OCTOBER PHOTO COMPETITION

[Steve Randles]

Good grief...you dont get it do you? To be hionest Cliff your still overcomplicating things.

 

STOP

 

Think for a minute, I'm actually trying to help people get more from their camera. I have at no stage or anytime said, stated or written...inferred, taught or pressured anyone to use manual Super overcomplicated Photoholic mode or some such...I'm attempting to teach basics...Thats BASICs...<<< BASICS ONLY >>>..ahem...somewhere to start, the first footstep only. I've actually run courses ( It was run in Private via another forum, but you can grasp a few of the thankful comments here http://www.photography-cafe.com/forum/index.php?topic=4169.0 ) online for this on a website before today so my teaching method is sound, works, and has given many students the knowledge to take their Photography to where they want it to be, wherever that maybe.

 

I could rattle on quite easily that the basic settings I gave in a previous posting here where just a basic starting point from where I would teach how to slow down the shutter when required or how to use ISO to gain the aperture you need for a particular shot...but isn't that quite specialised for here and isn't this paragraph then scaring and intimidating new people to cameras such as Janet? (Please excuse me Janet). Would it not be better Cliff to give information piecemeal and simplistically so that the person using the information is not overwhelmed with technicalities?

 

Still in your posts you have not provided links to where its stated (according to you) that manual mode is the only way to go, I have never seen it...and I doubt I ever will. But I will wait for you to post the links.

 

My reasoning for mentioning its best to start with manual mode is one of learning the light Cliff and how ones camera uses it to expose the shot. I use manual mode..shutter and aperture priority, sports mode even auto...all of these have a place within my photography and I use them when the situation warrants them. But its the information I gleaned from learning about light in manual mode that gave me the experience to know when to use which mode. Why barrage someone new to Photography with all this new info and scare the pants of them when I can just say set to 100 ISO, F8, spin the shutter speed, bungo..take the shot...leaving that new person to Photography happy they have learned and achieved something, and thirsting for more?

 

Lets face it Cliff, you would not give a newcomer to angling 2 x 12ft carp rods with baitrunners and tell them to set up a bolt rig on one and a paternoster with a weak link on the other and expect them to be able to do it....or would you?

 

 

I take exception to being called a Photoholic, I'm a knowledgable amateur at best and love my hobby and beieve there is no room for name calling in such a sedentary thing.

 

Anyway, I ask you to leave it here now...because all thats happening is extra confusion to newcomers which is not a good thing. In the new year I will once again be running my short "Manual Photography course" elsewhere on the web and all who want to learn the very basics of Photography, before deciding what path they take are welcome to take the course.

 

The course is 100% FREE and all you will need is a camera capable of shooting in manual mode, a notepad and pen and an open mind.

 

Steve...

[poledark]

Steve, you say "if its sunny set iso to 100, and if cloudy set to 200" surely that is what a good auto camera does for you? That is just what Nikon etc spend millions on perfecting for us. I am not knocking your use of a camera, but have an awful lot of sympathy with Janets point of view, as most of my pics are "spur of the moment" shots.

 

The other point that seems very relevant to me, is that even after you have set your camera up into manual, you probably end up with what the auto would have selected anyway. Unless there is something amiss with the design/programming of your (a general your) camera.

 

Re the idea of trying to sell a fully manual camera to the general public, that is a definite no no. Taking photos is now so easy and foolproof that anyone (everyone) can take excellent pictures, and get a result that reflects what they saw thro' the viewfinder. Even the phone makers have cottoned on to this....how many of them offer a manual option? With modern software things can only get better

 

How many of us actually carry a tripod/filters etc? Ok if you set out to get a picture, as you would take your rods fishing. I often take my Nikon and TC lens, my 'scope and tripod and HD video camera to plug on to the scope. This is when I am expecting/hoping to get a special shot. Often a portable hide goes with me as well. And when (if) I get that shot then I probably post process it as well.

 

Here is the rub of it all though, the photo comp was simply a lighthearted offshoot of the photo of the day, which itself was an offshoot of the themed topics. I loved the idea of trying to capture and portray a particular subject/time of year/ mood etc. Surely the most creative use of a camera? I needed that to inspire me to "see" things (not always as others saw them ) but now, even though I still take a lot of pics, I rarely even look at the photo comp. Oddly though, I look forward to the new images in the Belgium digital forum each week

 

Den

[Steve Randles]

Steve, you say "if its sunny set iso to 100, and if cloudy set to 200" surely that is what a good auto camera does for you?

 

Yes it is Den...the whole ethos behind my stating that is not as something you must do..but somewhere to start using another mode on your camera...that you have paid for. In my course I move on from there to show how changing the three basic settings can change the outcome of the photo..here's a couple of examples.

 

 

 

Quite simply, auto mode could never do this...end of discussion. But in manual mode you would learn how to acieve results as above by changing the settings, from blurring the waters movement to stopping it dead in its tracks. Once you have learned to manipulate the available light, you could then when faced with capturing either of the scenes above choose how you wanted to do it, thats either full auto to just capture the scene for a memory, full manual for ultimate control or somewhere in between such as shutter priority mode..or even sport mode. So its just learning the cameras abilities, and how you want to use them is all.

 

Steve...

[Janet]

Well, what can I say guys? Thanks for all the advice on the photo thread - I didn't get to bed until after three this morning, reading various on-line tutorials! All your fault....

 

Thankfully, I think it's all beginning to sink in, so my challenge today is to get out and about in manual mode....wish me luck! I've very much relied on the auto and scene modes up until now, and very good they are, but I do think I'll get much more from my photography if I learn how to control the camera instead of the camera controlling me!

 

I'm not going anwhere special, so it won't be a problem if I stuff it up. I'm only going along to my local woods and fishing lake, so I can always go back and do a reshoot if necessary. It will be something of a challenge, with the low light in the woods, but I'll give it my best shot!

 

The pictures of the lock were very apt Steve, as we spend a lot of time on narrowboats on the canal. We have a week booked just before Christmas, and then next year we have a whole month to cruise down to London and onto the Thames. I really want to have improved my photography by then, as I'd rather bring home something other than shapshots.

 

Thanks again guys!

 

Janet

[Sutton Warrior]

Tried to keep a 'measure' of light heartedness in this, seems its got a bit serious. No I dont 'see it' Steve, you and a lot of others are 'photoholics' intend as a light hearted description of a 'knowledgeable enthusiast', I put a line under all this at post #40?

 

Its obvious I'm not as serious a photographer as others? . . . I wont be giving any further help to 'any one', my experience in dealing with problems within the 'wider photographic envelope' is obviously considered of little value. I will just be a pain and keep posting my 'snapshots', on AN? . . . that remains to be seen?

 

Please enjoy your photography all . . . SW

[Janet]

Just to add, I'll also be shooting on auto, and then I can compare the settings and results I get with what the camera would have selected under the same conditions.

 

I'm not going to over-complicate things, so I'm only going to be using my 35mm lens.

 

Does that make sense?

 

I'll post the results when I get back!

 

Janet

[Steve Randles]

Cliff, No need to take umbridge just because others have a view that does not reflect yours. What you do works for you and your happy with it..fair play..I dont have an issue with that, and never will.

 

What I do take issue with is people fogging the issue of utilising a camera a different way, when its not complicated to do at all. I just recommend that those with manual settings on their camera should learn to use them, then when an understanding of light has been obtained, then to choose (as you have) how to shoot or how to use your camera.

 

I do everything with Photography as simple as possible, I dont view histyograms or check settings after each shot..I just lift, point and shoot..simples.

 

Steve...

[poledark]

LOL Steve, you know what I like....and don't like :) Custard

 

But, I have to agree with you, there is one of the classic cases for manual. Auto will consider poor light/slow shutter, and give you custard. Manual will enable you to speed up the shutter and give you water/spray. Or, if you like custard you can slow it all down.

 

Den

[Steve Randles]

Manual Mode Photography course will eventually be started at http://focal-pla.net, but as soon as I have made a post at that place about the course...I will also announce it here to so people here have the chance to take part.

 

Regards

 

Steve...

[Janet]

Well, I hesitate to say this, but I think I'm getting there!

 

 

....and this is only the first one I've looked at.

 

The same shot in auto was far too dark, but this has captured the colours beautifully! It was a very, very bright day and the colours have turned out just as they were.

 

I'm off to look at the rest of them now!

 

Janet

Edited November 16, 2009 by Janet