E U. Should we stay or should we leave.

[corydoras]

That was from March 2017, before Treason May and the traitors in parliament screwed the pooch and betrayed this country. Now, I and millions like me just want out and damn the consequences.

Then I hope that you and your ilk are the ones that are to be damned.

[Anderoo]

Anyone who thinks that leaving under any circumstances on 31 October will be an end to this is living in a cartoon world.

 

Whatever happens, we've barely started. No deal is not an end to this, it's the beginning. Also, no deal is not even delivering brexit, it is a failure to deliver brexit. It is failing to do anything. It is delivering quite literally nothing, while discarding what we already have.

 

It's easy to get the country to 'pull together' - just write down how things will be better than they are now. There shouldn't be any 'price worth paying' or 'consequences' for something that's better. If you can't do that, don't expect sane people to suddenly convert to this crazy religion.

 

If it's not going to be better, don't do it. And blame the conmen who promised you the earth and delivered precisely nothing.

 

The greatest achievement of these liars is convincing you that this is what you wanted all along, while simultaneously shifting the blame for this shambles to the people who have been saying from day one that it was either impossible or undesirable.

 

PS the millennium bug was not the same as brexit, although I doubt this or anything else will change any minds: https://www.itpro.co.uk/bugs/32143/the-facts-of-the-y2k-bug-and-why-it-was-nothing-like-brexit

[gozzer]

Hi Andrew, some of the things in your post suggest that parts are directed at my last reply to you, so here goes.

 

First I don't know anyone that thinks leaving on the 31st "will be an end to this", if you think that is the general feeling, then you are listening to the wrong people. Talking of listening to the wrong people, I remember much on here, as well as in the media, quoting the "experts" on how the economy of the UK would enter recession, almost immediately after a leave result. The UK economy would fail, the risk of peace in Europe would be in jeopardy, indeed the world economy, and global peace would be put at risk, if we voted leave. This is how I understand those who compare it to the Millennium Bug scare see it, a hyped up, biased, media scare threat, that had just enough basis in reality, to convince some that it was in fact inevitable. What I didn't hear from these "experts", or indeed anyone on here, was how our future would be "better" if we remained in the EU. Sure I heard about the 'status quo', but the past strongly suggests that it's a myth, and things will change. Whether that change would be classed as "better", is open to debate. You might think that the possibility of a closer and closer integrated Europe, probably leading to a Federal union with central power in Brussels, could be classed as better, some of us don't. It's already classed by some as a "quasi-federal structure", with EU leaders expressing a desire for even closer integration, the saving grace is the fact that we did not adopt the Euro, not for lack of trying by some. Maybe you think that having the Euro would be "better"?

 

If it's not going to be better, don't do it. And blame the conmen who promised you the earth and delivered precisely nothing.

This could be easily applied to staying in the EU, is it going to be "better", long term, or are we only discussing things in the short term, like some on here do?

 

You imply that the only liars were/are in the leave camp, you must have a very short memory, or a very blinkered view if you sincerely believe that, at least this leave voter admits that both sides have lied.

 

While obviously I would much prefer leaving with a proper deal, leaving without a deal is still leaving, whether you think so or not.

I wouldn't presume to know which of the many reasons each leave voter considered prior to making their decision, so I very much doubt you know which of them caused people to vote leave. Implying that people voted the way they did because they were gullible, or insane, is hardly a constructive suggestion, although it is infinitely better than some of the juvenile rantings by some members on here. The rantings do seem to be getting stronger, more petulant, and louder the nearer we get to the 31st, the result of desperate minds perhaps?

 

John.

Edited August 15, 2019 by gozzer

[Ken L]

Then I hope that you and your ilk are the ones that are to be damned.

 

When did you become this bitter hate filled man who rants and raves, wishes strychnine poisoning upon people and then wants to condemn others to a hell that he doesn't even believe in?

 

Your Brexit derangement syndrome must be severe.

 

On a positive note, it looks like Norway is about to step back a little further from the crumbling Euro-dream, Italy is about to surge to the right, raising the possibility of Italexit, Germany is heading for recession, France is tearing itself apart and Hungarian prime minister Viktor Orbán continues to cast a long shadow.

Even if the traitors win, with a bit of luck there will soon be no EU for them to tie us to.

[big_cod]

 

When did you become this bitter hate filled man who rants and raves, wishes strychnine poisoning upon people and then wants to condemn others to a hell that he doesn't even believe in?

 

Your Brexit derangement syndrome must be severe.

 

On a positive note, it looks like Norway is about to step back a little further from the crumbling Euro-dream, Italy is about to surge to the right, raising the possibility of Italexit, Germany is heading for recession, France is tearing itself apart and Hungarian prime minister Viktor Orbán continues to cast a long shadow.

Even if the traitors win, with a bit of luck there will soon be no EU for them to tie us to.

And whats Britain !!!!! The brexit media peddling poison day after day with the EU drip fed to the population hitter did exactly the same and it backfired. Edited August 15, 2019 by big_cod

[Ken L]

Is that the same Hitler who wanted a federal Europe without borders, with a single currency, under German control?

 

[Ken L]

Breaking news:

 

I'm not claiming credit but....

But all Boris has to do is tip the wink to the appeal court judge looking at the Tilbrook case and all of the roadblocks planned by traitorous MPs and members of the HoL go bye-bye.

Edited August 15, 2019 by Ken L

[big_cod]

Breaking news:

 

 

I'm not claiming credit but....

So can you explain how Europe has never been so prosperous and at peace in the last 50 years as it is now !!! Edited August 16, 2019 by big_cod

[Ken L]

Peace - NATO.

Prosperity - Do you see all of the grand buildings of London, Vienna, Paris and other European capitals? Why is it do you suppose there's nothing like that being built now?

I grew up in Birmingham which was known as "The workshop of the world", I now live in Kidderminster which once manufactured carpets to adorn great houses around the empire. Sheffield is where stainless steel was invented and once made knives and cutlery for the world. All that is now gone, like the fishing industry that once employed thousands.

Edited August 16, 2019 by Ken L

[Mikench]

The 17+ million people who voted leave were never asked about the terms of any departure and not told about the probable consequences. The 17- million people who voted to remain will be disenfranchised by a no deal Brexit, lose jobs, and face a most uncertain future. Scotland and Northern Ireland voted to remain so will be most dischuffed when we do without a deal.

 

You can leave your wife /husband quite easily by packing a bag and leaving. However you will have to deal with the family home, the custody and access to children, the division of assets, pensions as well as the emotional and financial turmoil you will cause. People do it but it often ends in tears with children badly affected for ever. This analogy only affects you and your immediate family and not millions of people, entire countries within the union and future generations.

 

The risible comments of some about not giving a fig about leaving without a deal are beyond belief. The buffoon is in favour but then he has committed adultery, left his sick wife and doesn't know how many kids he has got. Some role model as a father let alone a PM.

 

I hope the leavers can support the remainers when we sink without trace.