Winter Warning - Part 2 (link)

[SpeciMan]

Hi everyone.

 

The last thread whilst of good debate, has gone a bit off topic from how I thought it would go and I can't seem to pull my original post and edit its title to "Yak Fishing - Alone or Not?."

 

Anyway heres the link again.

 

Dry Suits and Thermal Undersuits

 

I for one thought the comments on that thread about what people wear under drysuits were interesting - especially the ones about the Swanage dinghy sailor who despite wearing a drysuit during the warmer months got into difficulties when his boat flipped.

 

Next time I head out with Zzippy I'm going to do a controlled immersion test and see how I warm I am after being in the sea for a while. I've practiced reentrys but not treading water for any reasonable length of time with my gear on. At least then I'll know if my clothing is warm enough. I'd be interested to hear if anyone has been in the water for any length of time with their paddling gear on and how they fared.

[SpeciMan]

Great post Mike.

 

Interesting comments on 'afterdrop'. I didn't realise a cup of coffee could make it worse - I guess the key is to judge whether the indiviudal is hyperthermic or not from the symptoms you've listed.

[darnsarf]

Excellent MIke.

 

As a mountain leader I have seen cases on several occasions. On an excercise in Cyprus we lost a guy. Cyprus! i hear you say. He went down with heat stroke he was casivaked by helicopter. The crew thought it would be a good idea to leave the door open to reduce his body tempreture. The rest as they say is history.

 

The key is knowledge, equipment and planning.

[Simon Everett]

Good stuff Mike. It would be a good idea to ensure you carry one of those space blankets in your first aid kit. There is room in mine for one as they weigh nothing and take up very little space. Not much use if you are on your own - but a lifesaver if someone finds you and it - or you can save someone else from going under.

I use my dry trousers now I have some (like Mike I used to wear neoprene waders in the winter/spring - but they have too many holes to be of any use now!) and a dry cag top. Underneath I like my Helly Hansen thermals that I bought in Haugusund in the February of 1977- they are still going strong, so I think I have got my money's worth out of them. On top I wear a t, followed by a shirt and then a Musto windstopper jumper (wooly jumper with a gortex and windtex membrane in it) that Anna got off Ashbourne market for £25! Brilliant jumper. A good woolen sweater is still one of the best warmth garments made - 75 million sheep can't be wrong! Polartec fleeces are good man made alternatives,but I still prefer the natural wool. (Stand by for the jokes....)

[phooey]

Excellent MIke.

 

As a mountain leader I have seen cases on several occasions. On an excercise in Cyprus we lost a guy. Cyprus! i hear you say. He went down with heat stroke he was casivaked by helicopter. The crew thought it would be a good idea to leave the door open to reduce his body tempreture. The rest as they say is history.

 

The key is knowledge, equipment and planning.

 

What happened ?

 

He fell out ?

[darnsarf]

Phooey.

 

unfortunately, his temp was reduced too quickly. They were unable to recover his core temp and he died. Tragedy for everyone.

[fishfinder]

I get the impression that one or two of those on this thread are serving or ex serving members of the armed forces. I'm one of those too.

 

In my job, I've investigated loads of cases of climatic illness (hot & cold climates), some fatal, but most just debilitating.

 

With many of the cold related injuries, I have found that the casualty was lulled into a false sense of security because he was wearing the latest Gucci kit. For example, one individual bought himself some goretex / thinsulte lined boots, and went on patrol on the South Armagh border. He was the only one out of twelve on the same patrol who lost two toes from frostbite. The others had bog-standard Army issue boots, but relied on common sense rules instead of their kit to stay healthy.

 

Doing your immersion test sounds like a good idea to me, especially under controlled conditions with a friend. at least you'll be prepared for it when it happens for real!

[darnsarf]

You are right fishfinder. I saw several cases when the "hard man" became the victim of his own ego. Winter Junior NCO Cadres execises in Germany were a perfect example. The guys would start to believe in their own invinceability and would leave common sense at the camp gates. We would budget for 15% cold casualties. As it was carefully monitored it was as good an enviroment to teach them a lesson as could be safely designed.