Better fish on deads

[lozza]

My pb was caught on a dead bait so was aleast 5 other anglers I know.,what bait or method has caught yours? Lure, live or dead bait would be interested to no. cheers

[JV44]

Livebait but that is because it`s the main method i use , of the deadbaits Sardine and half mack have done best for me but again they are my default deadbait setting so they would

[Dick Dastardly]

My PB was taken on a live as well but in all fairness the answers to your question will mean nothing! I say this as if a man only/normally deadbaits then that's what his PB will inevitably have come on" Also in my case 8 of my top ten have come on lives but that's more down to the waters I fish! See what I mean?

 

Hawks hit the nail on the head for me in the live v dead debate - lives are simply to much bother for most to use!

[Phone]

lozza,

 

The key to angling is CONFIDENCE. Looks as if you have your mind made up. Were you asking a question of telling of your good fortune with the baits you use. I agree with you - if you like what your using by all means stick with it until you no longer have that confidence. I believe, just me, big fish like big bait and you should match the hatch as a 1st choice (in the case of pike wouldn't that be live bait?) others, I assure you believe differently. We both catch fish.

 

I will contend, smaller fish, all fish not just pike, will be more bothersome on the most natural offering. They will not be as apt to interfear if you are specimen hunting with 2nd level baits (i.e. dead).

 

If I want to catch 100 small fish (similar to pike we call wipers) I chum the night before with buckets of cut fish and guts. But if I want to avoid them, the 2 - 6 lb fish, I don't prebait at all. It isn't conditioning, it is simply concentrating the bio-mass.

 

It may be different for you.

 

The third and fourth, etc elements are lures, artificals and stuff like that. They too probably play into the anglers equation as well. You didn't ask about them so they haven't been mentioned. There are layers and layers of "fun" you can add to your pike fishing.

 

Phone

[Steve Burke]

NO

 

Even though the average size of the pike I have had on deads is higher I definitely catch more Pike of all sizes on lives.Deads are pretty poor in comparison to lives on some waters (in fact on a few totally useless) I have caught bigger pike on lives than deads,simply catching more small ones just does not reduce the numbers of big ones you catch neither does catching a higher average size on deads give you more bigger ones!

 

I'm happy enough to catch more rather than a higher average as it simply means that by catching more I am (on percentages) increasing my chances of catching more bigger ones.Also as it doesn't lower my chances it gives me plenty of sport in between the real lumps.

 

I still think its conditions that dictate if live or dead is "best" and when I am faced with extreme "good" or extreme "bad" I let this (to a degree ) influence my choice.That said Its very rare I dont fish both at the same time.

 

Its hard to explain without going into a lot of detail and anecdotal evidence but I suppose the basic answer to your question "if you target larger pike should you stick to useing dead baits as a general rule?" is-

 

"You wont catch more big fish by only using deads but you will catch less fish of all sizes"

 

Not for the first time I agree with Budgie.

 

As per a post on another recent topic I catch as many big pike (15lbs+) on deadbaits as I catch on livebaits or lures. However I catch less pike on deadbaits as these produce less small pike.

 

Like Budgie I find that some waters, notably trout reservoirs, don't respond well to deadbaits. The only exception I've fished myself is Weir Wood.

Edited January 17, 2012 by Steve Burke

[Dave H]

I try not to talk about predator fishing as it gets my feathers all fluffed up and i held back last time but i am going to say my piece as i am new to the forum so once said i will not bore you with it again.

 

Looking at it in more details in my catches it seems that i caught more on deads on rivers and a better size and less in lakes and when i did live bait i found it more successful in stillwater but as said i have been fishing for 30 years but i just got very awkward about it but i don't want to change direction in the post here or the flood gates open but i do feel awkward and therefor don't really do it and do not really know how too. Yes i know a pencil float , trace etc . I fished every weekend for Zander for 10 years but it was on rivers or moving waters down stream its much easier but then what the heck i get more on deads so why bother it was just on few occasions as a B plan so to speak. And people who think only livebait will catch zander are talking out of their backside.

 

I seriously think too many pike anglers ( i say that in a loose sence of the word) think they know how to livebait and i bet 90% of them don't and again i believe a good 70% would not know how to deal with a hooked pike either. even i probably need a refresher course it it . The amount of pike i have found with traces in them either washed up dead or caught is beyond belief and to see one btreaks my heart.

 

I might have waffled a bit here but it is in the scope of things and i really wish that day ticket waters with large amount of pike in are NOT aloud to be fished for unless a proper course has been taken and passed and then a badge or certificate produced to the fishery and if DEFRA come round and they have not then been on a atleast simplistic basic course the angler and water owner are prosecuted. We owe it to the pike and too ourselves ( i have been sliced by a gill and believe me if bad enough you will be packing up straight away and you better get a stitch in it before you end up loosing 4 pints of blood). I know that the idea will never come about but even and some might laugh a dummy of a pike and prove to the fishery bailiff/owner knows that angler can if not he/she does not set out to fish for them.

 

Anyway said me bit ...Sorry about that but there you go...

[AddictedToScopex]

I try not to talk about predator fishing as it gets my feathers all fluffed up and i held back last time but i am going to say my piece as i am new to the forum so once said i will not bore you with it again.

 

Looking at it in more details in my catches it seems that i caught more on deads on rivers and a better size and less in lakes and when i did live bait i found it more successful in stillwater but as said i have been fishing for 30 years but i just got very awkward about it but i don't want to change direction in the post here or the flood gates open but i do feel awkward and therefor don't really do it and do not really know how too. Yes i know a pencil float , trace etc . I fished every weekend for Zander for 10 years but it was on rivers or moving waters down stream its much easier but then what the heck i get more on deads so why bother it was just on few occasions as a B plan so to speak. And people who think only livebait will catch zander are talking out of their backside.

 

I seriously think too many pike anglers ( i say that in a loose sence of the word) think they know how to livebait and i bet 90% of them don't and again i believe a good 70% would not know how to deal with a hooked pike either. even i probably need a refresher course it it . The amount of pike i have found with traces in them either washed up dead or caught is beyond belief and to see one btreaks my heart.

 

I might have waffled a bit here but it is in the scope of things and i really wish that day ticket waters with large amount of pike in are NOT aloud to be fished for unless a proper course has been taken and passed and then a badge or certificate produced to the fishery and if DEFRA come round and they have not then been on a atleast simplistic basic course the angler and water owner are prosecuted. We owe it to the pike and too ourselves ( i have been sliced by a gill and believe me if bad enough you will be packing up straight away and you better get a stitch in it before you end up loosing 4 pints of blood). I know that the idea will never come about but even and some might laugh a dummy of a pike and prove to the fishery bailiff/owner knows that angler can if not he/she does not set out to fish for them.

 

Anyway said me bit ...Sorry about that but there you go...

So who will pay for the course? Who will pay for the admin? What if someone forges a pass certificate and the water owner gets fined. There is a lot more to it than just saying lets introduce compulsory learning. It is one thing to say everyone should pass a course but I think it is just so unrealistic and nobody would bother anyway just like a lot of people ignore the rod license. Who will police the anglers pike fishing on canals and rivers. Do they need to pass the course too? Maybe we should ask the EA to enforce the course and certificate as they do such a stellar job with the rod license.

 

I love fishing for barbel and I catch a lot of fish with hooks in them etcso would you suggest that a course be passed by everyone looking to fish for barbel? Why should pike get preferential treatment?

 

Not being an arse for the sake of it or loooking to start an argument but I am just pointing out that while your views are valid they are also a little unrealistic in practice.

 

I don't see anything wrong with things how they are. Common sense is the only thing that is needed. No matter what you will get inevitable casualties whether caused by inexperience or just bad luck. If we want to avoid it all together we may aswell hang up our rods.

 

A course wouldnt change anything. Look at todays drivers. They all drove well enough to pass their tests but do you honestly think that the majority of them continue to drive as they did on their test?

Edited January 17, 2012 by AddictedToScopex

[Anderoo]

It's practicable at club level and can't see why it sholuldn't be at day-ticket waters too. When I was a member of FAS I had to wait until my second year as a member and then attend and pass a pike teach-in at one of their lakes, before having my membership book stamped and being allowed to fish for pike on their waters. I thought then (and still do now) that it was a brilliant idea.

 

As well as being shown 1:1 how to hold and unhook live pike, they also show you how to set up effective rigs and indication, and how to make your own traces.

 

It makes no difference how experienced you are (or say you are), everyone has to get their book stamped before being allowed to fish for the pike.

 

It's not practicable on free waters, but if every club/day ticket water/syndicate did the same, the poor old pike wouldn't get such bad treatment.

 

(ATS - they also did a barbel one.)

Edited January 17, 2012 by Anderoo

[Dick Dastardly]

I'm with Hawk as well ATS.As Anderoo says its well manageable at club level. Several of the teach ins I did each year were for clubs that had a "must attend/prove competence" system before piking was allowed.I wish more did.

 

I doubt any piker worth his salt would object to it knowing what an important issue this is.

 

Now I hate to say it but say it I must, the only surly faces I ever came across on pikers having to attend one of my teach ins inevitably belonged to anglers "who already knew it all" ......................................and in practice knew sod all!

 

Oh BTW Hawk don't ever feel that you need to dodge any issues here on AN! Also just because your not "current" dont mean your input (as you've shown since joining) isn't worth while.

Edited January 17, 2012 by BUDGIE

[AddictedToScopex]

Budgie, Anderoo, Hawk

 

I am not disputing at all that in an ideal world it would be a great idea I am/was simply making the point that it just seems very impractical and most likely extremely costly to attempt to roll out a sweeping rule and compulsory (even legally required) learning course to any and all still waters that contain pike. On a club level of course it is easier to manage and will no doubt be effective up to a point but to attempt to force all fishery owners to implement this would just fail IMO. Also if it were decided to do this for pike then why not all other species. It gets me a bit that everyone takes the **** out of the carp anglers (usually rightly so ) for putting their fish up on a pedestal but is this not just an example of doing the very same?

 

I appreciate the need for protection for pike from inept anglers but a one day course would have little if any effect. I related it to the driving test. How many people including ourselves still drive with the same care and attention that we did on our test.

 

You can lead a horse to water

Edited January 17, 2012 by AddictedToScopex