Tope - result of consultation

[Ian Burrett]

Tope packs already eat everything in there path if they explode in numbers they will need culling.

 

 

steve

 

They use to say that about the Spurdog. The shark seem to do quite well for 400 million years without your interference

 

Most sharks serve as top predators at the pinnacle of the marine food pyramid, and so play a critical role in ocean ecosystems. Directly or indirectly they regulate the natural balance of these ecosystems – at all levels – and so are an integral part of them. And because they usually hunt older, weaker or sick prey, they also help to keep the prey population in good condition – healthy and strong animals are more able to reproduce and pass on their genes.

 

The effects of removing sharks from ocean ecosystems, although complex and rather unpredictable, are likely to be ecologically and economically damaging.

For example, one study showed that the removal of tiger sharks from a tropical ecosystem resulted in a decline in tuna even though tuna were not important prey for the sharks. Instead of increasing in abundance as might have been expected, the tuna declined because the tiger sharks had been keeping other tuna predators check.

[barry luxton]

Sorry Steve but in my opinion your way of the mark.

This was done by Defra as a precautionary measure to stop the tope going the same way as the spurdog and because they are worth far more to RSA than as a commercial catch. It should be celebrated.

 

Why did he deam it a requirement to legislate against the rsa in this instance. He has now created an unnessasary law that needs (policing).

Edited March 14, 2008 by barry luxton

[Guest challenge]

Have to agree with you Steve, all they have done is brought in a legislation of restriction for the rsa that was not nessesary in any event. Don't know of any rsa who have taken one home alive. I have heard in the past of guys taking one home that has died, so it hasn't gone to waste. There is still an amount that is as a commercial bycatch, add that up over a week and that is not a bad take.

Barry

I repeat the intention of the bylaw put in place in this district was to protect tope from commercial over exploitation.

A part of the bylaw states that any tope if caught, shall be returned immediately to the sea in a position as near as possible to that part of the sea from which it came.

The reason for the introduction of this bylaw was because there was a good chance that a commercial effort was about to be put into place.

the Rsa,s and the people who take them to sea where being encouraged to look at alternative fisheries in the district and with tope being one of them and the coincidental pressure at the same time from the commercial sector, some kind of enforcement was inevitable.

Regards.

[barry luxton]

Barry

I repeat the intention of the bylaw put in place in this district was to protect tope from commercial over exploitation.

A part of the bylaw states that any tope if caught, shall be returned immediately to the sea in a position as near as possible to that part of the sea from which it came.

The reason for the introduction of this bylaw was because there was a good chance that a commercial effort was about to be put into place.

the Rsa,s and the people who take them to sea where being encouraged to look at alternative fisheries in the district and with tope being one of them and the coincidental pressure at the same time from the commercial sector, some kind of enforcement was inevitable.

Regards.

Again they are legislating on a perceived threat, not one that was acutally happening? What about the rsa aspect of it. why make that a bylaw or law. It certainly wasn't required to protect the stock in any event. Don't make sence. Could they have not gone for a voluntary agreement like they do for other issues.

[Guest challenge]

Again they are legislating on a perceived threat, not one that was acutally happening? What about the rsa aspect of it. why make that a bylaw or law. It certainly wasn't required to protect the stock in any event. Don't make sence. Could they have not gone for a voluntary agreement like they do for other issues.

Ok Barry lets put it this way.

Commercial fishermen identify what could become a lucrative commercial adventure. They certainly don’t keep there ideas to themselves.

Not only the tope would suffer considerably from letting this venture go ahead, but other (rsa) etc would also suffer.

Now in order to save one fishery and the fish in it you have to bring in legislation, now if this legislation affects the angler in that he has to return something that he has returned anyway what’s your problem?

[wurzel]

Defra have just crossed the threshold and introduced compulsory catch and release without any scientific evidence regarding the affect that anglers have on the species. Now don't get me wrong, I'm I'm not suggesting that anglers should be allowed to kill anything they like, but let's have a look at the realities involved here.

 

Most anglers who fish specifically for Tope practice catch and release anyway, so the legislation wasn't really needed. Most Tope caught commercially are caught as a bycatch, and they are still going to be caught no matter what legislation Defra put in place. So just how much extra protection are Tope being given? Not very much. Let's see it for what it is. It's a preventative measure just in case someone wants to start up a targetted commercial Tope fishery in the future, and that's good, but lets not get carried away.

 

Personally, I want a hell of a lot more from my fishing than fish that are supposedly "commercially unimportant" like Tope, Mullet and Flounders, (Defra and Natural England are trying hard to palm us off with these), especially if it involves compulsory catch and release. Please, let's not give Defra the impression that they've "delivered". They've actually done nothing, (in real terms), except place un-necessary restrictions on sea anglers.

 

Well Steve you wanted more and bigger fish , they don't come much bigger than Tope.

[Ian Burrett]

Ok Barry lets put it this way.

Commercial fishermen identify what could become a lucrative commercial adventure. They certainly don’t keep there ideas to themselves.

Not only the tope would suffer considerably from letting this venture go ahead, but other (rsa) etc would also suffer.

Now in order to save one fishery and the fish in it you have to bring in legislation, now if this legislation affects the angler in that he has to return something that he has returned anyway what’s your problem?

 

History is being made here. I am agreeing with challenge LOL.

 

If you forget RSA for a minute, The legislation was brought in as a precautionary approach to protect an officially vulnerable species.

 

If you google "soupfin shark" another name of tope you will see vast populations have been seriously depleted particularly in New Zealand and the states. There is no doubt as management controls increase on the larger sharks then tope will rise in value and in ten years time we would be looking at ways to rebuild populations.

 

As tope fishing is my hobby and career i really welcome this bold move by Defra in creating Europes first recreationally only species. Hopefully the Porgie, thresher and blue will follow

[barry luxton]

Ok Barry lets put it this way.

Commercial fishermen identify what could become a lucrative commercial adventure. They certainly don’t keep there ideas to themselves.

Not only the tope would suffer considerably from letting this venture go ahead, but other (rsa) etc would also suffer.

Now in order to save one fishery and the fish in it you have to bring in legislation, now if this legislation affects the angler in that he has to return something that he has returned anyway what’s your problem?

 

Blimy. How can it be logical to bring in a law that needs policing at what cost when it is not required. Thats the problem.The rsa have always to my knowledge treated the tope as a return fish, so again why bring in a law that is not required.

[Steve Coppolo]

Sorry Steve but in my opinion your way of the mark.

 

Of course any legislation that gives some protection to Tope has to be good for the Tope, I wouldn't argue with that. The main point I was making Ian, was that Defra have imposed compulsory catch and release on anglers, with no evidence of how much of an effect they were having on the stock. The new legislation might be good as a precautionary measure, but I very much doubt whether anglers would have suddenly stopped tagging and releasing their Tope and started killing them all. It's the compulsory catch and release for no good reason that bothers me. If you think back to the consultation, there were three options and one of them was that no one would even be able to fish for Tope. With Defra's thinking, i.e, legislation for no good reason, they could easily have imposed that upon us. How well would that have gone down?

 

Well Steve you wanted more and bigger fish , they don't come much bigger than Tope.

 

Hello Peter.

Yeah but, no but, yeah but, no but,..............

 

As you might have guessed by the strong gales we've been having over the last week, my boat is finally finished and ready to go.

Edited March 14, 2008 by Steve Coppolo

[wurzel]

History is being made here. I am agreeing with challenge LOL.

 

If you forget RSA for a minute, The legislation was brought in as a precautionary approach to protect an officially vulnerable species.

 

If you google "soupfin shark" another name of tope you will see vast populations have been seriously depleted particularly in New Zealand and the states. There is no doubt as management controls increase on the larger sharks then tope will rise in value and in ten years time we would be looking at ways to rebuild populations.

 

As tope fishing is my hobby and career i really welcome this bold move by Defra in creating Europes first recreationally only species. Hopefully the Porgie, thresher and blue will follow

 

Hello Ian

 

I'm pretty sure that the Tope as we know it is not used in shark fin soup, with the amount of chinies restaurants in this country there would be much more effort on tope if it was, plus I once tried to sell a large tope to the local Chinese take away, they laughed and said it was sh#t fish and no good for soap.

 

Defra have not created Europe’s first recreation only species as the rest of Europe will still be fishing for them and the by catch limit means it will make little difference to most UK fishermen.

DEFRA were always very good at being seen to do something with out actually doing anything.

Although they've made you happy, that’s something I suppose.