Trotting for Barbel - advice please

[Phone]

Mat, Tigger,

 

Dislodging material from the streambed to attract fish, [is]known as the “San Juan Shuffle,” and is considered chumming. Especially in trout waters you better be picking them up and putting them down. Chumming is defined as dislodging or depositing any substance not attached to a hook which may attract fish. It is considered POACHING. The penalty is loss of all "kit" - often including your means of transportation (although briefly).

 

Ken,

Maybe this will help. http://www.pestproducts.com/roachbait.htm

(I'll get my hat)

 

Phone

Tigger, you might loose one of them cheap arse pins.

Edited August 15, 2012 by Phone

[Matthew Simmons]

Mat, Tigger,

 

Dislodging material from the streambed to attract fish, [is]known as the “San Juan Shuffle,” and is considered chumming. Especially in trout waters you better be picking them up and putting them down. Chumming is defined as dislodging or depositing any substance not attached to a hook which may attract fish. It is considered POACHING. The penalty is loss of all "kit" - often including your means of transportation (although briefly).

 

Ken,

Maybe this will help. http://www.pestproducts.com/roachbait.htm

(I'll get my hat)

 

Phone

Tigger, you might loose one of them cheap arse pins.

 

Hi Phone - thanks for joining the thread, which has proved to be really interesting.

 

I'll remember your advice when I finally get to Henry's Fork (currently top of my bucket list) - but its a great idea. But on the trout rivers I get occasional access to - in the south of the country - questions would be asked in parliament if you got caught fishing downstream - let alone chumming as well!

 

M

[Nicepix]

Clive,

 

I am very familiar with the technique and I can think of a couple of stretches that I have access to that would allow me to do this - with a 10' fly rod I use for Salmon in Ireland - should be up to the task with a heavy fluoro tippet - there's not that much weed this year. But I'd probably need to try it on a weekday - the kennet is quite busy at the weekends - not sure I'd be the most popular guy on the river! I'll stick to trotting this year.

 

M

 

No disrespect mate, but salmon and barbel are different prospects. A barbel will know the river like the back of its hand and bury itself in any weed or snags. Salmon are strangers to the river. The biggest problem is that fly line is a lot thicker than mono or braid and easily gets stuck in streamer weed or round stones. By all means try it, but prepare yourself for wading to the fish to free it rather than bring the fish to you to land it. I found the better prospect was to trot a nymph down under a float. The Avon rod and braid line is far better able to handle this type of situation.

 

I suppose you could forget the fly line and use braid or mono as there is no necessity for a fly line when Czech nymphing. That might work. In fact, now I have thought of it, I might give it a go myself.

[Nicepix]

Mat, Tigger,

 

Dislodging material from the streambed to attract fish, [is]known as the “San Juan Shuffle,” and is considered chumming. Especially in trout waters you better be picking them up and putting them down. Chumming is defined as dislodging or depositing any substance not attached to a hook which may attract fish. It is considered POACHING. The penalty is loss of all "kit" - often including your means of transportation (although briefly).

 

Ken,

Maybe this will help. http://www.pestproducts.com/roachbait.htm

(I'll get my hat)

 

Phone

Tigger, you might loose one of them cheap arse pins.

 

In some places you are not allowed to wade let alone shuffle. This ban is far more likely on trout rivers, rarely on coarse waters. Coarse fishermen have shuffled in one form or another for years. Even to the extent of raking gravel shallows in preparation to barbel fishing or raking weeds and / or the muddy bottom when tench fishing. I used to troll a lure from my kayak with a length of chain trailing the sea bed hung from the downrigger. The chain kicked up silt that attracted flat fish. In the same vein I tied a fly specifically to kick up silt when being retrieved along the bottom. One place I used to fish on a river always fished best after the cattle had been in for a drink and stirred up the bottom.

 

Shuffling to dislodge insects is nothing new and only banned in a relatively few places in the UK.

[Steve Walker]

Shuffling to dislodge insects is nothing new and only banned in a relatively few places in the UK.

 

I have seen some comment about it recently - it seems to upset people for two main reasons; damage to invertebrate populations in the gravel and (when done by grayling fishers in the winter) concern that it damages trout redds.

 

Of course, logically, the second concern should also apply to trout fishers trampling grayling or barbel spawn in the spring, but funnily enough I've never seen anyone express that worry

[Matthew Simmons]

I have seen some comment about it recently - it seems to upset people for two main reasons; damage to invertebrate populations in the gravel and (when done by grayling fishers in the winter) concern that it damages trout redds.

 

Of course, logically, the second concern should also apply to trout fishers trampling grayling or barbel spawn in the spring, but funnily enough I've never seen anyone express that worry

 

Yes - strange one that Steve! Both are just as bad. M

[Nicepix]

One could never be accused of chumming for trite if one always fished upstream could one?

[Matthew Simmons]

One could never be accused of chumming for trite if one always fished upstream could one?

 

That's what I was alluding to Clive - on the rivers down here its upstream only - so effectively its a non issue! Not that I am particularly enamoured by the Test and its ilk. Too manicured, too many big stupid trout for the big, stupid corporates .... (no further comment ). Give me a wild stream any day to chuck a fly over! Much more of a challenge. M

[lutra]

No disrespect mate, but salmon and barbel are different prospects. A barbel will know the river like the back of its hand and bury itself in any weed or snags. Salmon are strangers to the river. The biggest problem is that fly line is a lot thicker than mono or braid and easily gets stuck in streamer weed or round stones. By all means try it, but prepare yourself for wading to the fish to free it rather than bring the fish to you to land it. I found the better prospect was to trot a nymph down under a float. The Avon rod and braid line is far better able to handle this type of situation.

 

I suppose you could forget the fly line and use braid or mono as there is no necessity for a fly line when Czech nymphing. That might work. In fact, now I have thought of it, I might give it a go myself.

Ive managed to foul hook a couple of upper single figure barbel on the fly and not had that much problem landing them. A fly rod rated 7-9 has a good bit more power than the average trotting rod i use.

[Nicepix]

Give it go and report back. The reason I stopped fly-fishing for barbel in the conventional manner;- upstream nymph fished between the streamer weed resulted in too many hooked and lost fish. I felt undergunned. Maybe Czech nymphing in relatively weed free areas might be the way forward.