The Pro's & Cons Of Using/Not Using Groundbait.

[HERUTILUS]

Greetings Y'all,

 

I went out recently on my first coarse fishing session of the year. A lovely day it was, a bit bright perhaps for 'good fishing' but all went well until circa 10.30am. Then, a club bailiff appeared [The first time I've encountered a bailiff at any fishery.] and I got reprimanded for using grounbait. My fault it was, the club rules specifically prohibits the use of g/bait. Only one problem there, I hadn't bothered to read the rule book properly.

 

Well, sufficed to say, the bailiff & I didn't get on at all well, I believe the applicable term is 'personality clash' He kept going on about my using g/bait & I asked him what the problem was in using ground bait; he didn't know. All I could get out of him was "It's in the rules & that's it mate". He eventually went off wearing a pet-lip & came back with a committee man; he, the committee man, in complete contrast to the bailiff, was polite. He said all baits were permissible except joker, boilies & groundbait. He then said that all sizes of pellet were permissible, to which I replied along the lines of "You do realise that after about 3 hours in the water all pellets [in my opinion?] disintergrate down into groundbait. To this suggestion I was again informed "Sorry mate, groundbait is not allowed".

 

So, I here ask the Anglers Net experts the question. "Why is groundbait banned on some waters, club or commercial, & not others"?

 

Please let me know what you think, & when you're at it can someone tell me 'what joker is' and how does one go about obtaining some?

 

Regards,

 

Sir H.

[davedave]

I have always assumed groundbait is banned on some waters to help water quality but i'm not really sure. I admit these a stretch of canal near to me that nobody fishes but the rules state no groundbait, but if i think it will help my fishing i do chuck in the odd ball of crumb.

 

Tbh i rarely use groundbait, i don't find it particularly effective on the waters i fish, it's also expensive for what is glorified bread crumbs.

 

It'll be interesting to see what comes out of this post though

[Dales]

Mainly the bans are to protect the water quality, no doubt at some point one or a number of members may have "filled the venue in" and this may have led to water quality problems or a risk of it happening. The problem with most bans is that there are alternatives that work around the rule but still fit the rule book, maybe not in the spirit of the ruling but if you can use pellets and want to groundbait then fast breakdown pellets may be the way forward.

 

What sized water are we talking about? If it's a massive lake then the rule would seem a little harsh but if it's a small pond then it would seem like a sensable decision. When fishing I would think nothing of putting in 5 to 10 kilo of bait on a huge venue, but on a small water I might stick to groundbait in the feeder only but I have seen anglers ball in huge amounts of bait in to small ponds and so can see how clubs and fishery owners feel that they have to bring in certain rules.

 

Anyway, it's always a good idea to familarise yourself with a fisheries rules, there does not seem to be any one set standard from one fishery to the next. It always makes for an easier and trouble free day if you know all the does and dont's.

Edited April 11, 2011 by Dales

[Steve Walker]

Usually, rules like that come down to some grizzleguts having a bee in his bonnet about it and enough influence in the club to push it through.

 

If it were genuinely about water quality you would ban pellets and allow cereal groundbait. Breadcrumbs are about 10% protein. Pellets are more like 50%. Pellets will contribute much more nitrogen to the water column, and having a higher calorific value I would also assume that they will generate a higher biological oxygen demand.

 

"Joker" are small bloodworms - tiny bright red midge larvae found in vast numbers in the mud at the bottom of ponds. I expect the place is full of 'em.

[RUDD]

Groundbait and boilies tend to get banned incase to much/many get(s) used.

Yes there are plenty of anglers with the mind set of "Got to ball or pile it in to get a bite" when infact it is generally better to feed little and often.

 

Joker / bloodworm is generally banned as it comes from stagnated breeding ponds / streams and clubs are worried it may carry diesease.

The other reason is that in the past once bloodworm/joker is used on a water and anglers (matchmen usually) do well with it more anglers start to use it and pretty soon it can get hard to get a bite on another bait.

[Steve Walker]

When I used to fish matches, bloodworm was often banned because it was expensive (or a hassle to collect your own) and if you didn't have it, you pretty much couldn't win. I remember my mate and I claiming a moral victory in our own eyes when we came third and fourth in a club match when first and second were on bloodworm - we were kids, couldn't afford it, didn't know how to collect it (and kids probably shouldn't try).

 

I doubt that the use of it as bait has any overall impact on fish behaviour, because virtually every water in the land is naturally full of it. It is highly effective, though, and as always there will be some who don't like seeing others catch on a method they can't be bothered learning. I haven't used it for years, but on Northern canals in winter it often made the difference between catching and blanking.

[HERUTILUS]

Mainly the bans are to protect the water quality, no doubt at some point one or a number of members may have "filled the venue in" and this may have led to water quality problems or a risk of it happening. The problem with most bans is that there are alternatives that work around the rule but still fit the rule book, maybe not in the spirit of the ruling but if you can use pellets and want to groundbait then fast breakdown pellets may be the way forward.

 

What sized water are we talking about? If it's a massive lake then the rule would seem a little harsh but if it's a small pond then it would seem like a sensable decision. When fishing I would think nothing of putting in 5 to 10 kilo of bait on a huge venue, but on a small water I might stick to groundbait in the feeder only but I have seen anglers ball in huge amounts of bait in to small ponds and so can see how clubs and fishery owners feel that they have to bring in certain rules.

 

Anyway, it's always a good idea to familarise yourself with a fisheries rules, there does not seem to be any one set standard from one fishery to the next. It always makes for an easier and trouble free day if you know all the does and dont's.

 

Hello Mr Dales,

 

Thank you for your very helpful response & I respond as follows:-

 

[1] I love the comment "Members may have filled the venue in", a real classic is that.

 

[2] Yes, I probably should've read the rule book. But, the bailiff was a bit of an oaf & I just cannot stand oafs who don't say 'please or 'thank you' & then have the temerity to call me me 'mate', particularly when I cannot, for one moment, imagine having the bloke as a mate!

 

[3] Another thing that got me was when I asked him what was the problem with not using groundbait [i really didn't know until you all told me] he didn't have a clue either. If I were a bailiff [Not this lifetime if I can help it!!] I would do a bit of 'rule research' before I started putting myself about. This bloke obviously hadn't done that.

 

[4] In terms of 'size of water'. The water in question is not large at all, very small in fact, & the fishing is nowt flash either. I had a fancy that pellets, small or large, are little more than compacted ground bait. I suggested this to the bailiff & the 'committee man' but I may as well have talking to my pole case for what good it did.

 

[5] Impressed I am when you mention putting-in 5 to 10 kilo of bait into a large venue. There's some money's worth there Mr Dales, how on earth do you afford it. Hook bait on top anall, someone must have left you some gelt?

 

Anyway, thanks once again for the advice.

 

Regards,

 

Mr H

[garyb72]

The water that I fish has got this rule, but what is classed as groundbait? I was wondering if I can still create PVA sticks using stick mix for example?

 

Gary

[tony tinca]

Greetings Y'all,

 

I went out recently on my first coarse fishing session of the year. A lovely day it was, a bit bright perhaps for 'good fishing' but all went well until circa 10.30am. Then, a club bailiff appeared [The first time I've encountered a bailiff at any fishery.] and I got reprimanded for using grounbait. My fault it was, the club rules specifically prohibits the use of g/bait. Only one problem there, I hadn't bothered to read the rule book properly.

 

Well, sufficed to say, the bailiff & I didn't get on at all well, I believe the applicable term is 'personality clash' He kept going on about my using g/bait & I asked him what the problem was in using ground bait; he didn't know. All I could get out of him was "It's in the rules & that's it mate". He eventually went off wearing a pet-lip & came back with a committee man; he, the committee man, in complete contrast to the bailiff, was polite. He said all baits were permissible except joker, boilies & groundbait. He then said that all sizes of pellet were permissible, to which I replied along the lines of "You do realise that after about 3 hours in the water all pellets [in my opinion?] disintergrate down into groundbait. To this suggestion I was again informed "Sorry mate, groundbait is not allowed".

 

So, I here ask the Anglers Net experts the question. "Why is groundbait banned on some waters, club or commercial, & not others"?

 

Please let me know what you think, & when you're at it can someone tell me 'what joker is' and how does one go about obtaining some?

 

Regards,

 

Sir H.

 

Its hard to believe the rules that fisheries come up with , your probebly allowed to shovel in as much luncheon meat and or high oil pellets as you like and these can do an incredible amount of damage to water quality .

What fisheries should to do is check the quantities of baits that anglers are carrying before they start fishing to put a stop to the small number of misinformed anglers that pile to much in and create these bans that effect the rest of us competant anglers that feed the neccessary amounts

[Dales]

[2]But, the bailiff was a bit of an oaf & I just cannot stand oafs who don't say 'please or 'thank you' & then have the temerity to call me me 'mate', particularly when I cannot, for one moment, imagine having the bloke as a mate!

 

So true, it does not take much effort to be civil, but I think the "power" does go the heads of some types who become bailiffs I think they are the sort that sign up as a bailif or committee member more for admin and authority that goes woith the posts more then for the love of fishing and give all the good ones a bad name.

 

[3] If I were a bailiff [Not this lifetime if I can help it!!] I would do a bit of 'rule research' before I started putting myself about. This bloke obviously hadn't done that.

 

It would make sense to at least be able to back up the rules with some sort of theory, even if we did not agree with it we could at least understand where they are coming from with the idea. I think Steve Walker was spot on in his post and some times it is the views of a few that carry all the weight in decision making.

 

Usually, rules like that come down to some grizzleguts having a bee in his bonnet about it and enough influence in the club to push it through.

 

 

 

[4] In terms of 'size of water'. The water in question is not large at all, very small in fact,

 

That might help explain why they have the ban, but then a rule of groundbait in feeders only might be more appropriate. But then again that is open to interpretation. One anglers groundbait in feeder might be a small cage feeder and anothers might be a method ball the size of a football

 

[5] Impressed I am when you mention putting-in 5 to 10 kilo of bait into a large venue. There's some money's worth there Mr Dales, how on earth do you afford it. Hook bait on top anall, someone must have left you some gelt?

 

I tend to bulk buy my bait from pet and animal food merchants and often pop in to pound shops. I love there betaine pellets at a pound a pop and clear the shelves when they are in stock. But the bait bill can get a little big at times It's just aswell that some times I just fish single hook baits. It's just a case of making a judgement call depending on the method, species and venue I am fishing.