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Dumping North Sea fish 'immoral'


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#11 SandTiger

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 08:30 PM

Personally I would rather see no discard whatsoever followed by closed areas once an agreed target has been fished from that zone. Maybe that is why by-catch also has to be placed in baskets, so it can be logged - I don't know how else these scientist bodkins would be able to ascertain what is being taken and where otherwise?

The electronics on the commercial fishing fleet vary as they do on the charter fleet – It's all down to what you have available in your pocket. But on saying that some of the commercial fleet have some pretty funky gear but I doubt they would be able to define species by bouncing of the swim bladder just yet.

#12 barry luxton

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 08:43 PM

Personally I would rather see no discard whatsoever followed by closed areas once an agreed target has been fished from that zone. Maybe that is why by-catch also has to be placed in baskets, so it can be logged - I don't know how else these scientist bodkins would be able to ascertain what is being taken and where otherwise?

The electronics on the commercial fishing fleet vary as they do on the charter fleet – It's all down to what you have available in your pocket. But on saying that some of the commercial fleet have some pretty funky gear but I doubt they would be able to define species by bouncing of the swim bladder just yet.

Slightly off topic, one of the good programmes i watched was with the altaire when he showed how he fished for the mackerel etc. He had a screen that showed the trawl and the fish entering it, how many, how heavy and he had sold it before he had got it to the fish hold, amazing.

I like the idea of no discard whatsoever, and close areas when the target is reached. However it must be done to protect the stock and to ensure that it recovers and increases for all.

 Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.

 
New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.
 
Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.
 
Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.
 
new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.
 
Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because  they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are.. 


#13 Diabolos

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:00 PM

Starting with the basic premise that people need food then the key issues are:

  • Sustainability
  • Efficient use of anything caught
  • Minimising habitat destruction
  • Maintaining biodiversity
Recent estimates by the UN Food and Agriculture Organisation put the quantity of bycatch near 20 million metric tonnes, or 25% of all fish caught.

Maybe your anger would be more constructivly channeled towards the gorvernment who implement the discard system rather then a fisherman that is working within the law, why not contact your MP about the utter waste that the bycatch system results in as it clearly doesn't work?

Even before the 'on deck exposure time' there are a number of other factors that could render the fish as good a dead. See: http://www.fao.org/d...1e/y6981e06.htm


Hang on mate if you want to chip in with a catty comment aimed in my direction, then be brave and answer the question posed rather than presenting a pile of, frankly, horseradish.

If you really are keen to suck up to the commercials, then maybe you should dig a bit a see what really goes on re discards and the hidden truth re voluntary discards.
What would that be then?? Perhaps it's when a boat with days at see remaining who has say, filled up with 100 boxes of cod for arguments sake, phones ahead to the buyer/market and finds out there is a better price for haddock. Boom – 100 boxes of cod go over the side (what the world does see and know blah, blah), commercial scum-bucket fills up with haddock and moves ‘em on at better price. Most, if not all boats are at this game, and other shocking dodges that you would probably never believe. This is reality, not some non-sense ‘feel sorry for me, I work hard’ publicity exercise.

As for the other goody-goody, let seek sustainable solutions drivel... I have heard it suggetsed that government takes a very different approach for once, and moves to shut the greedy lying gits down, and burns their boats. Not that I would go that far... I'd probably let them get off the boats first. :rolleyes:
In Nomine Satanas

#14 SandTiger

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:04 PM

... I like the idea of no discard whatsoever, and close areas when the target is reached. However it must be done to protect the stock and to ensure that it recovers and increases for all.


Now imagine a situation where concernerned anglers team up with skippers like James West from the Fruitful Bough for the better good and visa versa. They say politics makes strange bedfellows but also what a powerful lobby it would also make?

#15 spasor

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:16 PM

Hang on mate if you want to chip in with a catty comment aimed in my direction, then be brave and answer the question posed rather than presenting a pile of, frankly, horseradish.

If you really are keen to suck up to the commercials, then maybe you should dig a bit a see what really goes on re discards and the hidden truth re voluntary discards.
What would that be then?? Perhaps it's when a boat with days at see remaining who has say, filled up with 100 boxes of cod for arguments sake, phones ahead to the buyer/market and finds out there is a better price for haddock. Boom – 100 boxes of cod go over the side (what the world does see and know blah, blah), commercial scum-bucket fills up with haddock and moves ‘em on at better price. Most, if not all boats are at this game, and other shocking dodges that you would probably never believe. This is reality, not some non-sense ‘feel sorry for me, I work hard’ publicity exercise.

As for the other goody-goody, let seek sustainable solutions drivel... I have heard it suggetsed that government takes a very different approach for once, and moves to shut the greedy lying gits down, and burns their boats. Not that I would go that far... I'd probably let them get off the boats first. :rolleyes:


That`s the problem. You`re too liberal!! I`m sure our submariners are in need of some target practise.
We don`t use J`s anymore!!

#16 barry luxton

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:20 PM

Now imagine a situation where concernerned anglers team up with skippers like James West from the Fruitful Bough for the better good and visa versa. They say politics makes strange bedfellows but also what a powerful lobby it would also make?

I would relish the day that would happen, however Mr Deas gave me cause for concern the other day when he said something regarding the bass stock decision along those lines, after it was announced, no further was heard from him, not very good on his part unfortunatly.

Just to touch on Diabolos post, i hate cheats, thieves, receivers and liars more than the next person, this is where i don't mind defra spending the money, well worth it.

 Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.

 
New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.
 
Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.
 
Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.
 
new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.
 
Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because  they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are.. 


#17 SandTiger

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:22 PM

Hang on mate if you want to chip in with a catty comment aimed in my direction, then be brave and answer the question posed rather than presenting a pile of, frankly, horseradish.

If you really are keen to suck up to the commercials, then maybe you should dig a bit a see what really goes on re discards and the hidden truth re voluntary discards.
What would that be then?? Perhaps it's when a boat with days at see remaining who has say, filled up with 100 boxes of cod for arguments sake, phones ahead to the buyer/market and finds out there is a better price for haddock. Boom – 100 boxes of cod go over the side (what the world does see and know blah, blah), commercial scum-bucket fills up with haddock and moves 'em on at better price. Most, if not all boats are at this game, and other shocking dodges that you would probably never believe. This is reality, not some non-sense 'feel sorry for me, I work hard' publicity exercise.

As for the other goody-goody, let seek sustainable solutions drivel... I have heard it suggetsed that government takes a very different approach for once, and moves to shut the greedy lying gits down, and burns their boats. Not that I would go that far... I'd probably let them get off the boats first. :rolleyes:


So that's your constructive solution is it? It has nothing to do with sucking up to commercials but more to do with an overall concern for our fish stocks which is clearly over your head since you are just burying it in the ground ;)

#18 SandTiger

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:29 PM

Please explain to me why this grumbling sea rapist had to wait until all those 'live' fish were dead before he threw them back!!!!! There was no need. Making a point is one thing, but inventing a point is something else entirely.


As already posted and in answer to your question...

However, with figures showing by-catch at 20 million metric tonnes then I really do not have a problem with using 20 odd baskets of fish to drive home a very valid point. The whole point of the article is to show the needless waste that a by-catch system imposess with regard to food fisheries. To sling them all back and say that they will all be fine would be entirely disengenious in my view as I think that when fish have been through a trawl common sense dictates they would be pretty much knackered.

Also see a few other postings about net capture truma and mortality when discussing 'live' fish.

Hope that helps :)

#19 Ken L

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:29 PM

Another vote for zero allowable disgards, enforced with on board video and electronic (trawl operation etc) monitoring and a real time satalite uplink.
If you have a rapist in your comunity, you expect them to be tagged and monitored by the police.
We have rapists of our seas.

Species caught in 2017: Siamese carp. Striped catfish. Rohu. Mekong catfish. Amazon red tail catfish. Arapaima.  Black Minnow Shark. Perch. Chub. Brown Trout. Pike. Bream. Roach. Rudd. Bleak. Common Carp.

Species caught in 2016: Siamese carp. Jullen's golden carp. Striped catfish. Mekong catfish. Amazon red tail catfish. Arapaima. Alligator gar. Rohu. Black Minnow Shark. Roach, Bream, Perch, Ballan Wrasse. Rudd. Common Carp. Pike. Zander. Chub. Bleak.
Species caught in 2015: Brown Trout. Roach. Bream. Terrapin. Eel. Barbel. Pike. Chub. 
Species caught in 2014: Striped catfish. Pacu. Giant gourami. Clown knife fish. Rohu. Siamese carp. Amazon red tail catfish. Arapaima. Roach. Bream. Perch. Rainbow trout. Chub. Common Carp, Ide. Brown Trout. Barbel. Mekong catfish. Jullen's golden carp. Alligator gar. Java barb.
Species caught in 2013: Mangrove Jack. Barramundi. Blubberlip snapper. Baracouda. Malabar grouper. Yellowfin Trevally. Chub. Brown Trout. Perch. Roach. Pike. European Eel. Bleak.
Species caught in 2012: Northern whiting. Moray eel. Barramundi. Snakehead murrel. Silver razorbelly minnow. Deccan Mahseer. Malabar mystus. Deccan rita. Spotted Malabar Grouper. Mangrove Jack. Indian sea catfish. Brown Trout. Chub. Perch. Roach. Rudd.
Species caught in 2011: Indian sea catfish. Sardine. Barramundi. Mangrove Jack. Deccan Mahseer. Humpbacked Mahseer. Yellow Fin Trevelly. Giant Trevelly. Chub. Brown Trout. Perch. Pike. Atlantic salmon. Dace. Minnow. Roach. Gudgeon. 
Species caught in 2010: Barramundi. Giant Trevelly. Moray eel. Indian sea catfish. Mangrove Jack. Deccan Mahseer. Humpback Mahseer. Chub. Brown Trout. Perch. Bass. Pike. 
Species caught in 2009: Chub. Perch. Pike. Pacu. Thai Striped Catfish. 
Species caught in 2008: Barramundi. p-i-k-e-y sea bream. Indian sea catfish. Guitarfish. Mangrove Jack. Mahseer. Squid (Not strictly a fish but it took a lure !). Emperor Sweetlip. Black Spot Snapper. Moray eel. Spangled Emperor. Bluecheek silver grunt. Yellow striped emperor. Vanikoro sweeper. Pike. Perch. Brown trout. Chub. Atlantic salmon.


#20 SandTiger

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Posted 20 November 2007 - 09:35 PM

Just to touch on Diabolos post, i hate cheats, thieves, receivers and liars more than the next person, this is where i don't mind defra spending the money, well worth it.


Couldn't agree more Barry, this government is the worst yet :clap: