Lure Anglers

[Jeremiah T. Bagwell]

Guys,

You are hearing it straight from me. I have NEVER seen this product other than on the website. I have not used it, YET. I did place a small order. Once I have used them maybe it will be time to talk business.

 

Until then, It is as my initial post stated. I think they look cool.

 

JT Bagwell

[The Diamond Geezer]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jeremiah T. Bagwell:

Guys,

You are hearing it straight from me. I have NEVER seen this product other than on the website. I have not used it, YET. I did place a small order.

Once I have used them maybe it will be time to talk business.

JT Bagwell

---

That's the way to do it!

 

DG :cool:

[Newt]

Gents - we may have run head-on into one of those cultural differences here. One where you were looking at this whole topic from a UK viewpoint, me from a US viewpoint, and neither of us knowing they were different.

 

As to posting or writing of lots of specific products or vendors, I may well have looked like I had serious stock in BassPro and Cabelas. I wish!!!

 

As to JTs article on how to get and keep sponsors - it's a topic often dealt with for folks over here wanting to get into the ranks of professional anglers. Often asked about and answered by a kindly pro who is willing to take the time. So I didn't think a thing about his article except that the advice seemed good.

 

I think the professional angling scene in the US is a bit different than in the UK. Surely, those who are good enough can and do get sponsors. And where it doesn't matter (make of boat, trolling motor, battery, pickup truck) the angler uses his sponsor's product. But on the water, they use what works and pretty much have to report truthfully what they used on a given day since not only are the boats filmed heavily but the pro in most tourney formats will have an amature in the boat with him. Said amature being assigned by a random draw so having no reason to back up a lie about which lures the angler used (or rods or line or whatever).

 

And given the fact that these guys fish from their boat with complete freedom about where in the lake or river they fish, no way to use the "I had a bad peg" excuse for poor weights. They either find and catch fish on a consistant basis or find another line of work.

 

Yes, I've seen folks come on to this and other forums and post what are basically adverts. And it offends me. But they are usually new posters who start right out touting whatever they want to sell. And some are certainly from the US.

 

But for the life of me, I can't see how the benefits to a US bass pro of posting adverts to a UK forum where there are no bass would be financially worth the time and effort. Even if JT owned the company making those lures it wouldn't be good ROI to tout them here. And he doesn't. It might be a different story if Bud Fields (who is on the pro staff for the company) did it but based on his postings on the US angling forums we have in common, he is always quick to point out which companies he is affiliated with and the only time I've seen him recommend a lure it was with an offer to mail free samples to any who were interested if they would give him feedback on how they worked.

 

None of the above is intended to suggest that US folks are above doing sneaky things because that certainly isn't the case. But I think that here JT has just done the same as I have over the years and seen something interesting then posted about it. I've just about quit doing that based on the very poor reception I've gotten and I suspect he may do the same. For me, the recent Smartcast thread was probably the last time I'll mention a product unless someone asks about it. And in case anyone wonders, I don't have any stock in Humminbird (makers of the Smartcast thing) either.

[Jeremiah T. Bagwell]

Very Well said Newt,

 

I did take some of the remarks personal but, for the most part, I am used to stuff like that. You can't please everyone all of the time and I by no means try to do that.

 

99% of the people I deal with on a daily basis are great people and just want to become better anglers. There is always someone that is a little skeptical about products that claim to catch more fish and things of that nature. That is everyones right to have differing opinions and I do not ever hold that against anyone.

 

Have a great day.

 

JT Bagwell

[The Diamond Geezer]

Stay cool, guys 'n'gals,

 

I think this is the old "Send three & fourpence, I going to a dance" syndrome .. well almost.

 

There's an old adage, to which I subscribe, that if the message is incorrectly received or misunderstood or misinterpreted, then it's the Sender who has to hold-up their hand .... and if there's an across-the-pond language/interpretation problem, then let's all be aware of it, especially the Senders.

 

I have to say, JTB, that I did have problems interpreting your posting purely at face-value but re-reading it, that was/is because of the way you came-across, I guess, with all your excitement.

 

It does make things clearer IMHO if you have actually tried something first, but if you haven't, it also makes things clearer if you say so .... meantime, send reinforcements, am going to advance

 

DG :cool:

 

Oh, and P.S., we originally sent quite a few well-spoken families over the pond to get you lot established (plus some less well-educated types too) , and look what you've done to the language! I mean, you can't even spell aluminium properly ... and you keep sending us to the bathroom when there's no bath in there ... etc etc ad infinitum ad nauseam

 

[ 11. April 2003, 12:12 PM: Message edited by: The Diamond Geezer ]

[Tim Kelly]

The Diamond Geezer:

Stay cool, guys 'n'gals,

 

I think this is the old "Send three & fourpence, I going to a dance" syndrome .. well almost.

 

There's an old adage, to which I subscribe, that if the message is incorrectly received or misunderstood, then it's the Sender who has to hold-up their hand .... and if there's an across-the-pond language/interpretation problem, then let's all be aware of it, especially the Senders.

 

I have to say, JTB, that I did have problems interpreting your posting purely at face-value but re-reading it, that was/is because of the way you came-across, I guess, with all your excitement.

 

It does make things clearer IMHO if you have actually tried something first, but if you haven't, it also makes things clearer if you say so .... meantime, send reinforcements, am going to advance    

 

DG   :cool:  

Pot, kettle, black - why do those words spring to mind?

[The Diamond Geezer]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tim Kelly

:

Pot, kettle, black - why do those words spring to mind?

---

Well, TK, those words spring to mind because they so aptly apply to you Mr as someone who's known for being in-bed with a certain company and promoting their products even though you may not have paid for them.

 

Or, in case perchance you're intimating that I'm Mr Pot, perhaps you'd like to spit it out and tell me/us, here on Elton's Forum in public, what products I have lauded or denounced that I haven't actually paid for and used .. or forever hold thy peace!

 

And what's more, people who live in grass houses, shouldn't stow thrones

 

Mr

 

[ 17. April 2003, 08:12 PM: Message edited by: The Diamond Geezer ]

[Tim Kelly]

I was referring to the part of your message where you said that if the message comes across wrong it's the messangers fault. I'm sure you occasionally try to give helpful replies but they are so masked by your "sense of humour" that they loose their point!

 

You seem to have a real bee in your bonnet if I recommend anything to people, especially if they're asking for info. I have been sent a few bits and bobs to review for the LAS magazine from Harris Angling. I have used them and decided, based on how they performed, if they are any use or not. The rods I reviewed are amazingly good, especially when you consider the price they sell for and the past history of some of the poor rods Harris used to sell. These new ones are genuinely good and I would happily use them myself. All the rods we have been sent for review have been used as prizes for LAS competitions and have been distributed to the membership.

I have been sent a number of Harris Jerkbaits too and while some have been excellent they have had a few design flaws which I have pointed out to Harris and in the review I have done for them.

I have managed to talk about all these products without ever reffering to them as the dog's bollos or any of your other crass phrases and hopefully they have been of some use to people. Opinions are just that, I am happy to offer mine to people when they ask for them, it's up to the person asking the question what weight they give to each reply.

[The Diamond Geezer]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tim Kelly

:

I have been sent a number of .. Jerkbaits .. and while some have been excellent

(dog's bollos or any other crass phrase?!

)

they have had a few design flaws which I have pointed out and in the review I have done for them... and hopefully they have been of some use to people. Opinions are just that, I am happy to offer mine to people

when they ask for them,

it's up to the person asking the question what weight they give to each reply.

---

Peter Waller:

But here in the UK we are less tolerant, far less infact, than the US re contributors plugging their sponsors' wares.

 

There have been numerous examples, over the years, of articles being put together, thinly disguised as good advice, that are blatently taking the uric out of both readers and publishers over here.

 

Unfortunately some others have gained it by pure bull s****. Their annoying plugs are then forced onto us and are, largely, not appreciated.

 

One major reel manufacturer has fallen hook line and sinker for one bloke who is no better than a good laugh. A major mail order company has been persuaded to put a very conceited and largely unpopular anglers name on their rods, more fool them!

 

These guys devalue the work of those who deserve sponsorship. The good guys, in return, add value to the product, and offer sound advice to us punters. The bad are resented in some quarters, ignored in others, but, regretfully, sometimes admired by those who don't know better.

 

When a self-opiniated, self appointed, self-publicist and conceited angler stands up and says something is great, when clearly it isn't, then the whole issue of sponsorship becomes suspect, or at least a tad annoying.

 

Advice is only seen as good when it is not tainted by self or commercial interest.

Nicely put, PW

 

 

DG :cool:

 

[ 16. April 2003, 03:16 PM: Message edited by: The Diamond Geezer ]

[Jeremiah T. Bagwell]

Easy there gentlemen,

 

Ok now that we have it established that I am not being paid by that company and I haven't even used their lures yet. What did you all think about that lure I was referring to? I personally thought it looked really good but, using it will be my true test.

 

In case you skipped past the link here it is again.

Check out the Evilution "V"

 

Have a great one guys and gals. Hopefully, misunderstandings like the one earlier don't become a standard practice. I will be more clear in future posts as to whether or not I am sponsored by a company I am making reference to, just to avoid confusion.

 

JT Bagwell