you will see the full story.

You are being a bit brash with your words and I would suggest you get to know the folks you openly condemn before continuing to do so.

I have no doubt that your thoughts are well meant, and your help is genuine. There is plenty of room for discussion on here. As for blues from a kayak - no problem. How about 250lb threshers then? Well, that is commonplace in other parts of the world. Sailfish on 12lb line - was being done in the 80s, no doubt when you were still getting your nappies changed.
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#7 Zzippy

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 10:08 PM

Has anyone used true circle hooks? I would love to know if Iím right or wrong?
Talking of sharks I did read a topic on the forum yesterday about a guy who claims to have hooked a shark on 20lb mono, Ďaccidentallyí on a kayak, and then taken a very dodgy photo as evidence (convenient!). I would check it out if you havenít seen it. It made me chuckle.

I would suspect that he is one of those very strange people who practices his humour for his own gratification, nothing wrong with that, just strange. Some small probs with the hoax thou, you donít accidentally catch blue shark, no 20lb mono will stand up to the first run, and the Ďclincher', you wouldnít dare to hold your rod with one hand to take that picture on an aircraft carrier let alone a kayak.

Fishfingers.


Are you for real!
Or just one of these P.E.T.A *****,that come on to Forums for a wind up?
Saying that.It looks like you have come from the Total Fishing forums.May I sugest you try Kayak fishing before bad mouthing other people on here

Edited by Zzippy, 28 July 2006 - 12:27 AM.



#8 Neil

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 10:17 PM

Flatfish invariably sit still and eat you bait right down. I donítí know about you but I have lost count of the times I have reeled in to change bait and found a small flatfish attached. As I doubt I loose a lot of these flatties to hook shape, and you canít seem to get small circle hooks I can see no real benefit to circle hooks in UK sport fishing. I may be wrong, as I havenít tried them for myself.

Fishfingers.



You may not loose the flatties you talk about here but I bet the hooks are so far down, they are sh*ting them. Varivas, semis and full circles will reduce the amount of damaging deep hook ups.



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#9 Simon Everett

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 10:21 PM

Zzippy - look up the page a bit - then stop telling porkies on your telephone!!!
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#10 fishfingers

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Posted 27 July 2006 - 11:24 PM

GB,

Take a trip to Penzance; Newly harbour has a sea wall on the southern side. The rocks at the base of this wall are infested with small Pollock around six inches. The water is crystal clear and with good polarizerís you can see exactly whatís going on.
Get a 2Ē eddystone eel, these came fitted with and Aberdeen about size 1. Jig the eel up and down count the number of fish strikes and the number of fish hooked. Try this for fifty strikes at the lure. I got 22 fish. Now take the hook and bend an offset into it and repeat. Hook ups to strikes 30.

Assuming these fish are basically the same and their parents, this is good enough for me.

I would suggest you criticise a little less, be a bit more open-minded, and enjoy the fact that most people, if your polite to them, will tell you what they really think. You may learn a lot more. As a Ďreal maní you can then quietly decide for yourself if you choose to follow advice or not.

I donít have a monopoly on the truth; if you feel you need to go prove me wrong, then reply with some sensible, reasoned argument for your case, not just a childish empty rebuke with the woolly term Ďbait presentationí as a foil. I think some people have read to many glossy fish mags.

As for sharks, itís foolhardy to fish for them with inadequate tackle. If sharks are likely to be present proper precautions should be taken. If its not a joke, then you need youíre a**es kicked. Its not something to be proud of and post on the internet. I donít care if you decide to kill yourselves on your kayaks but please have some respect for the poor shark.

Iíve seen that macho crap to rock music that some American anglers put out. If you have half a brain, ask yourself were the filming platform is. Invariably itís a thirty-foot powerboat not a kayak on the open ocean. Are they filming because they want to show how they fish to the interest of others, or because they have deep rooted personal inadequacy?

I thought this was a discussion forum, looks like itís a self-appreciation society. I doubt now if I will learn anything from this forum as it seem to be populated by the ĎTextingí generation that have never bothered to learn how to construct arguments and reply openly to alternative views.

I donít want to be part of your schoolboy cliques.

Unsubscribing, I think Iíll just go fishing you meet nicer people.
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