bass stocks are in decline

[barry luxton]

within this news release according to the trust the stock is in decline. Is this the precurser for thier style of management against all including restrictions on anglers. I would like someone to show where that get thier information from with regards to the decline as according to ices the stock is sustainable.

 

I asked that question on this facebook link, rather than reply my question is deleted. Must be something i said. There is no mention of the fabulous bass fishing that anglers have enjoyed this year and is continuing with reports of brilliant sized bass captures for anglers in particular from around the isle of wight and at portland. I have had some good trips this year including top end of the channel.

 

The commercial take, information re methods indicate that the majority of landings are from line caught and netting as opposed to low trawling landings, so it appears that commercially the stock is being fished responsibly. Ignored by the trust is the take commercially of the bass stocks by the french, far out weighs the landings by the uk. Is that being taken into account? Again where have they got thier information that the stock is in decline?

 

http://fightingforfishing.wordpress.com/20...boost-for-bass/

 

quote: The current mls is simply insane and explains why UK bass stocks are declining

Edited November 30, 2012 by barry luxton

[barry luxton]

I left this question within the comments section, it is awaiting moderation, or sanitation

 

fabulous rsa bass fishing has been had this year throughout the channel, this has been ignored by the trust. The commercial bass fishing in the channel is also carried out responsibly by the low landing figures of trawling compared with line caught and targeted gill netting, i.e. no discard issues. Also ignored is the commercial take by the french that is far higer than the uk landings. According to ices the stock is sustainable. According to this report, it is in decline and the mls is used as the reason why. Are the trust and BASS looking for a uk bass fishery based on the Irish model. No commercial landings? Bag limits for the rsa and the fishery to be managed. If so who’s paying and at what cost to the local communities and the under tens who rely on this healthy fishery as they are excluded from 97% of all fish quota issued.

Edited November 30, 2012 by barry luxton

[Bob Shotter]

Both the Angling Trust and the Bass Fishing Society are pushing for the UK to increase the MLS for Bass. The EU has set the MLS for Bass at 37.5 at that size they say Bass can and do reproduce, while others including the Angling Trust’s Conservation rep Malcolm Gilbert dispute this. They would like to see an MLS of 48 and are asking the UK to adopt 40 across the board now with a view to increasing this to 48 over the next few years.

 

The Trust will sight the EU landing figures which increase year on year to support their claim that the stock must be falling; they will add to that the fact that some areas well known for its Bass fishery in the UK are seeing a decline in landing numbers, the far South West being a prime example.

 

The idea that a bigger MLS and Bag limits for RSA will make a difference is about as daft as it gets and without the support of the commercial sector at EU level then all that will be achieved there is more discards not more and bigger fish.

 

What is needed impo to protect Bass is the introduction of a TAC particularly on the breading stock in the Channel something all sides seem to agree on the trouble is the demand across Europe for Bass outweighs this and nothing is likely to change until the stock really is seen to be in trouble.

 

Meanwhile the Trust and co. will push for a bigger MLS and if they get it they will claim it as some sort of battle won.

[barry luxton]

just noticed this cavet within the link that i posted. So it raises yet another question is the ministers ear bent with an opinion or is it facts that the minister will use for any change in policy that could affect local communities?

 

quote: Whilst the Angling Trust's campaigning work is reported here along with various policy positions I should make clear that the opinions expressed are my own." Martin Salter

[barry luxton]

No bass tac according to the nffo, one of the reasons given is the huge amount taken by the rsa, hummm, wonder where they get thier info from as the next sentance clearly states that there is nothing in place to collect such evidence. Looking at the total landings from the commercial sector they will have to do better than push the responsibility of any shortages back to the rsa. Poor excuse. Wondering if they ever talk to the rsa, Gonna give that a go next week.

 

http://www.nffo.org.uk/news/tac_seabass_2012.html

 

quote: .......................................not least because of the high proportion of catches of bass made by recreational anglers. The evidence suggests that the infrastructure is simply not in place in member states to incorporate catch returns from anglers and significant cost and logistical problems would have to be overcome before this could be achieved

 

as a side issue i do like this bit, exactly what happend with the share out of the channel cod stocks, france won, uk lost, quote:

 

As the reference period suggested for the TAC is 2000-2010, it is abundantly clear that the UK’s catches have been underrepresented. It would be wholly unfair, and completely unacceptable, for UK bass fishermen to be disadvantaged in perpetuity because of deficiencies in historic catch reporting arrangements.

Edited December 1, 2012 by barry luxton

[Phone]

barry l,

 

I read with a jaundiced your posts on this subject (over and over). For fun, for me, I read the "reports" your refer and repeat. For the most part, they are extrapolations of opinion and at best suspect data.

 

Without leveling criticism of others, EXACTLY WHAT IS YOUR OPINION or position? You relate "facts" as you choose just as they do! You're the pot calling the kettle black. Although I'd think you are the responsible party since you keep bringing the subject up.

 

Mr. Shotter says things like, "As the reference period suggested for the TAC is 2000-2010, it is abundantly clear that the UK’s catches have been underrepresented."

 

I agree such a sentence is "political witchspeak" for we don't know. Very well - - - What are the "facts". Is it - - - Your opinion vs their opinion?

 

Are you just whining?

 

Phone

[barry luxton]

barry l,

 

I read with a jaundiced your posts on this subject (over and over). For fun, for me, I read the "reports" your refer and repeat. For the most part, they are extrapolations of opinion and at best suspect data.

 

Without leveling criticism of others, EXACTLY WHAT IS YOUR OPINION or position? You relate "facts" as you choose just as they do! You're the pot calling the kettle black. Although I'd think you are the responsible party since you keep bringing the subject up.

 

Mr. Shotter says things like, "As the reference period suggested for the TAC is 2000-2010, it is abundantly clear that the UK’s catches have been underrepresented."

 

I agree such a sentence is "political witchspeak" for we don't know. Very well - - - What are the "facts". Is it - - - Your opinion vs their opinion?

 

Are you just whining?

 

Phone

 

 

Get it right phone, they are bending ministers ears with these errm non facts to impose thier wants that will affect all. It is exactly that, an opinion, nothing else, yet it comes from those who are closest to the ministers. Now come on, do you think for one minute legislation (restrictions) can be introduced, that will not only be not fit for purpose, save to suit those secular guys, but cause problems to those who are enjoy the same stock. Do you wish me to make it clearer for you.

 

It was the nffo who stated the reference years, get it right.

 

Facts are phone the bassing this year, facts, reported captures, including foto,s btw, have been very good. I have also had a good year on the bass again, am i a lier then. While the likes of BASS for example quote that the 'o' class recruitment has been a disaster for one particular year and suggested dracinion measures, that fortunatly came to nothing. Foto's verse's secular opinion, what would you accept as fact, mate.

 

All the time these guys put up waffel to attempt to introduce thier wants upon a fishery that ain't broke i will challenge it. Got a problem with that, tough. You go to a charter skipper who relys on good captures to keep the punters interested and tell him that a two fish bag limit will be imposed on his guys for no sustainable reason at all, you happy to go and tell the skipper that. Come off of it.

Edited December 1, 2012 by barry luxton

[Phone]

Barry l,

 

Well then, why don't you just recommend we read the NFFO Response to the Commission’s Non-Paper on the Development of a TAC for Seabass?

 

Reading it seems to me your saying, current regulations [being put in place] have and will significantly reduced the potential catch of bass by the commercial fleet and therefore the UK’s record of catches. At present there is no means of accurately accounting for the significant component of the bass catch taken by recreational anglers.

 

To me, for this debate, "commercial fleet" and "recreational anglers" are quite different. Why don't you touch on that point?

 

Phone

For effectiveness - may I say your anecdotal "one fisherman experience" probably is not statistically significant for an entire NATION to rely on. Especially one so connected to the sea. If you wish to call yourself a liar - mox nix. Even if your saying recreational boat captains lie as a marketing tool for customers I can't see where it is germaine to the issue. The "key" is a good debate. Not name calling.

[Phone]

Barry l,

 

A couple non-confrontational questions (for me to understand). It the problem with all sea bass or just in the southwest of England. Are the Northsea fish included.

 

Is this a "good" beginning point for me to look at? http://www.fishonline.org/fish/bass-seabass-419

 

I especially intrigued by the "CAPTURE INFORMATION" Is it agreeable with "pleasure anglers"?

 

Phone

[barry luxton]

Barry l,

 

Well then, why don't you just recommend we read the NFFO Response to the Commission’s Non-Paper on the Development of a TAC for Seabass?

 

Reading it seems to me your saying, current regulations [being put in place] have and will significantly reduced the potential catch of bass by the commercial fleet and therefore the UK’s record of catches. At present there is no means of accurately accounting for the significant component of the bass catch taken by recreational anglers.

 

To me, for this debate, "commercial fleet" and "recreational anglers" are quite different. Why don't you touch on that point?

 

Phone

For effectiveness - may I say your anecdotal "one fisherman experience" probably is not statistically significant for an entire NATION to rely on. Especially one so connected to the sea. If you wish to call yourself a liar - mox nix. Even if your saying recreational boat captains lie as a marketing tool for customers I can't see where it is germaine to the issue. The "key" is a good debate. Not name calling.

 

your a wind up merchant, you discount anything i have stated with your jaundiced view. (name calling). One item to hold onto is that the scientists, ices, state that the stock is sustainable, you going to ignore that one? I have asked the questions phone for example where have the trust, bass, salter and the nffo got thier information from. If they want a debate bring it on. Somehow they won't. There is nothing in thier armory to back up thier claims particually the nffo that the rsa take is anywhere near that of the commercial sector. One example you can take onboard or ignore, the fishery at the portland race is shared between commercial and rsa boats. The rsa boat full of anglers will never be a patch on the commercial guys because that is thier living, they are bl@@dy good at it, it can only be fished, rod and line, all the time the bass are on the ground they will fish it. Us hobby guys who are lucky to fish it 2-3 times per year will never compete at the commercial level, the rsa guys are re-tackling after each drift, with the exceptions reporting bl@@dy good bass captures. Does that not make sence to you. Yet again the question i have asked is where have the nffo got thier infomation from. Martin Salter makes a point that the views on the link are his personal opinion and it's the trust who have the political 'ear'. They are polls apart from the rsa. They never join in with discussion in particular different opinion, they shy away with that one and come out with the chestnut that they are representing all anglers with thier agenda and they want to improve the rsa's lot, yup right. What have they done for the rsa since inception, nothing of any worth. All that comes out of that camp is what the rsa need. No polls, or audit of the very guys who they claim to represent. The very same guys who they are attempting to drag into the failed cfp as it fits in with thier agenda, without discussion.

 

Regarding the stock, there are no warnings issued re shortages. If so even on a precausionary measure defra and co would come out with measures to protect the stock. Watch my lips, there ain't any. Have you also ignored along with others the take of the french from the very same stock. Any e u warnings of shortages? Your right about dispelling charter boat skippers as liars, you do well to stay away from that one, in particular where i have known many for many years. Someone else can tell you the dangers of going down that route. The south west shortages are an opinion. One thing i can tell you is the south west is outside of the rsa catchment area. The season is very short. Most of the traffic is the holiday makers from the south and the midlands, in the summer season, three months. It starts when the kids break up for the summer holidays. My family is one of the group, have done for years mate. I know of quite a few charter skippers who have second or third jobs due to the FACT that full time trade is just not there. Now tell me you lean towards succnifficent captures by the rsa as the nffo have intimated. Mr shotter voted no to a mls increase as did the ifca in the south west and on the south coast, so shortages of recruitment? Don't let anyone come back with discard re a mls increase, ignore that one as the majority of the bass commercial captures are NOT trawled.

 

a new quote from one of the most experianced and respected skippers on the south coast re portland race:

Paul Whittall

 

 

Well...there we go..last trip of 2012 for me with a fine team of lads from Wales and other associated places nearby. Caught a few bass and watched (again) as the bass lads showed us how to do it!!

Edited December 2, 2012 by barry luxton