Wreck Netters

[Toerag]

Mr. Penfold (see the 1st article) is infamous in his part of the channel for completely destroying the wreck fishing. When they find a new wreck they net it until it's completely barren, losing lots of gear in the process. I know, I've fished the wrecks he nets, and they fish a lot worse than the ones he can't net! If he spots you on a 'secret' wreck then that's it, your sport is ruined.

[stavey]

omots said; The wrecks have now had several years' rest from this type of fishing. However, there does not seem to have been an increase in cod catches from those wrecks in the years since the wreck netting finished.

 

hello old man of the sea, i suppose this may have some truth to it? given the amount of mono entombing most wrecks today. but by the fact that any fish can still be caught otherwise charters and the odd commercials would totaly disregard them, its still a good idea i think of banning fishing on some of these wrecks, there is a chance and thats all we seem to have nowadays that the fish might make a recovery or start to if we leave them alone and give them a chance dont you think?

[Old Man of the Sea]

Hi, Stavey!

I don't think that either nets or anglers’ monofilament lines stay intact very long in such an environment. When we have retrieved trawl nets, bits of gill nets, and even angling gear from wrecks, after a relatively short time - say, six months of being on the sea bed - the growth rate on them is tremendous. I would think anything on the bottom for two years or so would be hardly recognisable and probably do very little damage to the fish population in that area.

 

Nevertheless, I commend you for your attitude towards this matter, and the fact that you are prepared to forego some of your fishing areas in order to make a better future.

 

I’ve read a lot of what you and others have said recently, in the different topic threads. I think a lot of what you say makes sense. You are obviously genuinely concerned about the future of the sea, and not just concerned because you have a financial interest and/or personal agenda. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think one of your beliefs is that anglers and commercial fishermen should try and tackle this problem together. I also think that this is the only way forward. However, it seems some of the contributors to the forum appear to want every fish in the sea just for themselves – as anglers, or as charter skippers taking anglers to sea. I can’t help feeling these contributors would like to get all the commercial fishermen in the country to a meeting - and then go in like Al Capone, and annihilate them.

 

Some of the more moderate members of this forum may find that they have success with a more diplomatic approach to commercial fishermen. Our British commercial fisherman is a strange animal. For years he has been let down by one lying scumbag politician after another, since the biggest one of them all took us into Europe and gave away our rights and our industry. So naturally he is now very cautious. But, in time, forming an alliance with anglers would pay off. For both factions. And you could unite against your common enemy.

 

I don’t think the commercial fishing in the UK will completely die out, although it is on a steep slope of decline. Why? Because the politicians and DEFRA will not let it go totally under. After all, if there are no potential criminals, then the policemen will be out of a job.

 

My prediction is that anglers will have to face more and more seemingly unnecessary stupid rules and regulations in the future, just to give DEFRA lots of ‘busy work’. You may think that I am cynical, but believe me, my cynicism comes from bitter experience of being shafted – as all commercial fishermen have been in the past.

 

Maybe we should start a new thread (or a poll?), to establish the opinions of the members of the forum as to whether it is a good idea to go down the road of communication with our fellow countrymen, the commercial fishermen.

But if you go in with guns blazing, they’re going to shoot back!

 

Over to you!

[stavey]

old man of the sea, i have myself have in the past been just as anti commercial fishing industry as anyone on here and have a said a few unpleasantries towards them, i have been also very naive and sometimes immature but now i realize its part of the process of learning.

 

Take for instance what i have posted on another thread today about an illegaly set net found at my favourite angling spot, not long ago maybe only months ago i would have jumped straight in and accused the commercials, its more likely to be a local chap on the dole trying to make some beer money from the local take away or whoever and if it was a commercial it makes no difference to me now, whoever it is it is wrong and they should be punished for the crime.

 

There would be plenty of good qaulity fish for both recreational and commercial fishers if we put our heads together and work towards helping each other, my local fisheries officer only today said that they would rather concentrate more on the offshore problems and sorting johnny foreigner out than the inshore lads, he did also say both our support is very much needed, you see if we could both put our political clout together we could change things out to 12 miles not just the six and maybe put a stop to those foreign vessels who are flouting the rules all the time by lobbying (or better still employing professionals to) for more offices and fishery protection craft, lots more things could be achieved working together then there would be working apart.

 

I propose some sort of alliance to start with this may sound a bit over the top but from the feelings i have got from both sides it might be a good way of breaking the ice, come on guys as a sea angler from the uk if a punch up broke out at my local pub between uk commercials and the french commercials or spanish etc and i had to take sides i know who side i would join in on, i still have the union flag up from the olympics as curtains in the bedroom to the missuses annoyance...

[Stoaty]

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If we expect the commercials to make sacrifices then we must do the same its the benefits we have to think about that will come a little later on from such measures

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I don't expect commercials to make sacrificies. I expect the government, us ultimatly, to support them while their industry is transformed into a sustainable one.

 

quote:

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by the way stoaty do you self impose a bag limit on the so called by catch you take home to eat?

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No I do not impose a bag limit on myself. I never take home more fish than my family and a cat with an insatiable appetite for pout can eat. I never take fish for people outside my immediate family as my experience is that those that ask for a "bit a fish" usually throw it away in the end because it's not covered in breadcrumbs.

 

quote:

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they have got so much mono tangled around them now with without the need to have even more added to strangle to death what little fish are left.

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Yes for sure you get nets and mono on wrecks but as the old man of the sea says they don't last for long. We have the scientists telling us plastics last in the sea for hundreds of years. But the last time I pulled a 1970 carrier bag out the sea was in 1970. What they mean is the molecules hang around. If all the gear that gets lost off Dover breakwater was still there we would have a new reef 20' out the sea.

[big_cod]

Old man of the sea can you anser me this if ted heath had not put us in the cfp what would the cod stocks be like now ,before you give your anser as a man who seems to know a lot about the the history of commercial fishing on the east coast you know as well as me quotas were literaly pie in the sky till the last three years or so ,as to been in the cfp it wont have made a bit of difference whether we were in or not we would still be where we are now in the ****.

 

over to you?

[stavey]

Some fare comments there stoaty, i am not going to pick the bones out of them even though i could but i will say this, any net lost on any wreck even if it only lasted for a week is to long and could do so much damage it may take years for some fish stocks to recover, i cant prove that but neither can you when you say that lost nets dont last for long.

[Old Man of the Sea]

Hi Stavey,

I am in full agreement with your point of commercial fishermen and anglers trying to find common ground.

 

I am new to this forum, but my impression is that there are some genuinely concerned good people on it – and some very intelligent ones too. Do you think there is any value in finding out their views on this subject? Should another thread be opened to find this out, or is there another way?

 

Over to you!

[Old Man of the Sea]

Mister Big Cod,

Just over a year ago I was listening to a radio program. It came on just after the shipping forecast on 198 Radio 4. It was comparing the EU countries and their common fisheries policy with Norway and their fisheries policies.

 

They interviewed a representative of the Azores fishing community. He said that they had a small subsistence hand line fishery and they were afraid that the Spanish trawlers were going to go into their waters and wipe out their livelihood.

 

Then they interviewed an EU fisheries minister who talked a lot of twaddle about the CFP and “no boundaries” within the EU and how fishermen should be allowed to do what they liked, using whatever method they liked, wherever they liked.

 

Next, they interviewed a Norwegian fisheries minister, who said fish was a very important part of their economy, and that they valued their commercial fishermen as much as their fish. Therefore they worked together with their fishermen to maintain and improve their fisheries. He also said their fishermen had insisted strict rules be imposed to protect their fisheries.

 

Most countries have had problems with their fisheries, but I think the ones that are making the best job of improving their fisheries are the ones whose governments recognise the need to consult and work with the men who are doing the job.

 

You don’t have to agree with my views on Ted Heath, the EU or the CFP. But the next time you are talking to your commercial fishermen friends, ask them if they think they are valued by our government; or if they have ever been consulted about fishing policy; or if they know of any fisherman who has ever been taken notice of by our government.

 

When I first entered the fishing industry, it was an industry full of proud, decent men doing a good job – feeding the country. They were respected by the people of our land and valued in their community. They even appeared to be respected by our government. I was proud to be a part of this industry. But now it seems that commercial fishermen are considered to be social pariahs – even by some members of this forum. And the government treats them like villains – even tagging them like criminals.

 

I believe if you treat a bunch of men like criminals for long enough, and pay them no respect or heed, some of them will start acting accordingly. But if you treat them with respect, and consult them on a subject they know a lot about, then they will excel - and progress can be made by all.

 

I know that there have been commercial fishermen on relevant government committees. I have met most of these fishermen, and they all sing the same song: Yes, the government has fishermen on all the relevant committees, but their presence on such committees is just a token gesture to demonstrate political correctness. Their views are never considered, as the findings of the committees were already set in stone long before they sat down at the meeting tables.

This appears to me – and to them – to show further disrespect and contempt for them and their profession.

 

I believe in ultimate responsibility and accountability. For example, if an angler on your boat starts acting stupidly and you don’t check him, and his behaviour causes an accident, ultimately it is not the fault of the angler, it is YOUR fault. He is just acting stupidly in an unfamiliar environment. But by not taking control of the situation before any harm was done, you are to blame. As skipper, it is your job to maintain control and enforce basic safety rules; and your responsibility to keep all your customers safe.

 

Using that analogy, our government has been in control and making rules that affect our fishing industry since the 1700s. If we hadn’t entered the Common Market/EU, they probably would be getting it right about now. But Ted Heath traded our fishing industry as part of a package to gain membership to a club to which only politicians seem to want to belong. He abdicated all responsibility to look after what was then a healthy (and apparently sustainable) industry. In modern day politics, politicians don’t consider accountability for their unwise decisions to be necessary, and, as a nation, we appear to condone this belief. Nevertheless, I personally hold Ted Heath accountable for the sorry state our fisheries are in today. From the day Heath signed that dotted line, he hurt every one of us who catch fish. You included!

 

Over to you!

[Guest johnfranz]

big_cod:

Old man of the sea can you anser me this if ted heath had not put us in the cfp what would the cod stocks be like now ,before you give your anser as a man who seems to know a lot about the the history of commercial fishing on the east coast you know as well as me quotas were literaly pie in the sky till the last three years or so ,as to been in the cfp it wont have made a bit of difference whether we were in or not we would still be where we are now in the ****.

 

over to you?

No wonder old man of the sea has not come back to you on that one big cod? Bit of a hypothetical question if you ask me. Bit like saying what do you think we would be doing to day if Hitler had won the war?

Bye the way loads of tope being caught of bay, well three in the last few days. Bye a lad who never moans about his fishing just gets on with it and catches more than most.

Does nothing illegal, is just happy that he has the opportunity to get out to sea and do what he loves doing, from the comfort of his wheelchair.

Maybe we should all take a leaf out of his book and stop blaming others