pole floats for deep river heavy tide norfolk broads

[John Weddup]

As some of the regulars here know I fish the norfolk broads this time of year. I very often use feeder tactics for bream but am enjoying the pole for the quality roach.

 

What would be the prefered floats to fish 8 ft deep or more with heavy tide such as at acle to thurne mouth on bure. I know the matchmen use pole on Yare for roach which is a slightly stronger tide.

 

I have used lolipops at about 4grms but it obviously is not any good for trotting through. I have seen the sensas choisy on benwicks site and its availeable in 4 6 8 and 10grms. It looks ideal and will probably give it a go.

 

Interested in anyone elses experience with this style of pole fishing.

 

Would I be better going for the heavier float to make sure of correct presentation. I feel the 4 grm river float is a bit light.

 

Any matchmen who fish the yare please let me in on your secrets, promise not to tell.

 

Also fancy using 17ft rod and big stick float before boats wake up. This could be very interesting.

 

Best regards

 

John

[coarsefish-torbay]

Hi John,

Flat floats are not just for holding back and keeping a bait still. It might be worth using one to run through at half speed.

 

I know some French anglers who use big Cralusso's for trotting on rod and line for barbel because you can run them through in heavy water, and then stop them by changing the angle of the mainline.

[Bob Bradford]

John I fish the river Yare open matches every Saturday, I have already framed in several of this years opens fishing the pole, and used to hold the match length record catch in 5 hrs of competition until I smashed it again (125lb of Bream) only to be beaten by 1lb in the same match!

The float I use is called a Sensas Bernard, I carry them on ready made up pole winders in different sizes, the size I use most is the 3 gram , you will need a bulk weight (Olivette of 2.75 grm) and set the float properly with no 8 shot , the nearest shot to the hook needs to be about 6 to 10 inches depending on the flow, plumb up and set the float about 4 inches over depth, ease the float through at half pace and keep stopping it to allow the bait to rise off the bottom and then let it go, usually the float will just bury! the best hook bait is Caster or red maggot on a size 16 fine wire hook, hooklength should be 0.10 or 0.12, feed small balls of GB laced with hemp and casters every other fish, before long you will be bagging! tight lines Bob.

[John Weddup]

Thank you very much Bob brilliant reply

 

I have used the bernard and wondered if it was heavy enough, the biggest they do is 4 grms, but if you make the 3grm work on the yare then it must be heavy enough.

 

Do you think it would be heavy enough holding back or would the bait lift with flow.

I am paranoid about presentation for big roach and feel that the flow can lift bottom of rig high up in water without me really knowing.

 

I generaly use sweetcorn as bait once fish have started to feed as I am fishing for the larger fish rather than quantity as in match. Having said that I will have a session sticking to maggot and caster as with your record and results its success cannot be denied.

 

I have found as you say that feeding a small ball of gb laced with bait works better than dumping a load in at start. I have been using dead maggot a lot, wheat, and kibbled maize as well as hemp.. They also make great feeder fillers aswell. Kibbled maize is dried maize smashed by machine to small peices and sold as chicken feed. Boiled for a short time it turns into tiny sweetcorn like particles. A brilliant feed and very cheap. When I go home from fishing now I riddle maggots and freeze them for next weekend.

 

How close do you set the olivette?.

 

I have had huge numbers of skimmers on the bure this year the most for many years. Hope the yare is doing the same. I am up to my caravan at oby again this weekend so will put into practice what you have kindly helped me with.

 

I discussed your reply with a good angling friend of mine who has improved my match tactics immensely. We fish most saturdays together through the winter. When I said your name he said he knows you well. Hugh Smith from Sudbury.

 

 

Once again many thanks for taking time to reply

 

Best Regards

 

John weddup

[Bob Bradford]

Say hello to Hugh for me....we used to fish in the same match team years ago!!!

 

If your approach is going to be a mostly corn attack a flat float may be a better option John, last Saturday I tried corn on the hook whilst feeder fishing and although I fed nearly a tin full through the feeder, I could not buy a bite on the stuff! I did catch 11 skimmers on pieces of chopped worm though, they were too small to significantly boost my overall weight, about hand sized would best describe them , for plenty of bites and Roach up to a 1lb Caster is king on the pole, but your corn approach I am sure will yield some Roach, I would be very interested if they are bigger than 1lb though!

 

I place the Olivette about 18 inches away with several no 8 droppers below that, if you are using a heavy hook bait like corn I do not think you should worry to much about it lifting off the bottom, if it is running clear I push the Olivette up to as much as 4 feet away from the hook and spread the droppers you will be amazed at the difference that can make, you can go from no bites at all to a bite every run through, don't be fooled into thinking the flow on the bottom is as strong as it looks on the surface, regards Bob.

[John Weddup]

Hi Bob

 

Speak to Hugh most days so will say hello. I beleive a couple of our local lads fish with you on saturdays aswell.

 

The corn has worked consistently for me on the Bure for several years now. I always start sessions with maggot and caster (hughs favourite bait) then when I know the fish are there and feeding I switch to corn or bread for the bigger ones. If bites slow too much I go back to caster or maggot. I think the only way to really loose the fish altogether is by wrong feeding tactics. This is something I am learning all the time. Hugh has taught me a lot regarding this but of late he has been a stillwater man. That is until last winter when I enticed him back on our local river stour in the winter again.

 

I am always wondering what speed the water is in bottom half of river I suppose its a lot slower generally but depends on botom make up/depth changes. I am not a lover of the lollipop as to hold back I generaly fish overdepth and if I need to move it through swim it does not perform that well. I find holding back can get the bigger fish when done right.

 

Overall my lack of practice with the pole in these conditions is probably my downfall so your help and advice is much appreciated. I often see anglers on the banks locally that are catching nothing when I am and when you try to help them they think they know it all and do not take advice kindly.

 

Thats the trouble with many anglers but we are lucky to have this site that allows members of all different skill levels and experiences to swap idea's

and experiences. As in work the clever man is the one who knows there is more to learn and will listen.

 

Thanks again Bob your advice has not fallen on deaf ears. If Hugh keeps pushing me and time permits I may well join the match brigade in the future and give the yare a go.

 

Best regards

 

John

[A Worm OOE]

I was also going to sugest the Sensas Bernard I use little else for trotting in heavy flows be it a flooded Medway, Thames or the Tidal Stour (Kentish). They are without doubt the best pole float I have ever used on flowing water.

Something I have had a lot of success with is fishing relatively light floats 2-3 grammes but overshotting them heavily. By adding up to 2 swan it is possible to get these light floats to go through a swim very steadily but without resorting to big floats.

It is not for the lazy as the bristle has to be constantly heald out of the water but bites are better than when holding a bigger float and you should connect with more of them due to the lighter float. They work a bit like the lolipop being eased through but as a tide increases or decreases rather than changing float you can add or remove the extra shot. I used this tactic long before the Lolipop floats turned up and would still prefer it to the lolipop in a situation with variable flow such as a tide or the Medways ever changing automatic sluices. Now I would only use a lolipop in extreme conditions and when I want to hold a float dead still.

The same technique also works with running line but again its ahrd work.

 

A general point about fishing strong flows (and in general) is to constantly keep adjusting untill you hit on a winning formula. I am constantly adding and subtracting shot moving the Oli up and down alltering the depth that the float is set........ Dont just set the float at or abit over the depth of the swim.Very often the depth at which the float is set has little to do with the depth at which you fish. I won a round of the kent League on the Stour with 38lbs of Roach and Skimmers a seson ago, the swim was five to eight feet deep(average tide), the float a 2.5 gram set at between 8 and 11 feet deep held back to less than half the speed of the surface flow with up to 4bb over shotted. I arrived at this after much experimenting, the flat float produced very little a 5 gram float the same but the small overshotted float got the bites in the end.

Edited July 25, 2007 by A Worm OOE

[John Weddup]

Thankyou thats very interesting.

 

I have in the past done as you say with overshotted float and held back to keep float out of water.

 

Because this style of fishing is not on my doorstep and is only a summer thing on the broads I don't get a lot of chance to practice it enough hence the replys from yourself and Bob have been most helpfull.

 

I had got it in my head that I needed a heavier float but I can now see that may be wrong. It was this feeling of not knowing where the bait ends up in a heavy flow as you mention that had me thinking about using a heavier float.

 

Experimenting is obviously what I need to do to see where fish are being caught. Luckily the Bure is stuffed full of roach and skimmers at the moment so experimenting will be easy as results should show straight away.

 

So down the tackle shop and stock up with bernards and off to norfolk friday for some fun.

 

My real aim apart from catching fish and relaxing a bit is to improve the size of roach. As the autumn approachs I anticipate the roach fishing improving. Bob asked about the size of roach. I have this year had 2 fish at 1lb 4oz and last year a friend of mine fished one afternoon with me and we both had a roach of 1lb 12oz each. The first 2 were on sweetcorn but the bigger 2 were on bread.

 

Those are not estimated but correctly weighed fish and although there are several hybrids around they looked like the real thing. Once you have looked at lots of hybrids from different waters its pretty easy to tell within a little whats a true roach. I know they are not huge roach but show promise of how the broads have improved. A few years ago there were lots of small roach but its now easy to catch lots of 10oz to 1lb fish.

 

Can't wait to get there

 

thanks

again

 

John

[ColinW]

I can't comment on the floats but I'd like to make an observation about the bait. I've used corn quite a lot and I've often found that it starts off catching but then after a few weeks completely "blows", to the point where the fish will actively swim away if you throw some in! That never seems to happen with casters. Pity, when you compare the prices