Consultation On Bass Mls Underway

[wurzel]

Hello Steve

 

A good answer and some valid points.

 

Just some comments on your comments

 

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But I'm getting confused now Peter. I have been lead to believe that overfishing was a myth because there were hardly any boats left fishing. You say that most days you never see another boat, apart from the occasional Dutch beamer towing up and down the same lines. Now there are French stern draggers towing along the tops of the banks,

 

I don't see as couple of large foriegne boats as over fishing. who said any thing about over fishing. Last month we did encounter a large French stern trawler, that did tow on top of all the offshore banks I presume he was fishing for bass.

 

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And what niche exactly, will they be filling?

 

There will be large shoals of under 45cm bass,that will be legal for them to catch. we will be only be targeting the over 45 cm fish .

 

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If the BMP is implemented and they come over here to exploit our 45+cm bass fishery, that's a different story

 

Why? they have every right to the fish, but they will also have the right to the under 45 cm, that to us is more worrying.

 

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But even if that did happen,. they would surely start looking at implemeting something similar themselves if there were benefits to be had.

 

Steve ! can you imagine what would happen if the French government tried to push the BMP on to the French commercial fishermen.

 

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I'm sure this year has been bad for me because of the amount of netting that has gone on, probably as a result of our campaign if the truth was known.

 

I doubt it, the chap in question has probably had a poor season, the same as the rest of us, Why don't you ring and ask him, I know of another visiting boat that spent a day in both rivers and caught very little.

 

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But these good years wouldn't be the norm. They would happen once or twice in a decade perhaps, if the past is anything to go by.

 

Not in the present climate of mild winters, there are allready at least 4 very good consecutive years comeing on now. the trouble with bass is they take too long to mature, it's like watching paint dry.

 

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At one time I thought we all had at least one thing in common, and that was we wanted healthier fish stocks

 

we do, and bass do seem to be healthy.

 

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but now it seems that our commercial fishermen are more worried about what the French might do than the healthy fish stocks.

 

It is one of the main talking points on the ships radio, we just want a leval playing field. I think it is a valid piont.

 

I say again Steve I agree with the princaple of the BMP, but to work with it would be a difficult.

also say again the average Joe Bloggs angler won't throw back a 2lb bass.

 

I presume Tom, as a bloody stakeholder I am entitled to some input to this sceme.

[Jaffa]

That really isn't going to happen.

Are you really saying that Wurzel would prefer to live with a stunted and diseased tree full of maggoty apples, so that his neighbour is deterred from stealing any?

I sometimes find it really difficult to understand the wavelength of commercial thinking!

 

(But I do try!)

When the success of the BMP, in a few short years, demonstrates that it is possible to manage the bass fishery in a much more productive way, you can bet that rather than stealing our apples, 'they' will be tending their own trees, eager to reap similar rewards in their own backyard.

Tight Lines - leon

 

Since Wurzel seems to be doing fine off his Sole fishing, and given that bass, and other warmwater species, appear to be currently thriving, I don't find it hard to understand his "wavelength" at all.

 

When the success of the BMP, in a few short years, demonstrates that it is possible to manage the bass fishery in a much more productive way

 

I have no doubt that the BMP will result in a lot more bass, whatever its effects on the UK commercials, but im far from clear what it means to others stocks, and as yet have heard nothing whatsoever from the pro bmp people on that. I had hoped things were moving away from managing fisheries for the benefit of one species and its economic value?

 

I'd love to see some evidence that "they" will follow our "lead" . Greenpeace could appparently not find any "spotters" for their pair trawl/dolphin campaigns in France? Whats the story here ? we kill off our fishing industry, let the quotas be bought up by other Europeons, in the hope that they will do things better, even though they have even less connection/interest in the preservation of local stocks than, as you allege our own fishermen do? Wheres the evidence that RSA's are a big deal on the continent?

 

Whats the story with a landlocked country like Austria, who have a say in the CFP? You reckon they will see the sense of the bmp and vote for conservation measures? or trade it off against one of their "local" issues like worries about immigration, turkish accession etc. Will our goverment consider bass or the support of Austria on another issue, like say Iraq, to be the deal clincher?

 

All beyond me Leon, but I admire your certainty

 

Worst of all, where the hell is the sense in tying any industry down into rules and regs that suit 2005 (or in the case of the BMP maybe 1995? ) in a world thats moving and changing as fast as this?

 

The biggest human migration in history is going on right now and is already having huge implications for us; yet you want to tie us all down from what can see?

 

Chris

[Simon Everett]

Chris,

and your point is?

 

From what you are saying you are prepared to just sit on your hands and do nothing and accept the current situation. Many of us are not and are prepared to do some work and write and lobby and continue to strive for a beter future for angling - and commercial catches within a realisitic total. We are not prepared to throw in the towel - the European wrangling will take place but that is still no reason to say that there is no point in trying to do anything.

 

Tha man who never failed, never achieved anything. I would rather aim at the stars and miss - who knows, I might hit the moon. Whatever the result it will have started an education process that the sea is coming to the brink of the sustainable harvest. Taking the breeding females en masse is not a bright idea ever - this killing of the Golden Goose has got to be stopped or one year there simply will not be bass left, just like in the late 70s when there was a sudden and rapid decline in the numbers prompting the current measures to be implemented. It was too little too late. It has taken nearly 20 years for the nursery areas and 36MLS to have had any appreciable impact. Now we are seeing the results of those measures and the help from the mild winters in combination. However, it has resulted in many 36cm bass only - they are not being given the chance to grow to a maturity that makes them an attractive target for anglers - would you bother travelling 500 miles and spending £500 to catch a 2lb bass? I doubt it - but there are 10,000s of anglers who travel further than that and spend more than that to catch 10lb bass with regularity. If those fish were around our shores in greater numbers that money would be spent here, not overseas.

 

We need to change our entire thinking on how fish are harvested - managed. We also need to change the way this country thinks about the motor car - it won't be easy, but it has to be done and it will create problems for many who have arranged themselves a comfortable situation that relies upon motor cars for travel - it is just downright stupid that people live 100 miles from where they work. When this country was great, workers lived within walking range of their work. Bicycles are used all over the world, but we lok down our noses at them. So many people drive to work in a huge car with only one person in it - they could use a bicycle if they travel less than 10 miles and a motorcycle for longer distances - but it isn't fashionable. Absolutely stupid, and what is more so many of them moan about it themselves - but then complain if anything is suggested to curb it. I am not off track, it is a very good parallel for the fisheries, and bass in particular.

 

Let us not lose sight of the fact that the BMP and the bass regulations are being used as a starting point, not a finishing line.

[Ken Davison South Wales]

Why? they have every right to the fish, but they will also have the right to the under 45 cm, that to us is more worrying.

 

What distance is that from our coast??

[Leon Roskilly]

What distance is that from our coast??

 

 

Foreign boats aren't allowed within 6 miles.

 

Some with traditional rights are allowed within 12 miles.

 

I'm trying to find out how many, and how many of those fish for bass within 12, and how much bass they take, and compare that with the number of UK boats fishing within 12 for bass and how much bass they take.

 

I suspect that much more is being made of the Johnie Foreigner bogeyman than it deserves in reality, but I've an open-mind, so if someone knows where there are some stats, please point me at them.

 

Tight Lines - leon

[stavey]

Leon or simon or whoever? Where exactly does the geezers dragging a seine net by foot along the beeches fit in to the new netting restrictions on all this? will their practices become illegal if the the mesh increase goes ahead? here in sussex i would say that 50% of all tangle nets catches consist of schoolies so no problem their confirming a bass fishery for the whole of the county.

 

These practices of seine netting and fixed gill netting by foot are a very serious and a continuing and growing problem in my area, (and any others throughout the county) this is something wurzel's and binatone's coleagues here fail to even acknowledge, we know why! but they should be and concerned! as these gits take everything from slipper sole to undersized bass and mullet out with no thought what so ever for the future stocks and they are taking them by the thousands and flogging them to pubs hotels and restaurants, they are destroying what little future both shore anglers and small inshore legit commercials may have.

[Leon Roskilly]

Stavey,

 

My understanding is that, assuming that the proposals are supported and adopted, if they are taking 10% or more of bass in their catch, they will need to increase their mesh size.

 

In any case, any bass that they take that are smaller than 45cm will need to be returned.

 

If the MLS proposals do attract enough support, ans are implemented in the spring, then the next set of proposals, supporting the BMP will be issued early next year, and will contain further proposals to restrict inshore netting for bass.

 

Tight Lines - leon

[stavey]

Stavey,

 

My understanding is that, assuming that the proposals are supported and adopted, if they are taking 10% or more of bass in their catch, they will need to increase their mesh size.

 

In any case, any bass that they take that are smaller than 45cm will need to be returned.

 

If the MLS proposals do attract enough support, ans are implemented in the spring, then the next set of proposals, supporting the BMP will be issued early next year, and will contain further proposals to restrict inshore netting for bass.

 

Tight Lines - leon

 

 

Ok leon, its something to work with for now but implementing and to determine who is and who is not operating illegaly is going to be difficult to prove?

 

If we can get these first to measures through? can we please please please, go for, and hold! out for the 1 mile exclusion zone from the beach for netts, this one proposal imho and i am sure most shore anglers as well would agree bring more benefits to fish stocks as a whole, then a multitude of time consuming small measures one or two at a time, also the responce from our nations anglers on that proposal would be much bigger and they would not object either to any sort of charging for the privilege ie, a license i dont think? cheers..........

[guernseybass]

If the MLS proposals do attract enough support, ans are implemented in the spring, then the next set of proposals, supporting the BMP will be issued early next year, and will contain further proposals to restrict inshore netting for bass.

 

Tight Lines - leon

 

interesting that the consultation document has a proposed date for the introduction, as well as a draft of the ministers approval at the back of it I thought

 

not usual surely ?

 

GB

[Steve Coppolo]

Hello Peter

We've spoke about all this a thousand times on the phone, on the bank or on the boat, so it's more for other's benefit than I'm bouncing some points back at you.

 

The bass fishery might be healthy from a commercial point of view. As long as there are plenty of 36cm bass to be caught that's all that matters. But as I said before, things are different in the eyes of angler. We would like there to be more bigger bass around, and the BMP looks like it might be able to deliver them. O.K, there are bigger bass offshore if you know where to find them, but most sea anglers fish from the beach. Those that get a float own small boats like mine, which are not really suitable for venturing offshore in anything but perfect conditions. It's rare for charter parties to agree to a day sitting it out for one special fish between 8 or 10 anglers.

 

I still reckon that the French have more than enough 36cm bass on their side of the channel, so I still can't see why they would want to come over here to target our 36cm bass. The French pair teams may have historic rights, but how many French gill netters have fished inside our 12 miles, and for how long?

I can understand you wanting a level playing field, but I believe that you will have one if the BMP is implemented. In fact, I think you'll have one up on the French.

 

As for anglers throwing back 2lb bass, I know that will be hard for some but they will just have to abide by the rules, whatever they may be. I would have no qualms about reporting an angler for killing undersize fish. I just hope that if the MLS is increased it will be policed and enforced.

 

I can see both sides of the coin, but being an angler I tend to support the BMP more than I would if I were a commercial fisherman. That may be selfish, I don't know, but I believe that there will be benefits for commercial fishermen too. At the end of the day the future is uncertain. The BMP may, or may not, be implemented. All we are being asked for at the moment is our opinions. What they do with all those varying opinions and the scientific evidence they have is anyones guess at the moment. I've learned over the last few years not to take anything for granted. Let's just wait and see what they decide to do.