[Histograms . . . ?]

Not really, I'll write something later...see if anyone else has anything to say on the subject.

 

Steve...

 

I typed into the Google 'Understanding Histograms'. A lot of stuff came up, basically it says, viewing the the camera histogram will give a good indication of exposure and colour. OK, I now understand in simple terms what a 'Histogram' is about . . . very simple terms!!! Which is 100% more than I did a few hours previously

 

So I thought, not got any pics on 'SD card' at the mo' so how about pulling a few originals out of folders and looking at them via 'levels' in Elements? Lets be fair, I suppose you need to be a bit savvy with 'levels', although I tend to really on what I see the picture is doing on screen live. It certainly helped to understand what was being said in the tutorials I looked at on the web. However, I'm still at a bit of a loss to see how one can be so sure what the histogram is conveying? it has been indicated that its 'gospel' on the exposure and colour, but is it what one wanted??? Still recon bracketing is a good answer, my old film days are dying hard or setting the exposure a tad on the negative side, thats the way in the digital world so they say?

 

Another dodge I use is when I first put the (JPG!!) picture on screen in Elements, I press the 'Auto fix tab', if it makes major changes to the picture, then I look harder, did I want the picture this way. Sunsets/sunrises are often mullered by 'auto fix', but normal subjects are treated in a more 'matter of fact' way, giving me a few clues where to go if I want, one never leave the auto fix on the picture.

 

Its all given me an insight into histograms in the camera, but I'm still not convinced I have the understanding to trust them. Be interesting to see what you have to say Steve, suspect there is going to be a RAW reference there some where, and I'v been talking out of my . . . hat! ho-humm I often do that it seems

 

SW

[Histograms . . . ?]

Is understanding the 'Histogram' the answer to properly exposed pictures?

 

Had an enforced day at home today, so looked into 'understand histograms', certainly, I now have a grasp of what the histogram is conveying, is it so transparent a guide to the exposure of the picture you have just taken???

 

SW

[Fix your monitor online]

A word of caution!!! on the 'Dead Pixel Fix'. FLASHING LIGHTS can be a problem for sufferers of Epilepsy

 

I'm no medic, but better safe than sorry.

 

SW

[Found a guide . . . ?]

I really dont think you will find a book that covers what you need, or rather as you want it written.

 

Best thing is to use google for example on "Levels" then read on that..too complicated for you then hit browsers back button and read from another tut..

 

The reason I say this here and in the other topic is because most books and online tuts will require knowledge of masks, opacity, fill, blend modes, possibly paths and channels and multiple selection techniques/knowledge, even actions and droplets, dodging and burning could be mentioned. So rather than reading a book of techniques/methods, concentrate on learning individual commands, then slowly piece together as your knowledge grows.

 

Cliff, you'll get overwhelmed if you try any other way...unless you can find this magic book and I've seen many people requesting that same book before. Concentrate on what you want to do, not what the software can.

 

You have my advice in the other topic, that still applies but if your looking to go beyond that andlearn more then google and learn about the commands under "Image/Adjustments" from within Photoshop.

 

Steve...

 

Hear what you say Steve, thanks, it makes sense . . . as I have said, "there are lecturers and there are communicators" . . . very few communicators 'Knowing' and knowing how to pass it on is a skill few have . . . Ever thought of writing a book Steve???

 

SW

[Found a guide . . . ?]

Following on from my thread, 'Need an Idiots guide'.

 

I looked in despair at the various offerings from Amazon, some had a 'look inside' option, many don't! If they wont let you at least look at the Index, one has suspicions as to the quality of text offered?

 

The fact that one is looking at a CS4 guide, seems to assume some sort of knowledge of photoshop? In my case, limited knowledge gained from 'Elements', I have seen threads recommending CS Photoshop to no 'experience photographers'. So where is the 'base guide' . . . yes I know there is a Dummies Guide, I've tried these on other applications, early days of Windows for instance, could not get on with them. I see a need for a book that starts off with basics in chapters ###, moves on to expand on the basics in chapters ###, adding the final touches in the last chapters when one has gained confidence.

 

Its an ideal world, some appear to go that way . . . ? However I found one that seem to be a possible 'Photoshop CS4 for Nature Photographers by Tim Grey'. Uninspiring tile, but as the majority of my pics are landscape, seascape sunrise or sunset type, it captured my attention. The index seems right and I liked the foreword, make an interesting read anyway, as it covers the basics of photography on the subject as well, supplied by guest authors. I suspect it will need a 'follow up' book choice on my part, hopefully I will be understanding a bit more by then, on both CS4 and landscape photography?

 

My idea is, the book will not be to intense, covering both, Photoshop and Landscape basics, breaking the ice for me on both subjects?

 

SW

[Need an 'Idiots Guide' CS4/Bridge]

Everyone likes a different method of learning, but I really liked the PhotoshopTV online videos. It's a slow way of learning, but in some respect that's good. Some don't like the advert fuelled jokey nature of the videos, but I just skip the sections I don't want to watch.

 

PhotoShop TV

 

Current episodes, and those from about 3 weeks ago are free, anything older you have to pay for. Don't worry that you've missed some, they go over the same stuff regularly.

 

 

Ye Gods mate, had a look 'Photo Shop TV', American waffle or what, does my head in . . . get to the f'ing point

 

Appreciate your suggestion Angly, but . . . they take ages to get to the point, then when there, they gable, assuming they are talking to people with the same grasp of the subject they have . . .

 

I can now see why Scott Kelby writes the way he does, this is how its done, RAW, RAW, RAW . . . donk . . . donk . . . donk . . . he! needs some lessons in comunication to us lesser mortals? There are lectureres and there are comunicators . . . ?

 

SW

[Need an 'Idiots Guide' CS4/Bridge]

I've had a look at Scott Kelby offering on the Amazon site, they let you 'look inside' at the index and a few pages of text. He launches straight into Camera to Bridge, then starts talking about RAW? . . . scary stuff . . . for me?? The style is very 'hold the hand', I'm still wary of RAW as a main medium? He does seem to go into JPG and TIFF etc shows in the index, but not sampled in the 'look inside' pages.

 

Then again looked inside a couple of others, equally . . . or more scary!!!

 

I'll think on it . . . its got to be a book as a screen partner (Bible) but which one?

 

SW

[Need an 'Idiots Guide' CS4/Bridge]

Thanks Steve, as you say, a lot of basics is covered by my use of 'Elements', however there is greater depth in CS4 and knowing where to set a number or level, I find daunting. The other problem is 'layers' . . . ???? O'boy Never have got my head around this one, which means many of the tools are a mystery to me.

 

Fortunately, I go along with your philosophy of 'get it right in the camera'. I'm learning, these days one is much happier with what comes out, I still crop and adjust a bit on occasions, but compared with the early days . . . !! Level horizon? can be a problem, don't use a tripod much . . . still a 'have camera will travel type', take the opportunity when it presents, this means dragging a tripod around can be a pain, the lined grid in the viewfinder helps . . . sometimes

 

I do find the 'play' element with any photo prosess program, a bit pointless, grumpy old sod that I am, get serious 'Victor Meldrew syndron', probably because I dont understand layers??? and cant join in

 

So onwards and upwards . . .

 

SW

[Need an 'Idiots Guide' CS4/Bridge]

OK, I now have a copy of 'CS4+Bridge', so all my possible needs can be met in the world of photo manipulation???? My problem is, having looked at it, compared it with 'Elements v7', it like a Ford 'v' a Roller, both have 4 wheels, steering wheel and engine, they both do the same job, but at the moment, I sort of understand the Ford, the Roller . . . where the 'f***in h*ll'!!!! do you start.

 

My 'Elements 7' (Ford Escort version ), is nice and easy, does far more than I have needed up to now. The 'CS4/Bridge' (Silver Shadow ), needs to be explained, its got the functions I'm used to with knobs on, plus a lot more besides, where do you put the ignition key!!!

 

For 'simple, quick and now', its still going to be 'Ev7', but as time goes by, I need to be able to unravel the hidden depths of CS4. I dont have the attention span, available time or desire to do more than short stints when I'm in the mood . . . I'm in no hurry?

 

So, advise, and where to look for a good idiots guide? . . . please

 

Any suggestions, SW

[POTM February '09]

Do we get to see how the voting is going or is it a suprise?

 

SW

[Ready to have a bash at RAW processing!]

I am inclined to agree. I got a Cannon 400D last year, my first digital SLR, & have been having a go processing RAW files lately using the software which came with the camera,Photo Professional it's called.

All I seem to end up doing to the RAW files most of the time is tweaking the brightness & contrast if needed which you can do in any basic software with jpegs. Sometimes I play around with the white balance etc, on photos that were probably quite acceptable any way.

I find even PS Elements I don't use half it's capability. I am far from being an expert, but to me photographs are about capturing the moment & I try to rely on the settings on the actual camera to get the picture I want. A lot of times it's the composure that makes a good photo.

 

" . . . I was much happier in the days of 6mp's!!!! wow . . . and 'Adobe Photodelux' (hold your hand fore runner of Elements)."

 

Hay, a man who understands where 'I'm coming from'. RAW and manipulation seems, so often, to be for the 'artistic birds', I'm not into fiddling a £arting about. Nature and the moment does it for me, just need a little adjustment when the camera . . . mmmm; OK, when I get the settings wrong. All this messing about to get a picture that you did not take . . . not for me.

 

The point with RAW is the zero loss factor, regardless of how many changes you make (which has never been convincingly demonstrated to me in practical terms) . . . the jury is still out, but RAW as a virgin archive special picture store seems to be a good idea, stored on an external hard drive. Large capacity drives are very cheap these days, I have a Matrox 500gb cost £65, I think one double that capacity can now be had at a similar figure? Its then a question, will you ever need the pictures in the archive . . . ?

 

SW

[Ready to have a bash at RAW processing!]

Keep chucking the ideas in team God loves a trier

 

John

 

I tell you what Snatcher, I'm destined for 'hell and damnation', I've given up trying with RAW, and I had mine working!!! I've been thrown a life line by a friend . . . but will it convince me . . . we will see?

 

I'm like you where computers are converted, a complete technophobe, I'm of the opinion its the computer and its quirky language we need to understand first???

 

I'm on the point of baking out completely where 'techie' stuff is required. I was much happier in the days of 6mp's!!!! wow . . . and 'Adobe Photodelux' (hold your hand fore runner of Elements). RAW . . . who needs it . . . pros, and those with aspirations?

 

All I see on other sites (not this one!) are people trying to impress each other, with the latest and greatest whizz-bang-whoosh, with how much it costs . . . and how much better it is than the now superseded yesterdays technology that was last months must have Perhaps it my total lack of ambition these days, I'm better of with the camera set on 'auto P' in JPG, done OK up to now. Go fishing, on my slooooow fishing boat, basic diesel/shaft drive, no complications . . . simple life life in the fast lane? nah

 

Mmmm . . . thats a RANT ain't it Might have something to do with my right shoulder giving me extreme 'GIP'!!! and I have no idea why, its the docs in the morning for me, had to come home early, could not drive safly any more, its so bad!!!!

 

SW

[And there is more . . .]

I get a lot of opportunity on my fishing trips afloat to be a little different, Saturday was a day out on my mates luxury 52ft sailing catch, we had a great day, fish, tea, bacon rolls and his partner did the most superb home made pizza . . . O'yes, and I managed a few pictures of the morning and evening sun:

 

Heading out to sea, past Felixstowe docks, about 6.50am, it was to get better

 

As I said, it gets better

 

Last of the sunrise, I love the sky

 

A simple sunset, lovely colours

 

Heading West and home

 

. . . . and!!! we caught some fish, the codling (left? ) is about 5-6lb, thats an 11lb spurdog (Rock Salmon in the chippy) beautiful eating

 

Used the Sigma 10-20 all day, great for this type of work, however, its not so good when there is a speeding and impressive looking boat traveling by, need to take the long lens as well next time. Enjoy, coments???

 

SW

[30%?]

Been looking at other sites and they indicate, unless its 'April fool', looks like camera and lenses are going up on 1st April by a massive 30% I understand why it might be so, but that realy is an 'out of court' hike. Wages going down, product going up!!! and thats not only luxury goods, Hazel came home this evening, she looked in the butchers to day, for a pork joint for the weekend, normaly £4, £4.50, they want £7!!! Its, chicken, sausage, mince, and imported frozen meat from now on, buy British? . . . cant afford British Mr Brown! and certainly wont be even considering any aditional photo kit for a long time to come. Thank goodness I bought the 10-20 recently.

 

SW

[Check your filters . . . ?]

Out yesterday with the Sigma 10-12, very bright, low winter sun. I was not happy with the results, compared with the previous outing, although the conditions were totally different. It was also interesting to have Hazels D40X/18-70 pictures to compare with, as well as my own 70-300 shots in the Docks.

 

Camera menu settings needed tweaking? They have been OK until recently pre 10-20? Even with menu tweaking, I was not happy . . . what other variables?

 

The only other change is UV filter . . . naaa!!! . . . ?

 

Its a known name . . . a series of shots later, the 'Kenko' UV filter puts a haze over the picture when compared to 'no filter', grabbed a 'Seagull' UV jobie, much better, there is a change but minimal in my humble opinion?

 

Kenco UV

Seagull UV

No UV filter

 

Place the two filters on a sheet of white paper, there is a distinct yellow/grey tinge to the Kenko, this compared to the Seagulls hint of pink. Both colourings are of the lightest huge, almost undetectable.

 

Comparing the above samples, the Seagull is almost like putting a polarising filter on if you look at the glass in the green house and the heightening of colour. Final testing will be on a sunny day, but its obviouse I've got a lot more to com from my 10-20. Have to hunt a Hoya 77mm UV/Sky? down, although I think the Seagull works OK?? Both comparison lenses yesterday had 'Sky' filters by Hama and Hoya. Just shows, cant take anything for granted.

 

SW

[Valentines Day Walk . . . with suprises]

well done SW, like the one of the bird flying into the wheelhouse. LOL

 

So it looks on the cards that we will be getting a new AN photographer, registration is easy tell her.

 

 

Cheers Fred

 

 

I doubt Hazel will ever get to computering?? . . . I thought she would not get into 'picture taking' . . . so what do I know??? She will pick a fishing rod up . . . put her own bait on! . . . Her sisters are on line in Hartlepool mmmm

 

SW

[Valentines Day Walk . . . with suprises]

Hazel and I have spent this 'Valentines day' afternoon wandering around Felixstowe, cameras in hand, hosing away, the dog too enjoyed it, doing his own kind of 'hosing' Weather was warm, for the time of year, sun stark, hard light, but beggers cant be choosers. I have already waxed lyrical about the Sigma 10-20, but to day, I had a couple of surprises awaiting me. The first was Hazels efforts, only here second outing with the D40X, in fact only here second outing with any sort of proper camera, she only took a dozen shots, but? . . . well here are a couple of samples:

 

 

 

Lots to learn, no prompting from me, for a second outing, I think thats pretty dam good!

 

The other surprise, we went to the Dock viewing area. I put on the 'Sigma 70-300mm APO HSM' lens, a few long shots were in order. I had the Mono pod, hosed away happily, the results are in my humble opinion stunning . . . not from the picture/composition point of view, thats my usual average to get lucky sometimes level. No, its the quality of the image, this is a £135 budget telephoto, purchased new a few Moths ago:

 

1

2

3

4

 

If you are on a budget, in the market for a 300mm lens, this one is going to take some betting on quality and price? The motor focusing is fast-fast! quiet, handling and balance was perfect, taken with a mono pod . . . what could be achieved on a tripod, remote shutter and mirror lock!

 

I have PS all these shots a little, but only a little, (they did not need much) both mine and Hazels.

 

The days going to be rounded off with gammon steak and pineapple for dinner, a glass of wine, what a great day

 

I hope you enjoy the pictures as much as we enjoyed out day taking them

 

SW

[Sigma 12-24mm Test Shots]

Just picked up my Sigma 12-24mm this morning, so thought I'd go for a walk about the town and get a few test shots done, to see how good it was / wasn't.

 

Seems pretty good with a little bit of softness in the extreme corners, but not sure if that's more down to the distortion. Pretty sharp everywhere else. The angle of view on fullframe is superb and really looking forward to using it for seascapes and maybe some star trails, although at 12mm I'd probably need a few hours of shots to stack to get any decent trail.

 

 

 

 

 

Dont you just love wide angle . . . Started playing with 'destortion corection' this week in Elements 7, its something else.

 

SW

[Camera gear and gadgets price rise.]

Been eyeing up the D300 and 18-200 zoom combo but decided against it at the moment as both the camera and lens have put on almost 100 quid each!

 

Wish i'd realised the price rise was coming as i'd have bought all the gear before xmas with money earmarked for other things as a temporary measure as in the long run it'd have saved me around 350 quid i reckon.

 

Question for you........what do people think of this refurbished stuff that floats around from what appear to be reputable dealerships? Is it worth having a look as a brief look at ebay through up a D300 body at 800 quid refurbished with a years warranty.

 

I'm in no rush and the credit crunch is making the sale of the items i have to fund the camera purchase slow anyway (an omega james bond, an omega seamaster and a tag formula1(all brand new and unworn)) so happy for now to sit and wait. I may even consider an eos 40D and lenses as i'm thinking with my lack of expertise i'm unlikely to know the difference but the canon package does look good value.

 

I could really do with some input on this guys!!!! *****grovels and asks nicely*****

 

 

As far as new on eBay is concerned, I have recently been looking for a lens. Wow!! found one at £280 then you look at the p&p £50!!!! which brings it up to the standard or more than I could get it at the local photo shop. My feeling on eBay is 'buyer be very awar' on items that are techie, expensive and might just need the 'Gtee' at some time???

 

As far as referb gear is concerned, I went this rout 12 months ago with a Nikon D80 Never again, the white ballance was way off, took it back, give the shope credit, no fuss, changed it for a new one, although I had to cough up the extra . . . is it ruse I ask???

 

I did find my lense, in a UK shop, used, with 3 months 'Gtee', £249 +£8 p&p, it pays to scour the magazines, magnifying glass essential Equaly, fleeBay have provided filters, batteries and the like at good prices, non technical, simple to post from USA or Honkong.

 

pays your money . . . etc. SW

[Ready to have a bash at RAW processing!]

Means nothing to an old techniphobe !!! Young man!

 

I was hoping one of the techies on sit would pick up on this mate. It seems that RAW comes in all shapes and sizes according to make and model of camera. So, Canon produce a new camera model with new RAW software . . . PhotoShop a couple of years old not compatable with the new Canon camera. Not a disaster as Adobe do produce patches (updates, eventualy) to cover the new cameras, look on the Adobe site for updates to your prgoram, they will also list camers covered.

 

This is what I suspect is the case with your camera? Although I dont know the vintage of your CS program, or how new the camera software is, hence, the heads up coment with '??' It may not even be the above, I might be ****ing in the wind

 

Two old techniphobes together I'm afraid mate . . . been trying to drag me-myself into the 21st centuary for a long time . . . I dont realy wana go! but there seems little option, I do like it when I get it right though

 

Out for a Valentines (holding hands ) walk this morning along the sea front and walking area for the dog, weather is very nice here, light will be a bit 'hard' but we will take the cameras, might get a photo oportunity or three Watch this space . . .

 

SW

[Ready to have a bash at RAW processing!]

Will give it a go over the weekend Colin. Also just took a picture in raw and went to download it to the hard drive and got the message file in incorrect format!!

 

Oh dear have not even got out of the stable door and fell off. God loves a trier though :rolleyes:

 

John

 

New camera, old program?????

[A study in red . . .]

well done mate really like the barge shot.

 

Cheers fred

 

The angle on the barge was a bonus, I was invited onboard the lightship. The barge is directly behind!

 

SW

[Reflections . . .]

OK, I will have a look at CS2 at the weekend, see what I can make of it? Bridge . . . mmmmm????

 

SW

[A study in red . . .]

Grabed a camera as I went out of the door this morning, floods? thought I might get a chance of an interesting photo or three Well, the weather was *rap, light was flat as a 'Witches ***'. I was parked up waiting for a job. Just around the corner is the river and the old Colchester comercial quey. A few boats moored up might get something? Plus I had grabed the D40X, only used it once last year when I bought it to test it out, so I had no real idea what to expect.

 

There is a refurbished lightship, used by the Sea Cadets. As I say, rubbish light, cold, grey, uninspiring. When I got home and poped the SD card in the 'putter card reader', I was impressed, this is an entry level body fitted with my old 18-70mm Nikon kit lens, light yet positive, a dream to handle, and, IMHO, they are some pritty well saturated, detailed, sharp pictures of the red light ship, wish I had taken some more angles? Even the barge 'Fountain' is trying, but I think it demonstrates how flat the light is. More pics when the light is better me thinks.

 

Again, very little 'PS Elements', just enough to lift them a tad:

 

 

 

 

Luton Airport tomorrow,

 

SW

[Reflections . . .]

But you could still take photos in "RAW +JPEG", so at a later date you have that availability if needed, which is what I said right at the beggining of your RAW adventure.

 

Steve...

 

Thanks Steve, yes you are right, feeling a bit at the moment, frustration with life, I want to get on with it! . . . There is no reason why I should not take JPG+RAW and just file the RAW for the future. Its simply the matter of sorting and filling each individual RAW pic. The camera seems not to present a set of JPG's with a set of seperated RAW's, it presents JPG+RAW, JPG+RAW . . . etc. Do you know of a way that I can batch sort with the computer? Sounds lazey . . . yes, its is I supose, perhaps I'm missing a trick? or the program makers are, a gap in the market???

 

The 'Lobster Pot' pic., colour wise, is, prity well, as it came out of the camera, I think I upped the contrast a tad, with a hint of un sharp, but both were used very sparingly, infact, I'm finding the Sigma 10-20 often does not need any sparpening. The majour 'PS-Elements' work was on destortion, to streighten things up. Can we use destortion corection in competition photos Steve?

 

SW