Working with Foreign Beamers

[wurzel]

QUOTE(wurzel @ May 10 2006, 09:04 PM)

Carful Seavey you'll blow a gasket.

 

 

In this area we have to live with the Euopean beamer fleet, which at the moment are working hard along the six mile , reports of seven large boats working in one small area a bit further south , and about the same amount working just north of us off Lowestoft ,and thee or four in between, been much the same for the last 30 odd years, they don't seem to have had much effect on our catches , after a slow start the fishing is now as good as ever.

 

Just had a thought, If the local FC was made up of just anglers, in fact if anglers were running the country and Nigel was primeminister , it would not make the slightest difference to the activities of the beamer fleet.

Hello Ian

 

 

 

 

Dont worry wurzel me old matey, i do have a few leaks in the old gasket but it has'nt blown completely off yet"

 

From your post's about these foreign beamers/trawlers etc would i be right in thinking you have no beef with them fishing in our inshore 6/12 mile limit? if you do and you would like to see them gone? then atleast we have something in common mate.

 

Each day that goe's by now i feel a tendency to lean a little more to the right with my political views, life on this island is becoming very hard to live with, this government's idea's favouring imigrants/ilegal black market workers and such ( of which i have just recently personaly experienced with the loss of two of my jobs and a third of my income) is a direct result of this, its not just this country's fishing industry that is being or has been undermined and sold down the swanny its all the working class's rights to earn a livable wage across the board whatever your job is.

 

So what can be done to stop this epidemic? well co-operation between the effected people or persons would be a start ie, uk's rsa's and commercial fishermen in this instance do you agree? i have read a lot of your posts on here and at times you have had some valid points but they never offer any real solutions only answers like" there is nothing wrong and leave us alone, if you came up with an creditable idea or proposal to put to the powers that be to oust all foreign fishing vessles out of our inshore 12 mile limit and stop the over fishing within it, then i am sure a lot of the rsa's in this country would give it backing ( i would) so over to you, or are you perfectly happy with things realy and you dont care how many foreigners come here in their beamers etc, taking what they want when they want and you having to stick to your rediculous quota's?

 

ps. if anyone thinks i have lost the plot then i suggest they open there eyes, it wont be long before i" and a lot of other manual working class people in this country will have no jobs to go to, as i have said before i have no political aspirations and seek no financial avantages, i am just a ordinary english manual working class bloke who is tired of being shyte on.........

 

 

 

--------------------

 

I Fish For Sport Not Me Belly

[wurzel]

Hello Stavey

 

I thought this would be better answered on its own thread as it is getting away from the Scottish RSA theme.

 

 

Quote

 

From your post's about these foreign beamers/trawlers etc would I be right in thinking you have no beef with them fishing in our inshore 6/12 mile limit? If you do and you would like to see them gone? Then at least we have something in common mate.

 

 

We have worked along side the beamers for years, there are not so many now as there was a few years ago, although it seems that the whole fleet is working along our 6 mile limit at the moment, this is normal for this time of year as the fishing is very good here at this time of year, next month when the water clears up and the may weed shows they will disperse, some due to the high fuel cost might even tie up for a spell.

 

Despite years of constant pressure from these large powerful ships that catch more in one month than I can in a year the Dover sole fishing is as good as ever so are they over fishing or just fishing?

 

What I do agree with you Stavey is the unfair balance of quota or fishing opportunities that are a direct result of the common fisheries policy or more like the mishandling of it by our politicians and managers, as you say similar instances are becoming more apparent in other areas that affect our lives that also come from EU directives.

 

What is to be done about it I don’t know, I have been trying to get a fair deal, or more like trying to stop the deal we had from disappearing like water through a siv for a couple of years now, I failed miserably, now I am just fed up with the whole issue of fishery management And can’t be bothered with it any more.

I was contacted by the Marine Stewardship Council last week, they are very interested in my ideas to make the Thames Estuary sole fishery a sustainable fishery and want to have a meeting soon to discuses what would be involved, I am wondering whether its worth the hassle and time involved, DEFRA won’t let me fish profitably whether I am sustainable fishing or not, so what’s the point.

[stavey]

Hi wurzel, good idea to make this a seperate topic on here.

From the sounds of it then you are quite happy to let these foreign beamers operate within our coastal limits, as long as you can still make a healthy living, fair enough, your argument is that you want to make more than a healthy living but you cant because of your ever diminishing quota,s?

 

Now how can you achieve your goal? Hmmm your up against it with our government, to pressurise the eu for increased quota,s as they have probably done a deal to give them same foreign beamers in question more extra quota,s which may have been at the expence of yours? (am i on the right lines?)

 

The only chances you have got wurzel is to pressure the government in to making changes that are well supported by a large population of this country and that this support is given over the long haul, and this you will not get from just the fishing industry i am sure you know?

 

The leisure industry is huge and will continue to grow, this is where your industry could get the support needed and it just so happens that 99.9% of this forums visitors and members belong to this sector directly and indirectly, as i have said before if fishermen free'd up the the first mile or two from nets we could take you and your coleagues more seriously on conservation etc, and then maybe the fishermen would get the help and support to free up the 12 mile limit from foreign beamers, that way you wont have to worry about diminishing quota,s as our government wont have nothing to barter with, does this make any sense or am i on the wrong track? i dunno, i will bow to your superior knowledge of these things and put it back to you but i am sure you get the message.

[wurzel]

Hello Stavey

 

As from this year it is not possible to make a proper living doing the work I have been for the last 10 or so years, this is not any thing to do with a lack of fish, nothing to do with the beam trawlers or what they catch. I am just being managed off the water, for management sake, the fact that the Dutch flag ships have most of the UK sole quota does not help.

 

What you have to understand Stavey is that if there were no quotas ,no management , no interference at all we would struggle to make a living, My boat is only 10 meters, we are not in the business to make loads of money, it's a roller coaster ride of good and bad but at the end of the year you can if you work hard earn enough to get by, the situation now is impossible, we have just struggled through a bad 3 months with no earnings at all, due to constant cold ne winds it was impossible to get out most of the time when we did the ground was so stirred up and full of broken weed and crap we caught nothing, eventually things settled down and fish started to appear on the inshore grounds and get back to normal, then we get 10 days of settled weather and reasonable fishing and bang that’s it quota all gone, I am using bigger meshes, and less gear but still run out of quota, I am lucky that CEFAS have 3 more days which I am off quota on next week

Perhaps 1 or 2 days after then will have to find something else to do. mean while the beamers carry plough on with more quota than they know what to do with, most of their quota disappears up their exhaust pipes in fuel costs, this is what I get the hump about, it has nothing what so ever to do with conservation, just quota management and share out. I could see this coming 3 years ago, I've tried to work with DEFRA , I've offered alternatives, bigger meshes and getting the quota at the time we need it most, I tried reasoning with them , shaming them , in the end you end up swearing at them, it does not matter they have their good salaries and pensions all fixed , they don't care, some, like some of you are on some elusion they are on a personal crusade to stop global over fishing, I am now at the end of my tether and as far as I am concerned all personnel involved with fisheries management should be stood up against a wall and shot for treason.

 

I don't whant more, I want the same as I had befor the need to manage brigade turned up.

[Jaffa]

Hello Stavey

 

As from this year it is not possible to make a proper living doing the work I have been for the last 10 or so years, this is not any thing to do with a lack of fish, nothing to do with the beam trawlers or what they catch. I am just being managed off the water, for management sake, the fact that the Dutch flag ships have most of the UK sole quota does not help.

 

What you have to understand Stavey is that if there were no quotas ,no management , no interference at all we would struggle to make a living, My boat is only 10 meters, we are not in the business to make loads of money, it's a roller coaster ride of good and bad but at the end of the year you can if you work hard earn enough to get by, the situation now is impossible, we have just struggled through a bad 3 months with no earnings at all, due to constant cold ne winds it was impossible to get out most of the time when we did the ground was so stirred up and full of broken weed and crap we caught nothing, eventually things settled down and fish started to appear on the inshore grounds and get back to normal, then we get 10 days of settled weather and reasonable fishing and bang that’s it quota all gone, I am using bigger meshes, and less gear but still run out of quota, I am lucky that CEFAS have 3 more days which I am off quota on next week

Perhaps 1 or 2 days after then will have to find something else to do. mean while the beamers carry plough on with more quota than they know what to do with, most of their quota disappears up their exhaust pipes in fuel costs, this is what I get the hump about, it has nothing what so ever to do with conservation, just quota management and share out. I could see this coming 3 years ago, I've tried to work with DEFRA , I've offered alternatives, bigger meshes and getting the quota at the time we need it most, I tried reasoning with them , shaming them , in the end you end up swearing at them, it does not matter they have their good salaries and pensions all fixed , they don't care, some, like some of you are on some elusion they are on a personal crusade to stop global over fishing, I am now at the end of my tether and as far as I am concerned all personnel involved with fisheries management should be stood up against a wall and shot for treason.

 

I don't whant more, I want the same as I had befor the need to manage brigade turned up.

 

Some random true (?) observations:

 

The Ling Bank ( one of the most important North Sea grounds) was for years put in the wrong ices box, simply because someone had made a mistake in the lates 60's/early 70's.

 

The seal issue was, despite all the scientific evidence in favour of culling, decided by short term political objectives.

 

The best idea for working out what a pelagic tankship was carrying, was worked out on the back of a fag packet and was simple and worked for years. Heaven knows how we have reached the stage where huge police /media operations are needed (often years after the event) to run the pelagic sector.

 

The lunatics have taken control

Edited May 12, 2006 by Jaffa

[stavey]

Hello Stavey

 

As from this year it is not possible to make a proper living doing the work I have been for the last 10 or so years, this is not any thing to do with a lack of fish, nothing to do with the beam trawlers or what they catch. I am just being managed off the water, for management sake, the fact that the Dutch flag ships have most of the UK sole quota does not help.

 

What you have to understand Stavey is that if there were no quotas ,no management , no interference at all we would struggle to make a living, My boat is only 10 meters, we are not in the business to make loads of money, it's a roller coaster ride of good and bad but at the end of the year you can if you work hard earn enough to get by, the situation now is impossible, we have just struggled through a bad 3 months with no earnings at all, due to constant cold ne winds it was impossible to get out most of the time when we did the ground was so stirred up and full of broken weed and crap we caught nothing, eventually things settled down and fish started to appear on the inshore grounds and get back to normal, then we get 10 days of settled weather and reasonable fishing and bang that’s it quota all gone, I am using bigger meshes, and less gear but still run out of quota, I am lucky that CEFAS have 3 more days which I am off quota on next week

Perhaps 1 or 2 days after then will have to find something else to do. mean while the beamers carry plough on with more quota than they know what to do with, most of their quota disappears up their exhaust pipes in fuel costs, this is what I get the hump about, it has nothing what so ever to do with conservation, just quota management and share out. I could see this coming 3 years ago, I've tried to work with DEFRA , I've offered alternatives, bigger meshes and getting the quota at the time we need it most, I tried reasoning with them , shaming them , in the end you end up swearing at them, it does not matter they have their good salaries and pensions all fixed , they don't care, some, like some of you are on some elusion they are on a personal crusade to stop global over fishing, I am now at the end of my tether and as far as I am concerned all personnel involved with fisheries management should be stood up against a wall and shot for treason.

 

I don't whant more, I want the same as I had befor the need to manage brigade turned up.

 

I say this with a little compasion for you me old matey but it sounds like the time is up for you wurzel as regards making a genuine living from commercial fishing, maybe our government does not want a fishing industry at all? sounds like it does'nt it", i have the same problem as you (all be it a different industry) countries like spain etc will be the fishing industries of europe total, like manufacturing, we no longer have an industry here.

 

The uk will end up just a great big office from which trade is redirected to and from and any manual labour work that is done here will be carried out by immigrants imported from poor eu economic countries and one or two third world nations, no the only way your children and their children will be able to survive is to become a informational technological del boy.

 

In the short term a solution for you might be a move to rye in sussex? with their quota's being higher because of their stewardship award, but i think your a little to long in the tooth for such a drastic solution and anyway who knows how long it will be before they scrap that award and the quota's with it? your going to have to look at things in a totaly different way entirely wurzel, the leisure industry is as far as i can see your only hope in the future for you to take any participation in you using your boat and knowledge to earn a reasonable living from where you are from the sea.

 

I like you, have to change tack yet again to survive (infact i have already started you'l be surprised what rubbish people will buy on the internet ) excuse the pun, but we are all in the same boat, see ya.........

[Leon Roskilly]

One factor that has destroyed the living of more fishermen than any other is technological creep.

 

And not just fishing jobs, the number of people employed in nearly every industry has had to be scaled back drasically simply because increasing technology means that there is no need of so many factories or offices, each employing so many people, as were needed in the past.

 

It's just that the fishing industry is experiencing a rapidly growing wave of technological advancement that will inevitably decrease significantly the number of boats, and devastate the number of jobs previously needed to operate them.

 

See: http://www.anglers-net.co.uk/sacn/latest/index.php?view=574

[wurzel]

Hello Stavey

 

At least we agree on what is happening with this country.

 

 

Quote

I like you, have to change tack yet again to survive (infact i have already started you'l be surprised what rubbish people will buy on the internet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) ) excuse the pun, but we are all in the same boat, see ya.........

 

 

The only option for me is to buy some smaller bass nets and target the 2001 class of bass, I still refuse to use 90 ml but perhaps 95, because of the amount available the price won't be good, so I will need to catch plenty to make up the short fall in earnings.

 

I am not done yet, you don't make a living fishing if you give in easily.

 

Hello Leon

 

Quote

One factor that has destroyed the living of more fishermen than any other is technological creep.

 

Not in my lifetime it has not.

 

It is now not possible to earn a living sole fishing on a boat with a crew, the smaller single handed trawlers can still just about get by if they don't need much i.e. young family with a mortgage, or are looking to replace boat or engine when it's all worn out, odd bods and part timers do alright, the odd wealthy owner who fish for a paying hobby aren’t to bothered either, thing is it is illegal to go to sea single handed in Europe, they are keeping it under wraps in this country for the moment , when they decide to enforce it on us that will be the final nail in the coffin for the S E sole fishermen. With Spain waiting not so patiently in the wings with a new fleet ready to go, it does not take a lot of working out who will eventually end up with the quota.

 

.