Jump to content

Shelf Life or Frozen?


Will Greenhill

Recommended Posts

Really we have not done enough research to know if my statement was twaddle!

 

Boilies in the modern sense have been around 25 years maybe, and used en-mass and as a matter of routine for maybe a good 10. I am not saying boilies are bad for fish WHAT I am saying is that comparing a shelf-life to a frozen nutrtionally is almost irrelevant when comparing it to say a natural grub or insect (or you local carps natural food sources).

 

I remember once reading something like a scientist can take all the chemicals, minerals, enzymes and compounds in an apple, put them together in a jar, but regardless of how he manipulates them he cannot make an apple. Natural food will nearly always be better for all animals than processed food, and boilies (frozen or shelf-life) all contain man-made ingredients.

 

Furthermore, mortality rates are one of those things we have to take with a pinch of salt. A bit of reading online will estimate the life of carp from 20yrs to a 100 - that's a pretty bloody wide margin of error. A commercial fishery will never (or hardly ever) admit it's carp are dying - that would be the end of the fishery! Likewise not all fish that die in a pond surface so they can be counted!

 

The reality of Carp Baits is that a new pellet can be produced with flavours which are toxic to carp, and given they are given no more than a couple of months to a years bait testing the long (long) term effect (5 to 50yrs) are rarely given a thought. Likewise because we change our baits so often the cause of any particular problem is likely to be very difficult to pin down to a certain product or brand.

 

I am not anti-bolie I regularly use them myself - I just find it difficult to believe that we (as anglers) get this HNV thing rammed at us by the angling mags and media and really it is difficult to see how any of those arguments really hold that much water!

Ian W

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 44
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Ian,

If you read what you wrote you said 'boilies stunt carps growth', it is that I take exception to.

 

You also mention how unnatural baits are - like what exactly ? HNV (milk derived), fish meals - (obvious that one), bird food (grains and seeds) etc ? The only unnatural bits are whatever flavours and /or chemicals you may add, unless of course you use shelf lives when you add in (not small) amounts of preservatives.

 

I think there is confusion around what a carp actually eats in it's life - it certainly isn't just bait. I would be suprised if bait made up more than 10-20% of their diet on heavily fished waters the rest are all the natural bugs etc. So that is where they get their other nutritional requirements from.

 

Simply put there's no reason and no evidence to believe baits are in any way harmful. If anyone has scientific evidence to refute that then I'd love to see it.

 

Rob.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can see why as anglers we might look upon someone to prove the baits are harmful, but in truth it is OUR responsibilities as anglers to make sure our baits aren't!

 

Simply put, it is entirely possible that a certain percentage of the well known brands out there may contain flavours, foodstuffs or whatever which are bad for carp - we just don't know. However, we cannot be blinkered and state that until someone proves otherwise we are just going to do it anyway. In fairness, our stance as anglers must be to ensure baits are safe from the off, and that means more testing by companies making baits, and less fad type flavourings which frankly are now getting a little ridiculous.

 

With respect to a carps diet. Boilies are easy food which fill a carp. Look at how many are plonked into a pond each day, and I suspect commercial carp are nearer 75% boilie fed on lakes that allow them - if not higher. They might not always take your boilie, but the carp will probably be very aware of those which are a couple of weeks old and 'a safe bet' to munch at will.

 

Even a home made boilie isn't natural - as I said, you can bunch a load of natural things together but it doesn't make it a natural end-product - especially after it's been cooked!

 

It's an interesting issue - I personally go with Scopex most of the time, and I accept the product I use might not nutrtionally be the best food for the carp. I think as anglers we are perhaps kidding ourselves believing we are doing them favours feeding them this stuff and I just think this nutritional content thing is perhaps being pushed a bit too far - I think most scientists and anglers will agree that it is certainly no substitute for a carps natural diet.

 

 

 

NB:

Apologies - stunting was defintiely the wrong word. I type in haste usually! I meant artificially increasing carps weight - which is true - we are doing that - Carp are bigger now than they've ever been, and it's not all selective breeding.

Ian W

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can see why as anglers we might look upon someone to prove the baits are harmful, but in truth it is OUR responsibilities as anglers to make sure our baits aren't!

 

Simply put, it is entirely possible that a certain percentage of the well known brands out there may contain flavours, foodstuffs or whatever which are bad for carp - we just don't know. However, we cannot be blinkered and state that until someone proves otherwise we are just going to do it anyway. In fairness, our stance as anglers must be to ensure baits are safe from the off, and that means more testing by companies making baits, and less fad type flavourings which frankly are now getting a little ridiculous.

 

NB:

Apologies - stunting was defintiely the wrong word. I type in haste usually! I meant artificially increasing carps weight - which is true - we are doing that - Carp are bigger now than they've ever been, and it's not all selective breeding.

 

I'm afraid I disagree strongly again. You seem to make major assumptions that have absolutely no basis in fact. I don't believe there's anything wrong with baits. Of course the ingredients can be harmful - do some google searches on ethyl alcohol for example and see what comes back. That is however all going to be animal and human based - no-one tests these things on carp. You want real testing then you ask the bait companies. The money it costs to do the job properly will close them all down, but feel free to ask them. I'd love to hear their responses.

 

NB/ however almost all flavours are the same - that is 99.9% solvent, 0.1% 'flavour', of which there are maybe 3 or 4 solvents.

 

Rob.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Essentially the argument that fresh boilies are better for carp and improves growth rates just isn't really fair.

 

sorry but gotta dissagree with this......jus gotta look at one of our syndicate lakes which has had a established stock for many years and most fish used to be about 23-25lb all looking old and battered...... but since the introduction of the more members all putting high quality bait in, the fish are now in the

30-35lb bracket and all look healither then they ever have....like i've said before if you was to eat strawberry flavoured sweets every day that are full of preservitives ect you would feel pretty crap....wheras if you was to eat fresh strawberrys every day you would feel pukka....thats how i see the fresh verses shelf life argument

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And what was their verdict then Will?

 

Gentlemen:

I think their verdict was that ready mades catch as many carp as fresh/frozen, Yes Ken is obviously highlighting Nutrabaits in this article but he could have been talking about any one of the many bait companies producing ready made boilies.

 

And if you were sponsored by them wouldnt you?

 

When I started this thread my question was is there any difference between ready mades (shelf life) or frozen/fresh boilies and can you expect to catch more fish using one or the other.

 

The only thing I have found out is that fresh/frozen boilies breakdown in the water quicker than ready mades

 

There is no scientific proof that ready mades are better for the fish than frozen/fresh.

 

Yes they have preservatives in them but unless you are a strict vegaterian I bet over 80% of the food we eat has preservatives in, are they all really that bad for you?

 

How many waters have actually banned ready mades? for how bad they are for the fish.

It dosent happen.

 

Another thing that comes to mind when we buy food it has to by Law I think have the ingrediants on the pack.

Never seen it on a pack of Boilies?

 

How do we know whats in them apart from some super secret ingrediants that will catch you more carp than you can dream of.

 

Clever marketing! wish I had thought of it!

Cum Catapultae Proscriptae Erunt Tum Soli Proscript Catapultas Habebunt

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We and our partners use cookies on our website to give you the most relevant experience by remembering your preferences, repeat visits and to show you personalised advertisements. By clicking “I Agree”, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. However, you may visit Cookie Settings to provide a controlled consent.