Steelhead Trout

[Nightwing]

corydoras:

corydoras:

To put it mildly, there are pond reared rainbow trout which have been somewhere along the line been genetically 'created' using the 'steelhead' gene, just like the 'tiger' trout and other variants...personally I think it was used to hoodwink the angler into thinking the fish were 'Steelheads', they might have the genes present in steelheads but these fish were not sea run..I am not knowledgable about this breeding lark but even I know steelheads are sea run fish and how can they call fish taken from a stewpond somewhere and call them by that name ?

Sorry friend but this is basically just plain wrong.

 

There are NO steelheads in Scotland IMNSHO.

 

Let me explain why. A Steelhead is a diadromous Rainbow Trout i.e. a Rainbow Trout (Oncorhynchus mykiss) that migrates between saltwater and freshwater.

 

Genetically your common or garden Rainbow is no different to a Steelhead. There is no gene that makes a rainbow a steelhead so you cannot transplant a steelhead gene into a rainbow, just as you can't take a gene from a Chihuahua and transplant it into a German Shepard.

 

To have steelheads in Scotland you would need the right conditions; large lakes connected to the sea by a fairly large river system.

 

The largest loch in Scotland is Loch Lomond. connected to the sea by the River Leven and the River Clyde. This is just not 'big' enough for steelheads, they really need BIG freswater lakes like the Great Lakes.

 

That at least is my understanding, others may disagree with me (as I disagreed with you).

 

Have a good weekend all, and tight lines in the new season!

Nailed it, Mate.

The lack of a "steelhead gene" is 100 percent correct.

If any fishery is making this claim, they should be taken to task. About the only thing I would disagree with is the idea that steelhead require a large lake connected to the sea.

Sufficiently large lakes(and I do mean large, as in inland seas like the Great Lakes), can support an independent(of the ocean) population of steelhead. Also, populations originating from the sea can and do exist whithout the benefit of a large lake along the river route they spawn in. So, if a population of rainbows were to become established in a coastal area of your country and managed to breed in local rivers, they would by definition eventualy "become" steelhead.

They would not, however, be steelhead because of some genetic manipulation, but instead, only because of their access to the sea.

 

[ 14. June 2003, 01:34 AM: Message edited by: Nightwing ]

[Elton]

Funny how the most innocent of threads often turn in to the most interesting.

[Steelheader69]

You guys hit it on the head. I live in Steelhead country. In fact, I live where the Great Lakes got all their original stock (They recieved Skamania stock from Washington state that started their runs). A true Steelhead is simply a searun rainbow trout. And NO, they don't need a lake at all to spawn. In fact, the majority of steelhead spawn in rivers that DON'T feed into lakes. Most spawn in rivers. But some to go into lakes, but rarely.

 

Actually, there has always been a question though. I should dig down and actually do a search. But thought the Great Lakes were freshwater. So technically, they would be large rainbows (though they came from Skamania Steelhead stock). Like Lake Illiama in Alaska, they support HUGE fish, but they are Rainbow trout, since they don't migrate to the sea, they migrate down into the rivers to spawn, then go back into the lake. One of these days I need to check that out. I fished those rivers on the GL, and looks like an ocean to me (the lakes that is). But never asked about water content. Oh well, one of these days.

 

[ 14. June 2003, 08:58 AM: Message edited by: Steelheader69 ]

[Nightwing]

The Great Lakes are indeed fresh water.

The controversy as to if they are really steelhead has raged for years, with most west coast steelheaders saying they are "just" rainbows, but with fisheries people(even those from the west coast) , and fisherman from about everywhere else considering them steelhead.

They LOOK and act exactly like their western cousins, in that they develope the size, the power, and the chrome coloration of "true" steelhead. I think the fisheries people allow the "loophole" for the great lakes fish due to the origin of the strain(Oregon and N. Cal fish, well over 100 years ago at least for Michigan) and more importantly, that the lifestyle they lead(living in the open waters of the lakes, migrating up the rivers to spawn), is the same as a searun steelhead.

 

Also, your account of the origin of steelhead/rainbows in the lakes is not really correct.

Relatively few of the steelhead in the Lakes originated from the Skamania hatchery. Steelhead were first established in Michigan almost 130 years ago(originating from a variety of sources, the McCloud river being important), and have developed a unique strain here. Most of the Michigan rivers support a unique long established wild strain (similar to the coastal situation where each river has its own strain), the Skamania are planted primarily in a handfull of rivers, mostly in the southern lakes(St. Joseph, and Trail Creek in IN. being the primary locations). Skamiania(as you know) are a "developed" strain, as opposed to a wild strain, and have only been in the lakes for a decade or so, and while they have done well in a few locations, they represent less than 4% of the fish found here. Steelhead in other states mostly came from Michigan(the Little Manistee strain proving to be the most adaptable to other areas of the lakes), as well as a few using Umpqa and Skamania summer run strains.

Truth is, however, it really doesn't matter, as like has been pointed out, rainbows and steelhead are exactly the same fish, with the same characteristics, steelhead being just a local name for "big, silvery, rainbow trout".

Interesting thread to find on a U.K. list, for sure!!

*oh, gotta say I love your sig, catacrafts rule!*

 

[ 14. June 2003, 05:51 PM: Message edited by: Nightwing ]

[Steelheader69]

I've only fished the GL's a handful of times, and everyone I talked to said they were from Skamania strains, and from what I've heard and read in books here (some books over 50 years old) that Skamania's have been sent that way for years. Maybe they stopped planting them in #'s and went with more a local stock of fish to keep stocks somewhat "Native".

 

It's funny about what a "Steelhead" is. I've always been taught, even in school (since the Steelhead is our state fish) that they are anadromadous fish. Which is a sea run fish. In Alaska, they have both situations (fish that spawn like "Steelhead" in the PNW, and "Steelhead" in the GL's). All the fish that come from the Ocean to spawn in rivers are called Steelhead, and all the fish that come from Lakes to spawn in rivers are called Rainbow Trout. And their "Rainbows" from the lake reach Steelhead size (up and over 20#'s). They even change colors as well.

 

I was curious which Western Biologists called them Steelhead? I know quite a few here, and most distinguish the fish by where their natal waters are they come from. They never commented on the GL fish, but have commented on the Lake Illiama fish which are considered rainbows.

 

Must be the size of the water, Lake Illiama is huge, but nowhere near the size of the GL's.

[Steelheader69]

Oh, forgot to add about the signature. Yeah, been running them along time. Actually, I've been running them probably longer then about 95% of the fishing community. Mostly because I have been running them since they're experimental days for whitewatering back in the mid 80's. Didn't become fishing boats until very late 80's/early90's. Always have a fondness for them (especially running whitewater). Only way to fish, especially for flyfishing. On gear fishing, sometimes better to run an actual driftboat for running plugs.