was a natural disaster now a humanitarian catastrophe

[poledark]

I will probably get it in the neck here but I have to agree with Jim. I would further add that if you choose to live in that situation then have you the right to expect "the state" to keep NG on standby in case of a disaster?

 

Do you have the right to expect stockpiles of water and food and clothing etc to be stored nearby in case you get flooded out?

 

Having said that, I expect that a fair number of those affected will now be seriously considering moving to a safer area...assuming they can afford it of course.

 

One further point Jim,, lots of London is now prone to serious flooding due to natural sinking of the land and the rising sea levels and the only answer seems to be to build higher flood barriers.....imagine a similar event as Katrina and all the poor people being left behind, unable to find accomodation elsewhere due to having insuficient money.

 

Does anyone living in these low lying ares of London really think that they will get flooded out? And who will they blame when they do?

 

Den

[Jim Roper]

Here's an interesting story/conspiracy theory that's doing the rounds in certain professional/ political circles.

 

The millenium dome, and several other structures in the UK, was encouraged because there was currently no technology in the UK for building the domes that will be needed to house the population of London in the event of everything freezing when the Gulf Stream stops due to global warming.

I wonder if Londoners will suffer murders and rapes like the people in the New Orleans domes.

 

The millenium Dome is going to be left intact to see how long it will last, so the story goes!

Unlike the Eden Project, it is not producing much income!

 

Glad we agree on something, Den.

[Jim Roper]

Dan:

Err isnt holland mostly below sea level? and Holme fen in cambridgesire is nearly 3m below sea level as well as numerous other areas.

 

Dan

So, with all the forcasts of rising sea levels, why do people buy houses there?

 

Who foots the bill when they are flooded out?

 

BSE - Blame Somebody Else. It's a worldwide disease!

[Vagabond]

Poledark. As someone who spent much of his working life as an oceanographer and geologist, I am perhaps more aware than most of natural hazards.

 

Unfortunately, there is considerable ignorance of such hazards - even amongst so-called "planners". Remember Aberfan?

 

Speaking for myself, I would never live in a house below sea level, or indeed in one less than 50 ft above sea level (100 ft if in the IndoPacific).

 

Nor would I live on a flood plain, nor a narrow valley, nor downstream of a dam, nor in an earthquake zone, nor on the slopes of a volcano, nor close to a spoil tip or scree slope, nor on a receding cliff, nor on unstable ground, nor anywhere near a nuclear power station or large factory.

 

Nor in an apartment block (don't want to be burned cos some prat was smoking in bed) I could go on.....

 

But many people do live in hazardous areas - some through economic necessity, some through ignorance of the danger.

 

I might take a chance and holiday in some of those places, but living there permanently is just waiting for a once-in-a-lifetime catastrophe to happen - and I don't want it to be my lifetime!

 

So yes, if you live in a low-lying area of London, take steps to move elsewhere.

 

Don't buy a house with a seaview in Overstrand, Norfolk, or Fairlight, Sussex! Don't buy a house on the Sussex Ouse floodplain etc etc.

 

It is easy to be critical of folk who are the victims of disasters - "they should have seen it coming" etc , but how much foresight is the ordinary person expected to have?

 

People went onto the Indian Ocean beaches when the sea receded (because the tsunami trough arrived before the tsunami crest) They were driven by curiosity.

 

All my family know what to do if faced by a receding sea - make height, bloody fast! ...but then, I have the advantage of having studied these things.

 

Having said that, I remember a colleague who was alarmed that his house on the banks of the Cam, was experiencing subsidence. We all fell about laughing - he was employed by the unversity as a structural geologist

[Leon Roskilly]

Poledark,

 

It's not just London, it's all low lying areas along the east coast and especially along the Thames Medway estuary.

 

(As a surge comes down the north sea and is restricted by the funneling effect of the coasts, it gets higher, once it enters the estuaries, it gets even higher as travels down the narrowing river(s), so you might not consider you are on low ground, but that surge will have other ideas).

 

Recognising that the Thames Barrier needs to be replaced (which only makes matters worse for those downstream) and bearing in mind the considerable development that is going on now to the East of London (Thames Gateway Project!), there is now a proposal to build a huge barrage that would stretch from Sheerness in Kent, across to Southend in Essex (Sam Cox etc would have to become coarse anglers!).

 

Why the New Orleans levee went wasn't because it couldn't hold back the force of water, or was overtopped, it was because of a surge effect undermining the foundations.

 

Just imagine if such a barrage was built, but failed!

 

Wouldn't it be better not to develop the 'East London Corridor' and make a new city somewhere safer?

 

Tight Lines - leon

[Vagabond]

Leon Roskilly:

Wouldn't it be better not to develop the 'East London Corridor' and make a new city somewhere safer?

I think someone tried to explain that to John Prescott - didn't get very far demon demon demon

[Jim Roper]

Leon Roskilly:

Wouldn't it be better not to develop the 'East London Corridor' and make a new city somewhere safer?

I agree, but I didn't dare mention it.

Now that London is not the busiest of ports, why should it be where it is.

Don't fancy being governed from Milton Keynes though!

With Bliar's total disinterest in history and his craving for modernism, it could be his legacy. A modern capital city, but I bet it wouldn't last as long as the old one!

Would Salisbury Plain be high enough?

 

Where is Chesters1 when we really need him?

[poledark]

I thought it would not be long before it was Blairs fault (aided by Prescott) ..........good grief!

 

Den

[Newt]

Some of you might enjoy the blog from 5 Sept located at http://www.wunderground.com/blog/JeffMasters/show.html

 

Informative main post and lots of comments.

[Steve Burke]

Excellent link to a horrifying "no-holds bar" story showing lack of political will. Thanks, Newt. The article gave a link to www.nola.com that is a site Peggy and I have been following since the hurricane struck. It's the website of a New Orleans newspaper with updates every few minutes.

 

By the way, FEMA was ordered several years ago by Washington to do a study on the effects of a category 4 or 5 hurricane on New Orleans. This wasn't carried out, apparently because its budget was repeatedly slashed. In fact, FEMA's budget wasn't cut just by the 2 Bush administrations. It was also cut in Clinton's day.