Countryside Alliance Angling Forum

[trent.barbeler]

Dear Peter,

 

But? Such a small word.

 

"But foxes are not bred as a food."

 

Oscar Wildes quote of "The unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible" makes a valid point on the culinary properties a fox might bestow upon your average housewife. But; Theres that word again, lets take a closer look at the humble pheasant for a moment.

 

Pheasants are by and large, reared for the gun as a sporting commodity in the first instance. Their culinary properties might well have been highly placed once upon a time, but now a days, their "game meat" attributes are shunned by your average housewife who is now dependant on supermarket fare. Lets look further.

 

The Belvoir Country Estate which I live within, boasts some of the very best pheasant shooting not only in the UK, but the whole world over. This fact is reafirmed by the numbers of guns that fly in from all over the world to enjoy the estates famous and renouned "high birds" that fly out of covert over the deeply situated valleys below. For this privlege, foreign as well as home grown guns pay upwards of £3000 per day, yes "DAY" to line up on the famous shooting stands amid truly wonderful surroundings.

 

Generously, their fee for a days shooting includes a single brace of shot pheasants. In almost every case, these braces of shot pheasant are NOT claimed by the members of the days shooting parties because frankly, they are not interested in pheasants in a culinary sense. Their money goes towards the sport that these birds provide.

 

Unlike years ago when pheasants might fetch upwards to £6 per brace, they are pretty much useless now in financial terms once they have been shot. Braces of pheasants can be picked up now for as little as a £1 per brace locally. Their fall from grace has arisen mostly because of the sheer numbers of pheasants being reared now a days. Shooting is very much big business out in the sticks where upon thousands and thousands of birds are now being reared. But it should be fully understood, that these birds are being reared for their sporting attributes. Their "food" capacity is merely nothing more than that they are edible and perhaps sought after by a few game meat devotees. I can see the day coming when so few people want to eat game birds that they will simply be thrown away once shot on these big shoots.

 

But; That word again, whilst pheasant meat might fall from grace, its sporting attributes will soar up and up as wealthy people seek out the finest shooting available.

 

Pheasants, partridges, grouse, ducks etc etc, ARE reared or encouraged to breed within certain areas for SPORTING purposes. This is the SOLE reason for the shooting community undertaking this activity. Food, or these sporting birds culinary attributes have nothing to do with the reason for them being artificially reared in such massive numbers.

 

As far as I am concerned, the ONLY viable argument against foxhunting as a "practising" sport, is via the cruelty aspect. No other argument in favour of baning foxhunting holds water. It is also fair and reasonable to bring into this argument old practices now outlawed such as dog fighting, cock fighting, badger baiting, even bear baiting if we choose to go back far enough. BUT; Aside from bear baiting, the other three practices still continue albeit "below ground". So it "could" be argued, that whilst the three practices have been outlawed, the actual cruelty still continues.

 

Moving on. Say the scenario continues and society pushes forward in its evolement, and foxhunting gets outlawed. A victory seemingly for an evolving society against all forms of cruelty.

 

But; That damned word again, how far is our society going to "evolve" before it turns its attention towards other sporting practices fighting battles beneath the banner of cruelty. Or Lord knows where as the baning culture directs proceedings from its many media outlets.

 

Living where I do, I have been presented with ample opportunity to speak quite a lot to the anti-hunting fraternity as they break for lunch in the pubs within my area when turning up to protest at hunt meetings. Contrary to the CA propaganda, these people are not rent a mob or punk rocker types seeking to change the world. They come from all walks of life that share a common denominator. They are totally against cruelty to animals. Having spoken to hundreds of these protesters over the years hearing their opinions, I can confidently say that they are as opposed to shooting and fishing as much as they are foxhunting. Within a certain element of todays modern evolving society, theirs is a staunch attitude that is a reality we will all have to face sooner or later.

 

Where exactly, are we going to make our stand if we want to protect our varied ways of life. Our sports, passtimes and passions? Where exactly, is the cruelty line going to be drawn between sporting human interest and the interests of the baning culture? My genuine concern is that this line is getting worn away in favour of a cruelty argument that can be applied to almost everything we do.

 

I do wonder though what many parts of human kind would make of todays modern evolving society in other parts of the world. What would say the starving millions on the African plains make of this foxhunting debate? Kind of puts things in persective really.

 

Food for thought perhaps? But, then again.......

 

Regards,

 

Lee.

[Danny H]

Interesting post T.B

 

On a lighter note

 

I wish the C.A would take down their ### signs, everytime I leave my town for a bit of sightseeing, the country is spoilt by all those signs stuck to trees, ### Litter bugs!!!

 

They've turned the ###Country into the Cromwell road

 

Hurrumph, Hurrumph.

 

Grumble over, back on topic at the double , attention!!

 

[ 22. February 2003, 11:10 PM: Message edited by: Danny H ]

[Peter Waller]

Lee, pheasents are greatly underated, great eating! Skin them, rather than pluck them, easy! I reckon my birds cost me about £35.00 each so we WILL enjoy them!! Actually we do both thoroughly enjoy them.

[H Jampton]

quote:

---

Originally posted by trent.barbeler:

[QB

Unlike years ago when pheasants might fetch upwards to £6 per brace, they are pretty much useless now in financial terms once they have been shot. Braces of pheasants can be picked up now for as little as a £1 per brace locally. [/QB]

---

50 years ago it used to be said: "Up goes a pound, bang goes half-a-crown, down comes ten bob"

Now its: "Up goes £25.00, bang goes 10p, down comes 25p."

You will still find pheasants in London for £6.00 a brace while the shoots are offered 50p a brace. The difference is all the red tape and regulations in between that has been introduced recently, putting people off wanting to deal in them.

In their natural wild state in North America, fox numbers are controlled by coyotes that hunt in packs.

In this country, in areas where no hunting takes place, they die with mange, gangrene or fly-strike.

[phil hackett]

In Gt. Manchester the majority die through neither of these ".......where no hunting takes place, they die with mange, gangrene or fly-strike." They are weakend by lead poisoning according to the work carried out by Paul Chipman at MMU, finishing up as road kill. Paul tells me the reason for it is the accumulation of historic lead in the soil from pre unleaded petrol. The lead having built up in the soil over time and worked its way up the food chain. The worst affected foxes that he has examined have had many earth worms, moles in their stomach when autopsied.

[Peter Waller]

phil hackett:

In Gt. Manchester the majority die through neither of these ".......where no hunting takes place, they die with mange, gangrene or fly-strike." They are weakend by lead poisoning according to the work carried out by Paul Chipman at MMU, finishing up as road kill. Paul tells me the reason for it is the accumulation of  historic lead in the soil from pre unleaded petrol. The lead having built up in the soil over time and worked its way up the food chain. The worst affected foxes that he has examined have had many earth worms, moles in their stomach when autopsied.    

Interesting point Phil. It would seem an obvious point re lead and swan deaths, albeit swans don't eat moles!

[Peter Waller]

Interestingly the CA Gone Angling site seems to have ground to a halt . Have you visited it lately?

[trent.barbeler]

Dear Phil,

 

Interesting note on Foxes and lead association. It is generally known amid country folk who shoot, that foxes "can't carry lead". An awful descriptive, "can't carry lead", but one that implies that wounded foxes (from shotgun pellets)if clipped by one or two pellets die none the less.

 

I haven't shot for many years now and I know that lead replacement shot is now widely used in some cartridges in some circumstances. Is it that lead replacement must be used when shooting near or over water?

 

I was already aware of lead pollutants in soil but was unaware of its full effects on wildlife. Interesting stuff. Well, if your not a fox that is. Tell me Phil, are Badgers effected in a similar way?

 

Regards,

 

Lee.

 

PS.

 

Dear Peter,

 

I skin pheasants myself ready for the oven, although my shooting friends assure me I am a heathen for doing so. Apparently, they taste so much better hung for a few days and cooked in their yellowy skins! Urrgh!

 

I like my "game" fresh, so I suppose it's not game meat in a traditional sense. I skin partridges in the same way. Fresh as a daisy then into the oven. Jo my wife, bastes them in honey and brandy. Luberly juberly. Served with home grown veggies and washed down with some of Jo's home made wine.

 

Thats the great thing about living in the sticks, everything food wise is cheap and on tap. Shame about the mud on the roads though but I wont go there. Might get old Sharpy going with that one.

[phil hackett]

Originally posted by trent.barbeler:

[QB] Dear Phil,

 

....lead replacement shot is now widely used in some cartridges in some circumstances. Is it that lead replacement must be used when shooting near or over water? Yes as understand it Lee

 

I was already aware of lead pollutants in soil but was unaware of its full effects on wildlife. Interesting stuff. Well, if your not a fox that is. Tell me Phil, are Badgers effected in a similar way?"

 

Paul's work has been carried out on Foxes only and I don't know of any work done on Badgers in this regard. I'll ask Paul if he knows of any.

My own opinion, base on no scientific evidence at this point, is that it’s most likely, unless there are some physiological metabolic reasons for it not to be so.

[Nugg]

If lead is coming up through the food chain, never mind the fox's and badgers, what about the human population, is anyone suffering from lead poisoning?

Another thing I would like to know is who is breeding all these wasps and rats and the like, why can't they be hunted into oblivion? Im sure even the antis would go for that.