Reincarnation - has anyone looked at the evidence?

[Old geezer]

In the number of years I have been in fora, the most divisive threads have revolved around religion. The contention that god exists, or doesn't.

 

Fact is, the proof or otherwise exists only in a persons head.

 

Surely, we are entitled to our beliefs, whatever they are. Just agree to disagree and respect the other persons point of view, because it seems they are in no mood to respect yours......

 

May your god go with you.

Edited January 11, 2013 by Old geezer

[Andy_1984]

Your too kind. More likely the product of an over active imagination and wishful thinking.

 

Probably a bit of both, Cory. i did watch something a while ago regarding it and recounting details while under hypnosis made me think that if they at least get a lot of details correct then it must be something they remember subconsciously along with their imagination.

[corydoras]

Cory,

 

More likely, I was a butterfly or perhaps an old Testament angel. Not sure about the intermitent(sp) years.

 

My point is, it is a matter of faith alone and yours is no better than the next. A better questions would be the other way around. Seems the Christians have the upper hand right now. You have the preponderance for proof the believers are wrong.

 

As for heresy, you say that - we don't - we're full in reincarnation. We are simply a bit selective in what we are to report incarnate or reincarnate. We report only really good guys or bums - like Ken says.

 

Phone

Phone

 

It seems like many theists (if indeed you are one, I knda have my doubts) you do not understand whith whom the Burden of Proof lies. The theist is the one making the claim that God exists, as an atheist I reject this claim, and carry no Burden of Proof. Mr Tench knows this as we have discussed such matters many times in the past.

 

As for the heresy, I don't really care one way or another; I am just laying out the orthodox (note the lower case "o") Christian theology concerning reincarnation.

 

One of the advantages of being raised in a country with no seperation of Church and State and attending a small rural Grade School with only one "Wee wee free" teacher who was given free range to proselytise to her flock was that I got a good background in what Christians beleive from an early eage. I just didn't swallow any of it, but I loved the stories, especially the Old Testament. Like many wee wee frees, Miss Morrison was not scared of the Old Testament. None of this "peace and love" BS from Miss Morrison. Pure old fashioned double predestination was what she preached.

 

I may be an atheist but I still dedicate an hour or so each day to study the bible. KJV version.

[kirisute]

I think your all wrong...jesus was obviously a vampire!

rising from his grave; drinking his blood and eating his body; and in the end speared through the body and his blood caught in a cup that legend holds can then go on to give immortal life.

stands to reason...

 

or maybe its all just utter crap

religion in most forms is nothing more than either mindwashing your flock to gain control of them in some way; or simply human nature not wishing to accept responsibility for its own existence and answer for its own faults and guilt.

belief is a funny thing and a powerful thing.

 

as for resurrection;

reading a lot of forteana and a lot of studies along the way all I can say is that the mind is a weird and wonderful place to examine..just as much as its terrifying and just plain bloody scary as well! can you know past lives? well you have to answer a lot of questions first to get to that point; and as Cory states most Christians are far too blinkered to accept most of the answers that would need to positive to truly accept reincarnation. to know a past life would require a transfer of spirit,or energy or life force; ergo that life force must exist; ergo ghosts must exist if that life force transfer somehow fails; or the inner force side of martial arts must exist; and if god exists there must be hell and all its spiky toothed minions that will tear your soul top shreds; and if hell exists then it must have spewed forth its monsters on the world....

so its comes down to how much you believe what you say you believe!

Edited January 11, 2013 by kirisute

[corydoras]

In the number of years I have been in fora, the most divisive threads have revolved around religion. The contention that god exists, or doesn't.

 

Fact is, the proof or otherwise exists only in a persons head.

 

Surely, we are entitled to our beliefs, whatever they are. Just agree to disagree and respect the other persons point of view, because it seems they are in no mood to respect yours......

 

May your god go with you.

The Flying Tench and I have had many theological sparring matches in the past, both on the public forum and via PM. We can have our discussions without being uncivil to each other most of the time, and without any comforters being ejected from perambulators.

 

Flying Tench's post was not about the existence of God, but rather about re-incarnation, which he stated he does not beleive in, so we are in agreement on the original question in the thread. The theological debate, such as it is, is between myself and Phone, whom I suspect is just being a wee bit provocative, I doubt we will fall out over it.

 

As you say, everyone is entitled to ther own beleif, but when religious people start to make testable claims then that is a different ball game. Jon is not silly enough to do this. He has never claimed that the earth is only 6,000 years old, nor that dinosaurs and humans were contemporaries.

 

I don't have a god to go with me. Miss Morrison and a few Church of Scotland ministers put paid to that.

[corydoras]

I think your all wrong...jesus was obviously a vampire!

rising from his grave; drinking his blood and eating his body; and in the end speared through the body and his blood caught in a cup that legend holds can then go on to give immortal life.

stands to reason...

 

or maybe its all just utter crap

religion in most forms is nothing more than either mindwashing your flock to gain control of them in some way; or simply human nature not wishing to accept responsibility for its own existence and answer for its own faults and guilt.

belief is a funny thing and a powerful thing.

 

as for resurrection;

reading a lot of forteana and a lot of studies along the way all I can say is that the mind is a weird and wonderful place to examine..just as much as its terrifying and just plain bloody scary as well! can you know past lives? well you have to answer a lot of questions first to get to that point; and as Cory states most Christians are far too blinkered to accept most of the answers that would need to positive to truly accept reincarnation. to know a past life would require a transfer of spirit,or energy or life force; ergo that life force must exist; ergo ghosts must exist if that life force transfer somehow fails; or the inner force side of martial arts must exist; and if god exists there must be hell and all its spiky toothed minions that will tear your soul top shreds; and if hell exists then it must have spewed forth its monsters on the world....

so its comes down to how much you believe what you say you believe!

There is so much wrong with that lot that I don't even know where to begin.

[chesters1]

Not faith physics! if matter can only be changed not destroyed this time my matter is a human next time a bunch of worms or a nest of squirrels,if were buried under a tree some of our matter maybecome fruit and pass through a bird and become another tree

I presume theres a finite amount of matter on earth so i guess in 4 billion years we have been most things

Edited January 11, 2013 by chesters1

[Steve Walker]

Not faith physics! if matter can only be changed not destroyed this time my matter is a human next time a bunch of worms or a nest of squirrels,if were buried under a tree some of our matter maybecome fruit and pass through a bird and become another tree

I presume theres a finite amount of matter on earth so i guess in 4 billion years we have been most things

 

Atoms are small enough that I would think we all have atoms which have previously been part of pretty much any historical person you can think of!

 

No reason to remember past lives on that basis, though, unless you want to get the homeopaths in on the case as well as the spiritualists for double the nonsense!

Edited January 11, 2013 by Steve Walker

[Andrew]

 

I may be an atheist but I still dedicate an hour or so each day to study the bible. KJV version.

 

Could you please explain to me why you still read a book that you dont believe in ?

[corydoras]

Atoms are small enough that I would think we all have atoms which have previously been part of pretty much any historical person you can think of!

 

No reason to remember past lives on that basis, though, unless you want to get the homeopaths in on the case as well as the spiritualists for double the nonsense!

Chesters is absolutely right about the chemistry and physics side of it. I just had a cup of coffee, some of the water molucules in it undoubtably passed through the bladder of Oliver Cromwell and Montezuma.

Edited January 11, 2013 by corydoras