Sea Angling Guide

[glennk]

I think I have asked this question before on here but I cant remember the answer.

 

Are there many sea angling guides around the UK and how do they manage to run a guiding business under the strict health and safety laws we have in todays blaim and claim culture.

 

Can you get insurances or valid disclaimers for taking people out onto the rocks and beaches ??

[Norm B]

I think I have asked this question before on here but I cant remember the answer.

 

Are there many sea angling guides around the UK and how do they manage to run a guiding business under the strict health and safety laws we have in todays blaim and claim culture.

 

Can you get insurances or valid disclaimers for taking people out onto the rocks and beaches ??

I know of a couple of shore angling guiding services but I don't know of the technical bits like insurance etc.

[fishyrob]

I think I have asked this question before on here but I cant remember the answer.

 

Are there many sea angling guides around the UK and how do they manage to run a guiding business under the strict health and safety laws we have in todays blaim and claim culture.

 

Can you get insurances or valid disclaimers for taking people out onto the rocks and beaches ??

 

 

Hi Glenn. A few things you should know about guiding........

 

1) You make very little money. If I get eight sessions a month, its been a VERY good month, and I live in a high tourist area.

 

2) Make sure you have some quality fishing available. Newbies especially wont appreciate your instruction without a result at the end of it. With this in mind, it is essential to be knowledgable and honest about the fishing at the time of the planned session.

 

3) H & S. Explain that fishing is britains most dangerous participant sport. Take a recognised first aid course ( I did the St JOhns session. Not terribly expensive and the certificate lasts three years), carry a first aid kit and make sure you point out the specific dangers of any chosen mark.

 

4) Insurance - Rocks........... The first year I did it I took out a generic insurance aimed at the freshwater guide, less than £200 and I was well chuffed. Until I read the small print, which specifically excludes rocks and most saltwater shore fishing situations. I then tried to get a policy tailored for me, but when I outlined some of the areas I wish to take my clients, no insurance company were interested. It is much easier to get insurance for taking people out on boats, so Kayak guiding might be a better angle. I have never heard of a Kayak fishing guide, so I reckon your best bet might be to get in some spare Yaks, and give the ebenefit of your experience there. ITs such a new but RAPIDLY growing sport, that I really wish I could swim, as I reckon thats the way I would go. You can get guided Kayak fishing in Alaska and Canada. Nowadays I explain to the customers that I am a guide, I can take them to some good fishing, I can advise them on their safety, but I completely refuse responsibility for their safety. If they arent happy with that, I recomend we fish on the local marina, which is paid for and insurance cover is granted as part of the ticket sale. I've only ever had one customer ay "no, lets not go on the rocks" and I think that was mostly because he was elderly........!

 

5) When your customers have caught the fish they are after, and they hand you over not just your fee but a tip on top, then it is the best job in the world.

 

5a) When the customers hand over the money but the result has been not good, you feel eternally guilty and really want to waive the fee. Youcant afford to do that though, as fishing in the UK is fishing, and I have blanked on game boats costing many hundreds of pounds to charter. I charge £10 per hour for up to four anglers inclusive.

 

6) Be prepared with plenty of tackle so you can accomodate corporate enquiries. Havbe good local anglers ready to step in and assist you in this situation, as you could not possibly give everyone the attention they are paying for in groups bigger.

 

7) Ignore the knockers. When you declare yourself as a fishing guide for hire, you get a lot of stick, and there is a lot of jealousy. So what. Its your customers who will show you how good a guide you are. It takes a very different approach guiding than just taking people fishing. They need to have absorbed the information that you have given them well enough to come back and do it on theirr own. There is very rarely time to fish yourself if you are doing the job correctly

 

8) Preperation. If you are taking your party to a specific mark, make sure you go and fish it the day before, to confirm that what you are expecting to catch is there. If you dont catch, and assess the likely hood of catching is poor, do advise the customer of this. You SERIOUSLY earn your money when all is said and done.

 

Any other questions, feel free to ask. Part of the reason I dont have a full book is that I dont advertise anywhere other than my website. The diary on my site (www.fishyrob.co.uk) is invaluable, as it shows the fishing I am doing and the quality of the fishing available. If you want a full book (I actually dont as I am also very committed to the DVice Tackle Co Ltd) then linking up with the tourist board, stag weekend web sites, locla council etc etc will bring you more exposure. (and sometimes bookings! I have a regualr group from Brighton Council....!)

Edited September 22, 2008 by fishyrob

[glennk]

Hi Rob,

 

First of all thanks for taking the time to reply, it is appreciated.

 

Just looking at your reply I am interested in your statement on insurance, specifically the bit in bold :

 

Nowadays I explain to the customers that I am a guide, I can take them to some good fishing, I can advise them on their safety, but I completely refuse responsibility for their safety. If they arent happy with that, I recomend we fish on the local marina, which is paid for and insurance cover is granted as part of the ticket sale. I've only ever had one customer ay "no, lets not go on the rocks" and I think that was mostly because he was elderly........!

 

Does this mean that you do not have insurance ? Do you get them to sign some type of disclaimer and does this stand up legally ??

 

Thanks again - Glenn

[Ken Davison South Wales]

3) H & S. Explain that fishing is britains most dangerous participant sport. Take a recognised first aid course ( I did the St JOhns session. Not terribly expensive and the certificate lasts three years), carry a first aid kit and make sure you point out the specific dangers of any chosen mark.

 

I find that very hard to believe, I appreciate people do get into trouble and some end up as sad statistics but the most dangerous participant sport seems to be one hell of a statement. Is it based on simple figures or is it a percentage based on numbers involved statistic.

[H.A.]

You are ill-advised in this day and age to coach/guide without a minimum of qualifications and adequate insurance.

 

For casting tuition, I have £5million 3rd Party Indemnity (certain members of this and another well-known website will be relieved). When I take youngsters out for tuition and in the annual Juniors BoatFest, which I help organise, I have to possess a Child Protection Certificate and an enhanced CRB (criminal record) check ... + the obligatory (3yr re-tested) Ist Aider's cert.

 

No wonder we have so few coaches/instructors/guides!!!!

 

My qualifications, including these courses, cost me circa £1000.

 

Most of the stuff I do in angling is voluntary, but I cannot fault those who wish to help anglers and their kids be safe on boats/beaches/rock ledges and piers and who then, may ask for expenses etc.

 

Golf coaches are similarly qualified to me (and, of course, given the dangerous environments they work in ask anything from £40 - £100 an hour.

 

Not a living. But certainly a vocation.

 

[fishyrob]

You are ill-advised in this day and age to coach/guide without a minimum of qualifications and adequate insurance.

 

For casting tuition, I have £5million 3rd Party Indemnity (certain members of this and another well-known website will be relieved). When I take youngsters out for tuition and in the annual Juniors BoatFest, which I help organise, I have to possess a Child Protection Certificate and an enhanced CRB (criminal record) check ... + the obligatory (3yr re-tested) Ist Aider's cert.

 

No wonder we have so few coaches/instructors/guides!!!!

 

My qualifications, including these courses, cost me circa £1000.

 

Most of the stuff I do in angling is voluntary, but I cannot fault those who wish to help anglers and their kids be safe on boats/beaches/rock ledges and piers and who then, may ask for expenses etc.

 

Golf coaches are similarly qualified to me (and, of course, given the dangerous environments they work in ask anything from £40 - £100 an hour.

 

Not a living. But certainly a vocation.

 

 

 

Ada is bang on as regards taking youngsters. I dont, unless their parents accompany them.

I have never had any of my customers query my criminal record, so again, only required by law if taking unnacompanied minors, and rightly so.

If I am guiding for people able to power cast, then I assume that they take responsibilty for their casting!!!

I also rarely do anything volutary, except charity meets......

 

Ken, I'm sure you do..... I must admit it is an old statistic, taken from a year when drownings and electrocutions came to something like 42 anglers. I cant remember the year, but I'm pretty sure I read it in the Daily Mail, so its got to be true........

 

Glenn, that would have to be tested in court. But I would lose faith in humaity if anyone took me there as I do make it very clear. O explain the insurance situation, and also point out I have nothing of value.....I did knock up a form once, but got told that it would be worth nothing in court, so not much point in collecting signatures.

Edited September 22, 2008 by fishyrob

[FishingGuernsey]

I just gave up being a guide after 3 years in the firing line.....

 

1. Insurance. DEFINITELY needed. A signed disclaimer will NOT stand up in court according to my legal friends. There are too many get out ways and another lawyer will rip it to shreds, plus it's a contract and an under 18 cannot legally enter that contract.

 

2. Expectation. If you advertise or suggest a bass/cod/whatever trip, they WILL expect to catch a double figure no matter what you say.

 

3. Safety, always a problem and only had a couple of problems but remember that when someone falls and breaks a leg, no matter how nice he/she might be, inshore rescue costs a packet, IF their holiday insurance covers it, and you all know what insurance companies are like for paying out, they will get the 3rd degree and it will return to bite you whatever and however nice someone was until they are out of pocket big style.

 

4. Kids. I refused to take anyone under 16 without an adult unless I had taken them before and knew how they acted, their capabilities etc etc.

 

5. jealosy, professional and otherwise, get used to having it against you...

 

Forgetting all the above, I am completely gutted that I can no longer afford to make a loss (despite the 50 people I take per year) as it's so good to see someone catch their first/best/first of a species fish knowing that you helped them do it and they will be eternally grateful!!!

[fishyrob]

I just gave up being a guide after 3 years in the firing line.....

 

1. Insurance. DEFINITELY needed. A signed disclaimer will NOT stand up in court according to my legal friends. There are too many get out ways and another lawyer will rip it to shreds, plus it's a contract and an under 18 cannot legally enter that contract.

 

2. Expectation. If you advertise or suggest a bass/cod/whatever trip, they WILL expect to catch a double figure no matter what you say.

 

3. Safety, always a problem and only had a couple of problems but remember that when someone falls and breaks a leg, no matter how nice he/she might be, inshore rescue costs a packet, IF their holiday insurance covers it, and you all know what insurance companies are like for paying out, they will get the 3rd degree and it will return to bite you whatever and however nice someone was until they are out of pocket big style.

 

4. Kids. I refused to take anyone under 16 without an adult unless I had taken them before and knew how they acted, their capabilities etc etc.

 

5. jealosy, professional and otherwise, get used to having it against you...

 

Forgetting all the above, I am completely gutted that I can no longer afford to make a loss (despite the 50 people I take per year) as it's so good to see someone catch their first/best/first of a species fish knowing that you helped them do it and they will be eternally grateful!!!

 

Did you get a policy thatincluded rocks and reefs FG?

[FishingGuernsey]

Yes, had it tailored for sea fishing shore guide off rocks etc as well. Cost about £450... Ouch.