Alien invaders

[Guest tigger]

Probably a food source for lots of other fish too.

 

 

Yeah but there's loads of fish fry to eat besides Carp so there should be some young Carp left to grow.

[corydoras]

Their at it like rabbits up here to, but don't seem to have the little babies.

How 'little' are we talking about? How many other little fish do you see? Most salmon anglers will never see a salmon parr, unless they guddled about in little streams and burns when they were a kid. I'm just guessing, but I reckon that the little uns will be experts in hiding away out of sight of predators.

[lutra]

How 'little' are we talking about? How many other little fish do you see? Most salmon anglers will never see a salmon parr, unless they guddled about in little streams and burns when they were a kid. I'm just guessing, but I reckon that the little uns will be experts in hiding away out of sight of predators.

I think most salmon anglers that fish worm will have caught salmon parr.

 

As for carp, any thing smaller than 10lb say on some water or maybe less than 2lb on others.

[Guest tigger]

How 'little' are we talking about? How many other little fish do you see? Most salmon anglers will never see a salmon parr, unless they guddled about in little streams and burns when they were a kid. I'm just guessing, but I reckon that the little uns will be experts in hiding away out of sight of predators.

 

 

 

I catch plenty of Salmon Parr every year when trotting for Grayling.

 

I've seen fish fry many times. Thing is Cory I catch small Roach,rudd, Perch, Chub etc but no small Carp in ponds that haven't been stocked with them. They don't have to be fry just a few ounces would do.

Edited October 20, 2008 by tigger

[corydoras]

I catch plenty of Salmon Parr every year when trotting for Grayling.

I'm sure you do, so might anyone fishing small streams and rivers with maggots or worms.

 

The honest answer is I don't know tigger. Does anyone know what young carp eat?

[lutra]

The honest answer is I don't know tigger. Does anyone know what young carp eat?

Most things i think.

 

Ive never had a problem catching little carp on waters they're stocked in.

Edited October 20, 2008 by lutra

[corydoras]

Most things i think.

 

Ive never had a problem catching little carp on waters they're stocked in.

I mean little like under half a pound little. a 2lber is hardly a juvenile.

 

Any clues here?

http://www.carp-fishing-tactics.com/scienc...production.html

Edited October 20, 2008 by corydoras

[Dick Dastardly]

Lutra,Carp breed in all waters providing they get the correct temperatures.That said even down here in the sunny south it doesnt mean they always get the correct water temperatures.

 

A bit like tench though (I dont know if carp fry stay in the weed untill they reach a certain age like tench do) carp fry/very smal carp are rarely caught.

 

Cats do breed in ths country.Ive had very little experience of the "new" UK cat waters but on the older ones such as Claydon,Tddenfoot and Rackly Ive caught kittens.

 

People are often mislead about "natural" conditons for Catfish.THey think about the sort of weather in Spain! Simply not true.Cats originate in Middle to Eastern Europe (hence their other name of Danubian Catfish) Some of these countries (like Czechoslovakia) do have quite warm summers but they are qute short and their winters longer and far colder than ours.

 

Abroad Ive caught plenty of kittens in France and I can assure you that non have been stocked in their rivers since the intial ones!

 

Cats can very quickly establish a sustainabe breeding population. Like a couple of other species if introduced into a warmer climate they can grow much qucker (try puttng a kitten in a warm water tank and see how fast it grows!)

Although ths isnt the main reason they have done so well in Spain as several parts of it that have fished do have quite cold water even in the summer due to being mountain fed)

 

You may be interested (and its quite frightening) just how few cats being introduced can result in a viable population,

in 1974 a German guy Roland Lorwkoski stocked the Ebro with 9 very smal kittens! Between then and mid 75 he introduced some more.In total only 32 fish of between 8-12"!

 

France had similar (though not quite as low) stockings in its river system as well. In fact the only European country that had "proper" stocking was Italy in its River Po.

 

But should we worry about the same happenng here in the UK? Well there have been cats in our river systems for a few years now but weve not seen anything lke what happened in Europe,As pointed out before our temperature isnt greatly different to France. I dont know if it is just the subtle dfference in our temperatures or the fact that our weather system is Oceanic as opposed to Continental, or just that our rivers dont have the amount of food in as the others.

 

It doesnt look like they are going to boom but I certainly dont think its worth taking the gamble and stocking them intentonally.

 

Quite how they affect other predaters Im not sure. Trouble is that even though I know the Zeds dissapeared from Claydon its such a strange water I could think of loads of reasons why they went. Tring still produces good pike.Tiddenfoot I ony know since the cats have been present.European waters I know are all hamered for Zeds,pike and perch by local anglers to eat and as such all have quite poor pred fishing.No leave well alone I say.

[lutra]

I mean little like under half a pound little. a 2lber is hardly a juvenile.

I have caught carp of 1/2lb, but only on waters that they have just been stocked in.

 

Any clues here?

http://www.carp-fishing-tactics.com/scienc...production.html

Do They Eat Their Own Eggs?

Many carp populations appear to be self-regulating. Adult fish in dense, highly competitive populations eat their own eggs and larvae. When adult numbers decline, the survival of young carp is greatly enhanced and a strong new generation emerges.

 

That bit makes for interesting reading, but it doesn't explain why i know so many waters (some big waters) with only a hand full of carp in them and have had for a long time.

[lutra]

Lutra,Carp breed in all waters providing they get the correct temperatures.That said even down here in the sunny south it doesnt mean they always get the correct water temperatures.

 

A bit like tench though (I dont know if carp fry stay in the weed untill they reach a certain age like tench do) carp fry/very smal carp are rarely caught.

 

Cats do breed in ths country.Ive had very little experience of the "new" UK cat waters but on the older ones such as Claydon,Tddenfoot and Rackly Ive caught kittens.

 

People are often mislead about "natural" conditons for Catfish.THey think about the sort of weather in Spain! Simply not true.Cats originate in Middle to Eastern Europe (hence their other name of Danubian Catfish) Some of these countries (like Czechoslovakia) do have quite warm summers but they are qute short and their winters longer and far colder than ours.

 

Abroad Ive caught plenty of kittens in France and I can assure you that non have been stocked in their rivers since the intial ones!

 

Cats can very quickly establish a sustainabe breeding population. Like a couple of other species if introduced into a warmer climate they can grow much qucker (try puttng a kitten in a warm water tank and see how fast it grows!)

Although ths isnt the main reason they have done so well in Spain as several parts of it that have fished do have quite cold water even in the summer due to being mountain fed)

 

You may be interested (and its quite frightening) just how few cats being introduced can result in a viable population,

in 1974 a German guy Roland Lorwkoski stocked the Ebro with 9 very smal kittens! Between then and mid 75 he introduced some more.In total only 32 fish of between 8-12"!

 

France had similar (though not quite as low) stockings in its river system as well. In fact the only European country that had "proper" stocking was Italy in its River Po.

 

But should we worry about the same happenng here in the UK? Well there have been cats in our river systems for a few years now but weve not seen anything lke what happened in Europe,As pointed out before our temperature isnt greatly different to France. I dont know if it is just the subtle dfference in our temperatures or the fact that our weather system is Oceanic as opposed to Continental, or just that our rivers dont have the amount of food in as the others.

 

It doesnt look like they are going to boom but I certainly dont think its worth taking the gamble and stocking them intentonally.

 

Quite how they affect other predaters Im not sure. Trouble is that even though I know the Zeds dissapeared from Claydon its such a strange water I could think of loads of reasons why they went. Tring still produces good pike.Tiddenfoot I ony know since the cats have been present.European waters I know are all hamered for Zeds,pike and perch by local anglers to eat and as such all have quite poor pred fishing.No leave well alone I say.

Thanks for that Budgie certainly answers the catfish bit for me.