Keep canoes off our rivers, e.petition.

[Guest Rabbit]

The right to canoe on all our rivers? No way. Not much wrong with seeing the odd indian on the larger rivers but, smaller rivers this cannot be good. Strange isn't it there is a close season for anglers on rivers and yet these people could disturb gravel spawning areas at will, the 'white water' would be an added attraction to these born again cyclists.

Had an incident on a weir pool on the Warwickshire Avon last summer fishing a weir pool, when a group of kyakers caused mayhem by ruining our sport, swearing at anglers, and proceded downstream to charge into an anglers line when he was playing a barbel. Another occasion about six tried to launch their craft about 12 foot from where I was fishing, needless to say they did not.

Sorry my kyaking friends on here, but I for one think that anglers and kyaks dont mix, I could not canoe past an angler without feeling a great deal of guilt that I had disturbed his sport. Can you?

[Simon Everett]

The problem is not all waters are the same.

 

I would think a system similar to the public footpaths across fields would be the best way forward - actual sections of certain waters where canoe/kayak access was permitted, but with other off limits water.

 

The right to roam does NOT mean you can stray off marked footpaths - it merely provides access to unfenced areas.

[Peter Waller]

It could be argued, with some truth, that both parties are being selfish on this issue, but the harsh reality is that us anglers got there first. Why should we give in?

 

I do have a canoe, and I am seriously tempted to buy a yak. But to be able to go just anywhere I please? Not so sure. One of my great joys with a canoe is the peace and quiet that I am able to find. But would I be best pleased if the local water skiing club demanded access and a right to ruin that peace quiet? I don't think so. Okay, so that might be extreme, but a flotilla of boisterous canoeists, young or old, and why do they always shout at each other, can be equally disastrous for anglers.

 

Simon, how on earth could you police such restrictions as you suggest? We already have off limit waters, but the BCU want unrestricted access to such areas. Give an inch, and eventually a mile is taken.

[izzetafox]

I too am a fishing yakker. I have passed anglers with never a cross word indeed there is usually an interesting exchange about access to otherwise inaccessible swims.

 

As for 'total access' then NO, but access to areas that are already deemed navigable by powered craft then definitely.

 

Are you aware that there is significant access permitted already.

 

£20 approx membership of the British Canal Union gets you access to all British Waterways Canals, you also get 3rd party liability insurance ( how many anglers have that ?????), a further £20 will get you access to the River Glen, Nene, welland and Ouse complexes which I assume would include the Fenland drains.

 

So you see things are not as 'angler exclusive ' as you think.......I belive the E.A. also offer navigational access on other River complexes.

 

I am uncertain how long these agreenents have been in force but have you seen your favourite stretch of Anglian Waters rivers devastated by kayak/canoe yobs????

 

I am sorry but as I say I fish from bank and yak and think the two can complement each other. I was an angler first and saw the yak as a way to enhance my experiences. Rather than dismiss it out of hand perhaps you should give it a try.

 

As for the ' we were there first' argument, I thing we would find that historically the rivers were probably shared by our ancesters for travelling and hunting and often both at the same time.

 

Do not be blinkered and judge all yakkers by the occasional idiot, the same way as anglers would not want to be judged by the idiot angler who dumps luncheon meat and sweetcorn cans on the bank along with his left over line and hooks. In both groups these are the minority that the majority try and educate.

 

Both groups should talk to each other rather than firing ill informed insults back and forwards. That way we should get what we all want ' a sensible solution'.

Edited March 21, 2007 by izzetafox

[Peter Sharpe]

There are small rivers where canoes are completely out of place and wholly disruptive to wildlife as well as other river users.

The trouble is that these e petitions have very quickly become one of the biggest jokes of recent years and I'm quite sure that nobody takes any notice of them whatsoever. I think there are groups of people who become obsessed with them and spend most of their spare time putting their names to absolutely anything.

[Moggy]

The right to canoe on all our rivers? No way. Not much wrong with seeing the odd indian on the larger rivers but, smaller rivers this cannot be good. Strange isn't it there is a close season for anglers on rivers and yet these people could disturb gravel spawning areas at will, the 'white water' would be an added attraction to these born again cyclists.

Had an incident on a weir pool on the Warwickshire Avon last summer fishing a weir pool, when a group of kyakers caused mayhem by ruining our sport, swearing at anglers, and proceded downstream to charge into an anglers line when he was playing a barbel. Another occasion about six tried to launch their craft about 12 foot from where I was fishing, needless to say they did not.

Sorry my kyaking friends on here, but I for one think that anglers and kyaks dont mix, I could not canoe past an angler without feeling a great deal of guilt that I had disturbed his sport. Can you?

 

Kayaks and anglers can easily mix, Rabbit! It's just a matter of mutual respect isn't it? I've enjoyed both sports for many years, (Though never combined) and I've rarely had a problem, whether I've had a paddle or a rod in my hands. Used to paddle the Leeds Liverpool canal down Formby way every Sunday. My wife was happy to get me out of the house for the day, and I was happy to visit the Scarisbrick Arms, The Ship Inn, the Saracens Head and the Bluebell, each in turn...(Well...you have to keep your fluids and blood sugar up!) I just asked anglers where they would like me to pass and as far as I remember, only got civilised answers!

 

Live and let live...canoists are usually just passing through and the disturbance to fishing is usually minimal.

 

Moggy

[chelmerpaul]

Can't really see a problem with this. How many canoeists are there anyway?

 

You seem a bit upset peter. What's the matter - did you discover that your "German girl" was really a big Geordie with a moustache?

[Neil G]

And one that would probably be 'won' by bird watchers, not anglers or canoeists.

 

I suppose I don't fish often enough these days to experience much in the way of boat/canoe traffic, but it's never bothered me. An ignorant boater would annoy me just as much as an ignorant angler, and there are plenty of the latter. There are 60 million of us sharing this country. I'd much rather we all tried to respect each other's enjoyment of the outdoors.

 

Well said

 

Most of the boaters on the river where I fish have been nothing but considerate towards myself fishing so O've got no issues with them being there. Most of the fishing I do is in the winter anyway for pike so the traffic on the river then is pretty minimal anyway.

Edited March 21, 2007 by Neil G

[chesters1]

It could be argued, with some truth, that both parties are being selfish on this issue, but the harsh reality is that us anglers got there first. Why should we give in?

hmmmm thats very unlikely since most rivers (even small streams today) were highly used highways in the past then its the contrary.

even my stretch of the wey was 3 / 4ft deeper a 1000 years ago (barges took stone up it to build waverly abbey in 1278) its considered unavigable now by the village council (to allow them to ban canoes) its perfectly usuable by canoes for many miles upstream.

because you see "natural" looking headwaters now only means its (the river /stream) been allowed to silt up or get gravel beds because boats are no longer the main transport today.

angling as we know it is pretty modern but fishing for the pot using a rod probably not as old as using a dugout.

even in the 6ft wide narrow bits i fished on the wey i had no problems with canoes (no i dont own one) they went past in a very short time and i know their passing stirred up the silt which benifitted both fish and their pursuer.

anglers get the "privilage" to get to the fishing via the landowners land ,they dont own the fish nor the river! canoes dont need to go on private land in their journey so why restrict them ?

theres bolshy canoeists just as there is bolshy anglers but those are a small % of the overall river users most of both sections get on perfectly well .

you wouldnt like a canoeists petition asking to ban angling because a few anglers obstruct canoes so why the opposite?

Edited March 21, 2007 by chesters1

[Guest Rabbit]

Kayaks and anglers can easily mix, Rabbit! It's just a matter of mutual respect isn't it? I've enjoyed both sports for many years, (Though never combined) and I've rarely had a problem, whether I've had a paddle or a rod in my hands. Used to paddle the Leeds Liverpool canal down Formby way every Sunday. My wife was happy to get me out of the house for the day, and I was happy to visit the Scarisbrick Arms, The Ship Inn, the Saracens Head and the Bluebell, each in turn...(Well...you have to keep your fluids and blood sugar up!) I just asked anglers where they would like me to pass and as far as I remember, only got civilised answers!

 

Live and let live...canoists are usually just passing through and the disturbance to fishing is usually minimal.

 

Moggy

 

Your right about the mutual respect and mostly there is not a problem, but the incidents hihlighted that I witnessed last summer, indicates to me that some kyakers are getting more millitant. I and other anglers invest a lot of time and money to fish for species of fish that are easily spooked. Can you imagine the scenario that you have been stalking chub or barbel for a few hours, introducing feed to get them feeding, and the moment you have fish interested in your hookbait a couple of kyakers a paddling through the swim discussing Brokeback Mountain at the top of their voices. Needless to say the fish are gone and so are the intruders leaving one very frusterated angler. It happened.

 

I am sure kyakers such as you and your friends do have empathy, but many do not, to see any amount of kyakers shooting the weirs on the Warwickshire Avon and paying no regard whatsoever to others is a fact I am afraid.

 

This problem is a serious one and is affecting the rights of a large amount of people who just seek peace and quiet by the river. Surely in this age high speed stressed livinig we are entitled to a bit of tranquiity?