Alien invaders

[bluerinse]

Cats breed in the lake close to my house, the Cat fish conservation club have a water in Kings Coughton, (Midlands, not norf nor souf) a few years ago they lost a lot of fish due to lack of oxygen.

They did not restock but they did install an aeration system, since then the cats have been breeding and a lot of Small moggies have been caught this year, prior to the aeration system I think I’m right in thinking there was no evidence of the cats producing offspring, it could be two reasons after the disaster there were less cats left and they have reproduced as the water can stand to have more fish in a kind of natural balancing act. Or that the aeration has some how prompted or helped the fist to reproduce or has helped the eggs to mature.

Interesting topic

 

With regards to carp I catch the odd small carp on un stocked waters (river Avon) there are large carp in the river so I presume these are the off spring.

[corydoras]

Cats breed in the lake close to my house, the Cat fish conservation club have a water in Kings Coughton, (Midlands, not norf nor souf) a few years ago they lost a lot of fish due to lack of oxygen.

They did not restock but they did install an aeration system, since then the cats have been breeding and a lot of Small moggies have been caught this year, prior to the aeration system I think I’m right in thinking there was no evidence of the cats producing offspring, it could be two reasons after the disaster there were less cats left and they have reproduced as the water can stand to have more fish in a kind of natural balancing act. Or that the aeration has some how prompted or helped the fist to reproduce or has helped the eggs to mature.

Interesting topic

 

With regards to carp I catch the odd small carp on un stocked waters (river Avon) there are large carp in the river so I presume these are the off spring.

That to me is just irresponsible, why are people risking our waters by introducing vermin.

[Steve Burke]

I'm not qualified to comment on catfish. However I am on carp for, as many of you know, I run my own carp fishery.

 

The biggest mistake I made at Wingham was not realising how successfully the carp on the Carp Lake would spawn. Indeed, every autumn the water is stuffed with carp fry - which I'm sure the bigger carp find a nice high protein addition to their diet!

 

As a result I had no option but to stock pike after just 5 years. It wasn't a problem on the Coarse Lake as it contains very few carp and has always held a large head of predators.

 

Fishery scientists tell me that here in the south-east it appears that carp successfully spawn nearly every year in nearly every water. Of course they have to survive predators to grow to maturity, and as Budgie has pointed many don't survive their first winter due to starvation. There may be sufficient food for the older carp, but there's not enough food of the right type or size for the carp fry.

 

What is interesting is that commons do better than mirrors in that first winter. This would appear to be another reason (apart from genetically reverting to the natural type) why over generations a population of carp is made up of more and more commons.

Edited October 23, 2008 by Steve Burke

[bluerinse]

That to me is just irresponsible, why are people risking our waters by introducing vermin.

 

 

I presume you mean the carp. The cats are land locked and are not near enough to a main water coarse to escape without the help of humans and as it’s a privet syndicate I don’t think they would want to move the cats.

 

The Carp however have escaped into the Avon from fisheries that the river flooded into in the 80's and 90's and I am sure in 2007, One fishery that flooded in the early eighties was a trout fishery, trout were common for a couple of years in the Avon, but these have now all but disappeared.

 

The question of irresponsibility in my mind lies with the environment agency for allowing commercial fisheries to be built on the flood plain without adequate protection.

[lutra]

why are people risking our waters by introducing vermin.

I'm not sure id have use the word vermin, but i can see your point.

 

The thing i don't under stand is why do the NRA allow none indigenous species to be put in any water, as the track record of them escaping is so poor and allowing one water to be stocked with something just seems to fuel the angling interest and it sets a precedence for other to be allow the same. Before you know it we have the situation we have now with carp were they are everywhere like it or not.

 

I hope they frisk vagabond at the airport.

 

The last time i went to Ireland (about 4 years ago now) and was driving from Dublin to Cavan i passed a sign for a carp fishery. After a few pints of Guinness one night in the pub i got talking to a local that was into fishing, so i asked him who would pay to go carp fishing with so much good free fishing about. I'm not sure if i got an answer to that but he did go on to tell me about one or two loughs that carp had been caught from. I wonder how long it will be before Ireland is mecca again.

[Steve Burke]

Certainly in my area the EA counts species like catfish as non-indiginous and doesn't allow them to be stocked in enclosed waters on a floodplain.

 

Carp can be stocked in such waters, although unlike waters not on a flood plain, they have to be health-checked.

[lutra]

I'm not qualified to comment on catfish. However I am on carp for, as many of you know, I run my own carp fishery.

 

The biggest mistake I made at Wingham was not realising how successfully the carp on the Carp Lake would spawn. Indeed, every autumn the water is stuffed with carp fry - which I'm sure the bigger carp find a nice high protein addition to their diet!

 

As a result I had no option but to stock pike after just 5 years. It wasn't a problem on the Carp Lake as it contains very few carp and has always held a large head of predators.

 

Fishery scientists tell me that here in the south-east it appears that carp successfully spawn nearly every year in nearly every water. Of course they have to survive predators to grow to maturity, and as Budgie has pointed many don't survive their first winter due to starvation. There may be sufficient food for the older carp, but there's not enough food of the right type or size for the carp fry.

 

What is interesting is that commons do better than mirrors in that first winter. This would appear to be another reason (apart from genetically reverting to the natural type) why over generations a population of carp is made up of more and more commons.

Thanks for that Steve.

 

I think this thread is starting to show just how temperature dependent carp are to breed successfully. As a northern angler who isn't into carp fishing in a big way (sorry to those that are), i do get a bit of a sense of relief from this, as it is looking a little more likely that the steady invasive march north of the carp may start to slow. I say this as it looks unlikely to me that their going to be as successful in our more northern lakes and lochs, although I'm sure they will be given the chance.

[chesters1]

Certainly in my area the EA counts species like catfish as non-indiginous and doesn't allow them to be stocked in enclosed waters on a floodplain.

 

Carp can be stocked in such waters, although unlike waters not on a flood plain, they have to be health-checked.

not entirely true although the law may recently have changed i know a lake which is stream fed and exited which had a licence to stock cats

[corydoras]

I presume you mean the carp. The cats are land locked and are not near enough to a main water coarse to escape without the help of humans and as it’s a privet syndicate I don’t think they would want to move the cats.

 

The Carp however have escaped into the Avon from fisheries that the river flooded into in the 80's and 90's and I am sure in 2007, One fishery that flooded in the early eighties was a trout fishery, trout were common for a couple of years in the Avon, but these have now all but disappeared.

 

The question of irresponsibility in my mind lies with the environment agency for allowing commercial fisheries to be built on the flood plain without adequate protection.

No I'm talking about the wels. It ought to be illegal to bring one into the country or to release any into any water in the UK, period. We do not NEED catfish to be introduce to the uk.

[poledark]

Who is "we" Cory? I have no problem with cats or carp or any other fish that has been stocked/moved/introduced. All grist to the mill for me as an allround (well rounded) angler.

 

How many of "US" would bother fishing if ponds and lakes and pits were only stocked with "English" fish? Roach/Rudd/Bream/Perch and Pike..........maybe a Gudgeon or two? Much as I love Roach, I wouldn't want to be restricted to what I had when I was a kid.

 

Den

Edited October 23, 2008 by poledark