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Vagabond

Just so all you hooligans know......

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I would applaud anyone who wants to improve our British society and am happy to welcome ideas for discussion.

 

However I think rather than members of Parliament suggesting this or that they should get their own house in order before they open their mouths.

 

Perhaps they should all regardless of which political party they are, get working together for the benefit of the country and British society as a whole and that includes the bankers and business leaders that are having such a widespread effect on society far, far wider than a few criminals going on the rampage.

 

Lead by example e.g. stop being so soft with members of parliament and Government and local government employees, who have been less than upstanding, honest and law abiding, simple kick them out of Parliament and or Government or their jobs, then if they can be proven to have committed a crime stick them in prison and seize all their assets. For they are doing far more damage than any and all the drug dealers and criminals do as they are the representative face of the country as a whole.

 

One people one law.

 

I look upon misuse of public money as just that, although I also believe it is far worse when persons who claim to be educated and to represent the people and the country and are already in receipt of very considerable salaries and have exceptionally good pensions to look forward to, steal or fraudulently claim money or misuse money or their authority they are not entitled to or in ways they are not entitled to.

Edited by watatoad

From a spark a fire will flare up

English by birth, Cockney by the Grace of God

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All,

 

I have a novel idea. Since entitlements are so politically hot right now. Why not tell the hooligans they are entitled to apply for entry level jobs? How about this - - create entry level jobs equal to welfare income? Probably wouldn't work. I don't see why it has to be such a convoluted complex fix.

 

There's not a child alive I would not take fishing - once. More if aptitude warranted. I'm not giving them my (collective) river, they don't know how to use it.

 

Phone

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All,

 

I have a novel idea. Since entitlements are so politically hot right now. Why not tell the hooligans they are entitled to apply for entry level jobs? How about this - - create entry level jobs equal to welfare income? Probably wouldn't work. I don't see why it has to be such a convoluted complex fix.

 

There's not a child alive I would not take fishing - once. More if aptitude warranted. I'm not giving them my (collective) river, they don't know how to use it.

 

Phone

Whaaaat? Get a job when they can smoke pot and live with their parents...

You're right Phone, it WON'T work, well, not for the majority.

 

Yes, they may not know how to use your river, but the sort of 'yoofs' we're talking about, have already demonstrated they know how to 'abuse' it.

ANY other child or youngster should go fishing at least once in their life, just not if they have a 'record', criminal or otherwise.

 

Renrag


This Years' Targets:- As many species by lure as possible. Preferably via Kayak. 15lb+ Pike on Lure...

Species Caught 2012- Pike, Perch.

Kayak Launches- Fresh-8 Salt- 0

Kayak Captures- 14 Pike, 1 Perch.

 

My Website and Blog Fishing Blog, Fishkeeping Information and BF3 Guide.

Foxy Lodge Wildlife Rescue

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Yes most of us were stupid bored kids in the past but we never needed to do stupid things like riot, loot and burn shops, so why is it different today???

 

Yes we did have gang fights in the days of the Mods and Rockers but we only fought each other; and we did used to let the odd tyre down and do other silly things but we never did things like riot, loot and burn shops and other buildings for fun.

 

Anyway it was reported that most of these thugs who looted and rioted already had prior criminal records, or is this totally wrong?

 

Perhaps it's something simple like most of them coming from one parent families where they dont have a father figure to keep them in check and teach them right from wrong, or maybe it's because the ones who do come from a normal family have fathers which are just as bad as themselves.

 

But whatever it is I don't think that trying to put a rod in their hands will do them or us any favours

And the people it would help are not likely to be the main troublemakers with a criminal record; it would more likely be just the odd misguided kid who happened to get led astray.

 

But hey, I would give anyone just one chance to prove me wrong as long as they are supervised properly by people who know about angling and the environment and not by a couple of officers who where unlucky enough to be put on supervising duty but know very little about angling, which seems very likely.

Edited by BoldBear

Happiness is Fish shaped (it used to be woman shaped but the wife is getting on a bit now)

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Vagabond is quite right, the forces don't want them. These are organisations of motivated professional men and women who joined up of their own volition, and the idea that the forces are an ideal dumping ground for society's dregs demeans them. Many things have changed in Dave's lifetime, but I'll bet human nature isn't one of them. You can lead a horse to water, and this lot have been led all their lives. Why should the forces be charged with rehabilitating them? The option is open to any of them who really want to change and choose to change, the rest of them are beyond anyone's help but their own.

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Yes most of us were stupid bored kids in the past but we never needed to do stupid things like riot, loot and burn shops, so why is it different today???

 

I think it's bacause the majority of the rioters are from a different culture and have different set of morals...invasive species.

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You are drawing on your experiences from the National Service era

That's what I said.

 

things have changed

Indeed they have,the Services these days are comprised of professionals who have chosen that career.

 

Most of my fellow-conscripts made the best of their compulsory National Service.

 

However, there was always the disruptive few who regarded themselves as "hard men" - (although they were only just turned 18 !), and made life difficult for themselves and those around them. The services could do without disaffected conscripts then, and they certainly don't want them now.

 

 

thankfully we have moved on from the Teddy Boy era

In what way have "we" moved on? Does the use of "we" mean you are a former "Teddy Boy"?

 

The rioters have certainly "moved on" from that era, they now carry petrol bombs instead of knuckledusters, and co-ordinate their looting and arson by means of mobile phones. Many have doubtless learnt other skills during their time in prison.

 

We don't need them in angling, the services don't want them, so what do you, teme-man, putting on your judgemental hat (and I know you have one), think should be done with these hooligans ?


 

 

RNLI Governor

 

World species 471 : UK species 105 : English species 95 .

Certhia's world species - 215

Eclectic "husband and wife combined" world species 501

 

"Nothing matters very much, few things matter at all" - Plato

...only things like fresh bait and cold beer...

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Yep, put them in the army, give them a weapon and teach them how to kill people PROPERLY ;)

 

Of course, he regularly smoke hashish and we all know how that is liable to turn you into a depraved killer :rolleyes:


Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be.

 

 

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity

 

 

 

http://www.safetypublishing.co.uk/
http://www.safetypublishing.ie/

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believe me the services to-day could give the majority of miscreants a lesson in becoming a good citizen.
Well, maybe they could, but do they want to? The services have much more important things to do at a time when resources are short. You said yourself that disaffected conscripts "tainted" the experiences of those around them. Is conscripting these hooligans one of the "ten steps backward" you want to take?

 

 

So what would I do ? Well for a start I would like the more cynical of society and especially it's elders like you perhaps to show a modicum of understanding of the real issues in Britain especially with the real lack of employment for the young.

It is a trifle amusing that the first thing you would do is to wish for me to do something :lol:

 

What I have done, as I said upon starting this thread, is to make efforts to prevent the hooligans from being foisted upon the angling world. (No reply yet from Westminster). That is what I was and still am primarily concerned with.

 

Someone else suggested putting these miscreants in the services - an idea I thought was unwise and impractical for reasons already discussed, and an idea I am amazed that, you. as a former serviceman, seem to support.

 

I would generate jobs

 

If you know how to do that, write a letter to Mr Cameron (copy to the Daily Telegraph) setting out in detail how to go about it!

 

While having every sympathy with someone who cannot find a job, I can only directly influence my immediate family. During much of our working lives my wife and I each held two jobs (and paid a lot of tax in consequence), and are still directors of our family business.

All six children are in employment

Of the ten grandchildren

Two are in employment after university - both having elected to move to where jobs are.

Two are in employment having chosen/been advised by family not to go to university

One is still at university, the other five still at school.

 

Lucky ? I don't think so, much thought and hard work by all concerned underlies that situation.

 

there will be more civil dis-order in the future.

Very likely - but before you call for "more jobs" as a panacea, consider how many of those convicted already had a job and also how many already had a criminal record. There have been job shortages in the past, and protest meetings, but not the degree of criminal activity that characterised this recent outbreak.

 

sending ALL our kid's to 'Uni' is not the answer.

There I will agree with you absolutely - I have been saying that for years. Academic life does not suit everybody, and trying to get "degrees for everyone" undermines the value of a degree.

 

"When everybody's somebody, why, nobody's anybody" W.S.Gilbert


 

 

RNLI Governor

 

World species 471 : UK species 105 : English species 95 .

Certhia's world species - 215

Eclectic "husband and wife combined" world species 501

 

"Nothing matters very much, few things matter at all" - Plato

...only things like fresh bait and cold beer...

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