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Does The Otter Deserve Such Bad Press?


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I was going to put a nice one in so I've changed tablet so I can :kissing:

 

 

Only problem is this tablet is so small I can't see if the smiley is appropriate.

Smile they said life could get worse, I did and it was

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Otters never left the UK, (England, Scotland or Wales) so they haven't been reintroduced here. OK maybe they have to a few rivers, but they have been making a slow but steady come back to these places anyway in resent years.

 

Some anglers might not like that its return to some parts has been speeded up a little, but that is all that has happened and it might have stopped them from digging their muddy hole even deeper.

 

The only thing that should (and probably will) get more bad press is the modern head in the sand angler. IMO.

 

 

 

A tiger does not lose sleep over the opinion of sheep

 

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here's one area where some otter where released, have a look at the landing weights, they appear to be consistant and healthy.

 

http://www.edp24.co.uk/sport/other-sport/norfolk-angling/angling_results_and_fixtures_1_1933505

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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John

 

Sorry in a rush, i think i already answered the first question. Tell me where there are a plauge of carp in the river and i can answer your second one, I river fish for carp and can say i probably average one every 1-1.5 days. There not plague proportions like Australia and the USA because the water temperature is lower.

 

Sorry for the delay in replying, I got caught up with other stuff.

 

I didn't say "plague proportions", I said "spread like a plague", meaning relentless, no stopping the spread. Maybe a bad analogy on my part.

 

I can only talk about my local waters, and the spread of carp in them. I've fished the Yorkshire Ouse system for over 50yrs, and my father and uncles for 50 before that, and never heard of carp being caught until about 20yrs ago. I've since caught them from three of the rivers, and had reliable reports from others, (even a match on the Wharfe won with carp!). On a stretch of the Aire I found it unusual not to hook at least one in a session, (not always landed), often two or three. These fish appeared in the 2 to 4+lb bracket, so were not bred in the rivers, but washed in from ponds, the canals, or put there illegally by idiot anglers. It's a good job that the climate isn't condusive to successful spawning, they don't need it, their numbers are topped up every time we have a flood. The policy of stocking/ over stocking waters on or near flood plains over the last 20odd yrs has caused this, not to mention the stocking into canals, which invariably run into rivers!

There is a lot of talk about the impact of predators on fish stocks, but a predator will only survive if there are enough prey. If you introduce a species that competes (out competes) with the indigenous species, then the impact is greater. The carp by the nature of it's feeding will take up almost anything. That includes small organisms that fry rely on, and the different food that's needed as it grows, as well as predate on the fry itself. A river will only provide a fluctuating finite amount of food, and this dictates the over all stock level, So every competitive new species introduced will have an impact on the resident stock numbers. It's not like a commercial where the fish rely on extra feeding or excesive baiting to survive. The size of these carp on entry into the system makes them unlikely to be predated on by the pike or perch, so thank goodness for the otter.

 

As it's been said the stock numbers,and species will change over time. Anyone who's fished for a number of years will have noticed this. It's dead easy to blame one thing, an otter, eastern europeans, cormorants, anything that is obvious and seen. Then when the the press sensationalise a percieved problem it starts the ball rolling quicker, and it becomes a 'fact',regardless of proof. There are many factors to consider, many rivers are clearer than they've ever been, (clearer doesn't always mean cleaner/purer), abstaction, invasive species (both flora and fauna), the lack of safe havens for fry etc. One of the invasive species that I believe causes more damage that all the otters, and cormorants put together, is the signal cray. It not only competes with the fish for food, it feeds on the eggs, and fry. While I believe it's part of the cause leading to the exraordinary increase in size of many species, that anglers like, what happens when these big fish eventually die? Will there be enough year classes coming through to replace them? Not for many years I fear, and then we can complain about 'dead' rivers.

 

John.

 

PS, sorry if this seems like I'm rambling, but I'd written it once, tried to post, and lost it! Fingers crossed for this one.

Angling is more than just catching fish, if it wasn't it would just be called 'catching'......... John

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gozzer,

 

Do you approve of our, for the most part, "put and take" stocking policies and practices? They account for (otter - etc) in the number of fish stocked.

 

Phone

 

Does that mean for every fish taken,another one is stocked? Like we have on many trout fisheries? If so, then no I don't. It might be ok for a managed artificial lake, where profit is the main issue, but wouldn't work on rivers. The cyclic fluctuations in stock and food available means that no river could have a static stock level for an extended period.

 

John.

Angling is more than just catching fish, if it wasn't it would just be called 'catching'......... John

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gozzer,

 

Yes, very much like your stocked trout fisheries (I think(?)). I wish I had a matrix I could direct you to. It's worked nearly perfectly since 1952. The problem comes when undesireable fish intrude (carp and snakeheads for example). There is no "take" in the put and take equation. It does dilute the importance of a "record" fish however.

 

Phone

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A waggler is a waggler I don't need telling how to fish it 2013 style.

 

Couldn't agree with this more!

As famous fisherman John Gierach once said "I used to like fishing because I thought it had some larger significance. Now I like fishing because it's the one thing I can think of that probably doesn't."

 

 

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Here's my thoughts...

Well, It's hate-mongering, as per usual. Now that Pike are off the list as blood-thirsty, endlessly hungry, non-discriminant killers of all things aquatic, the anti-anything-predatory division are now setting about seeing the destruction of yet another animal, we as humans, practically wiped off the face of the Earth in the first place.I'm absolutely certain there's an imbalance of Otter numbers in certain parts of the UK but their reintroduction is quite a recent event and like any reintroduction, it takes time for the population to spread out and find some kind of equilibrium but it seems some aren't prepared to give them the chance to do even that.

I'd think most people are glad to know that Otters are back from the brink of destruction but it's yet another case of 'not in our backyard'. As long as Otters are eeking out a living 'elsewhere' there generally isn't a problem. It just so happens that 'elsewhere' is likely to be someone's backyard.

It wasn't so long ago that Mink were rampant on my local river and the fish suffered as a result but Mink aren't a native species, they breed like rabbits and their eating habits are woefully destructive. However, Mink and Otters don't get along and since the larger, native species have increased in number, the lesser, non-native predator has decreased in number and quite considerably too. I know which of the two I'd rather have living in these here parts.

The pike has been let off the hook, quite recently as it happens, due to pressure from in the know anglers and groups like PAC and the scientific community. Now that it's deemed bad practice to net, cull and fling Pike up the bank, it's inevitable that another predator was going to find itself in the firing line. We just can't help ourselves.

I've also noticed that it's mainly Carp owners, farmers, fishery owners and private fish-keepers who are most vocal about this subject. Carp are no more natural to the UK than the Mink, yet they seem to be far more important, having attained almost God-like status throughout the country, yet in other countries, where Carp are equally unnatural, they are regarded as little more than destructive pests. Personally, I'd rather see the back of Carp before I saw the back of a quite beautiful animal that has every right to be here in the first place. The very same could be said for Rainbow Trout and their supporters.

It surprises me that some pikers should have the same level of distain for Otters that was and in some cases still is, directed towards the Pike. It was only very recently that Pike were treated as aquatic vermin and it was the right thing to do, to net them, kill them, discard them and blame them for low fish-stocks, natural or otherwise. We've since learned that Pike are essential for the health of a water and the fish within.

How is that we are so sure that we know the pros and cons of having Otters reintroduced, when we've only recently done a U-turn on widely accepted control methods directed at Pike?

Edited by Andy Macfarlane
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