Steve Walker
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Posts posted by Steve Walker
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You appear to have a particular and specific hatred for Islam. You fear that Muslims are going to enact the ludicrous bits of their scripture in ways you dont fear Christians will.
People used to believe absurdities of Jews.
Anyway, I think I am done with this. We seem to have wandered a long way off topic, which was ordinary men women and children being murdered by someone who was so blinded by hatred that he was unable to see through their religion to their humanity.
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The Muslims I know are no more likely to do that than my mother is to commit genocide or smash infants brains out.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/6120373/Top-10-worst-Bible-passages.html
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The question is about personal behaviour and what the scripture says, not who has sympathy for what or what they would like the law to be.
They are required by their own religion to obey the law unless in doing so they sin.
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Depends on the conflict and whether obeying the law would mean that they personally were in sin. In that situation, they have to conscientiously object. I am not aware of any such cases, though. They are not obliged to stop others sinning.
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The Soviets and Yanks are waging a proxy war here?
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And your explanation for those complex bits of history is that Muslims are bad people?
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Absolutely.
I'm quite shocked by the question, to be honest.
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In the same way, I'm not sure what mum does at church, but I've seen her wearing mixed fabrics and I haven't caught her burning any witches recently.
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And where exactly do you draw the line between the two given that all of the structuring society and aggressively spreading the faith stuff was codified by Mohammed during his time in Medina and if fully incorporated into both the Quran and the Sunnah.
They also codified the obligation to obey the laws of the land in which one lives.
All the Muslims I know seem to manage to muddle along reconciling their faith with not overthrowing secular democracy.
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Islamism is a political ideology based around structuring a society and its governance on Islamic principles. Islam is a religion. Muslims are people. I find that easy to differentiate. We are a secular democracy in which live many people of different faiths and none, all of whom are equal under the law. There is no room for Islamism here.
I'd happily get rid of all the faith schools, and not especially because of the Islamic ones. I think that might be easier said than done, though, and I think the real religious fundies of whatever creed will just home educate, which might actually make matters worse. I'd also be happy to lose homeschooling, but that would be highly contentious.
Not sure that these, nor any of the other points, would address John's concerns about the nature of neighbourhoods changing with demographic change.
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Does anybody defend "Islamism"? That is not the same as "having Muslims living in the UK".
Anyway.
Ken, John - the only way forward I see is that we make sure that the laws of the country are applied without fear or favour, and we all learn to live together.
Do you have a better solution?
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The answer to that kind of harassment is fair and equal application of our laws. Not shooting up a mosque, or supporting hatred.
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Hmm, but those Muslim families in Leeds are British citizens subject to British laws and they buy or rent their land. They haven't turned up, slaughtered the natives and stolen their lands. I don't think it's the same thing at all. I don't think the issue in the US and Australia was really the acceptance of living side by side with people with different ways of life so much as the genocide.
If someone is brown, and wears different clothes to me, and doesn't consume pork or alcohol, and goes to a mosque instead of a church, they're not dictating anything to me.
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So you are saying that because some 'entrepreneur' decides to buy up an area, and tries and push the locals out for profit, it's ok, accept it, that's life. That the situation is the same as when thousands of immigrants descend on an area and spread into all surrounding areas, usually bringing the house values down. It's tantamount to being invaded. The long term locals find that their whole lifestyle is completely changed, the pubs and clubs, the shops, the entertainment, everything is either gone, or changed. They have to adapt to suit those that move into the area, instead of the newcomers adapting to suit their adopted country. You think that's ok, and they shouldn't worry or react?
I'm guessing that you've never been in that position, or if you have, you've been in a position to move.
John, I'm just saying that places change, it's always been the way of the world and always will be. Different groups move in and out. Ways of life change. People are basically the same.
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John, yes, it was satire, but made a serious point about those who stir up hatred and then act as if they had nothing to do with the results.
Communities change. It happens even without international migration. People in London get upset when their neighbourhood goes up market and gets infested first with hipsters, then with rich people. Often displacing ethnic minority communities, who in turn had displaced white working class communities. Locals in Cumbria moan about offcomers and pensioners pricing their kids out of the market. Changes in local industry lead to villages becoming dormitories for city workers. Young people dont go to church, or the local post office, or the pub, things change, older people moan about it.
Meanwhile, people, who basically all want to live their lives, raise their families, make their living, go on doing so.
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John, I wasnt implying anything, I was asking what you feared about those populations. People fear all sorts of things, some real and some imagined. Sometimes they just fear change. What I was getting at is that those fears can initiate and feed hatred.
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Hatred is rooted in fear. What do you fear?Ah, we differ slightly on this. I see a difference between hatred and fear. I fear for the future of my kids and grand kids when I travel a few miles down the road, and see how immigration has changed the entire area. Not just culturally, but every aspect of life in the area.
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Indeed. And those preaching hatred and fear of immigrants and Muslims should be painted with the same brush as those preaching Jihad.
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True. The trouble is that they now have online echo chambers to bounce their hatred back and forth, and people who are only too willing to legitimise their views in public discourse.
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But ordinary Muslims no more live by the sword than you or I.
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John, they get so sick and twisted when people fill their hearts with hatred.
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If those kids lived by the sword because of what people the same colour or religion do, I guess that's all of us?As Ken hints those that live by the sword die by the sword
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Appalling. Cold blooded murder of men, women and children. The people who radicalised these criminals with their hate-ridden far right ideology bear a share of the blame.
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We know what's on the table now. Simple question, we've done our best and this is what you can have, do you still want it? If we say yes, fine, do it.
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Hemp and tares for roach in summer
in Coarse Fishing
Posted
We had one summer when I was a teenager when we absolutely murdered the roach in the park lake on hemp and tares. We fished short poles to hand using tiny pole floats with spherical bodies and cane stems and just a few #10 down the line. Bites were on the drop and often hooked themselves against the elastic. The fish were a better stamp than we got on maggot.
Never fished it since!