low stretch mono v braid

[Worms]

Well, I've been umming and aahing about a lightweight rod for shallow water boat fishing. Lots of rods are on my shortlist but one of the issues now is braid and mono choice.

 

I understand that the no stretch braid is finer diameter so resists drag and consequently lighter leads can be used. Bite detection is suberb because of the lack of stretch I witnessed this in 180 feet of water last week when I and my friend were using mackerel flappers on a wreck. We both had bites (baits were chewed) but I didn't see a thing (using mono), he saw loads (using braid)!

 

Attaching a mono leader to the braid allows a small amount of elasticity to allow for sudden lunges at the boat and, arguably abrasion resistance on the bottom. In deep water this could be the way to go.

 

My concern here is that I may be fishing (for rays, tope, huss etc) in very shallow water, in some marks as little as ten feet. Obviously a 30' leader (seems to be the commonly referred to length) would make the use of braid completely superfluous as I might not have any out!

 

I have been looking at the "low stretch" monos which, should aid bite detection if not give the finer diameter advantages. I noticed that Rok-Max are advertising 'Mystic Green' low stretch mono with a claimed 7% stretch (as opposed to 20%) and considerably less than other low stretch monos at 12%.

 

Has anybody tried this line in the real world?

 

My return to boat fishing has revealed a whole new world as regards tackle!

[barry luxton]

Ohh it's me again Worms.

 

I suppose using mono in shallow water for uptiding, fishing for tope would make sence.

 

I use braid obviously with a leader, not just for a bit of spring but over the wrecks, braid don't like metal. However, my loverly rod allows for the pollack to crash dive along with a correctly set clutch, so i use the leader more for protection against the metal.

 

I also use braid with a leader for fishing on the banks in shallower water for blonde ray. In a full tide you would struggle to hold bottom without it. The best blonde ray fishing i have is in a fast tide. Also use it for deepwater reefing for conger, tope, bull huss, again without braid you may well need more than 3lb just to hold bottom. I use braid to drift fish the portland race, very shallow ,very rocky, super fun to fish, however, if you haven't got the thinner braid you will need something like a pound and a half unless you want to fish away from the boat with a much better chance of hooking the bottom.

Edited October 20, 2009 by barry luxton

[Worms]

Evening Barry, I had a feeling that you might respond to this

 

As you know I'm returning to boat fishing after a bit of a lay-off. I've realised that some of my old tackle is a little, well, shall we say heavy and outdated compared with what is on offer these days so, I'm open to offers on ideas. I think I've accepted that braid on deep water/ fast tide scenarios is the way to go (obviously somebody is going to pop up and say that 50lb mono in 200 fathoms can still be managed with 2oz of lead and a 2# fly rod but..... ) but I still haven't tried it! The bite detection comparison last friday was quite an eye opener!

 

This shallow water thing is what concerns me, also the fact that I don't particularly want to have to change reels/spools/line whilst out fishing if we change marks from say 10' to 100'. Some of these low diameter 'low stretch' monos could be the ideal line for such events. Could this be the line that ousts braid?

 

I'm considering....wait for it.... both the MTI boat rods and the Avet LX/JX reel (40lb class coincidentally to match the 20-40lb MTI braid rod) which should fulfill all of my boat angling requirements. Loads of dosh I know but two rods and matching reels with matched line (40lb braid on the larger rod and reel and low stretch 16lb mono on the smaller MXL/MTI 15lb offshore combo) was the (dream) plan at the moment.

 

Money isn't the problem........the wife and mortgage are though

[Sutton Warrior]

I bottom fish and drift the shallow water off Felixstowe all the time and am just making the transition to braid . . . The trick is, for me, light forgiving rod, takes that initial hit, I use Abu Suveran 7'-9", 12-20lb class, work well with mono as well! 20lb braid, 0.19mm dia., 20lb mono leader twice the rod length, is about right. It works well for me.

 

I'm not sure about the wreck fishing dont do much of that up here, but a 40lb rod sounds a bit heavy for braid to me???? Abu do a 20-30lb Suveran which I use sometimes, but am feeling its still a bit OTT??? Have not used mine for 9 months now.

 

The Suveran is an unusual blank, super sensitive and forgiving top third (not floppy) the rest is tough but bendy!! getting tighter as pressure is applied . . .

 

SW

[Steve Coppolo]

My opinion is, use braid..........................if you have to.

 

If using braid allows you to fish in conditions that mono doesn't, or gives you any benefits or advantages, then use it. But in shallow water, there is no need. The problems associated with braid outweigh the marginal benefits, if any, that it may provide in shallow water. At least that's my way of thinking, for what it's worth.

[Worms]

My opinion is, use braid..........................if you have to.

 

If using braid allows you to fish in conditions that mono doesn't, or gives you any benefits or advantages, then use it. But in shallow water, there is no need. The problems associated with braid outweigh the marginal benefits, if any, that it may provide in shallow water. At least that's my way of thinking, for what it's worth.

I agree with you on using mono for shallow water. I'm just wondering whether the low stretch monos are any better as regards bite detection in deeper water.

 

Apparently they've been popular on the carp scene for a while. I wondered whether anybody had tried them in the sea?

[Steve Coppolo]

I agree with you on using mono for shallow water. I'm just wondering whether the low stretch monos are any better as regards bite detection in deeper water.

 

Apparently they've been popular on the carp scene for a while. I wondered whether anybody had tried them in the sea?

 

Anything with lower stretch wil give better bite detection, so the low stretch mono's will be better than normal mono with regard to bite detection. I have never used it, so can't speak from expreience, but I've heard of issues with knot strength and breakages with low stretch mono.

[Brian Carragher]

Loads of dosh I know but two rods and matching reels with matched line (40lb braid on the larger rod and reel and low stretch 16lb mono on the smaller MXL/MTI 15lb offshore combo) was the (dream) plan at the moment.

 

 

Now you're coming round to to right way of thinking, different rods and set ups to do different things

 

When I'm afloat in my own boat I have with me at least three rod and reel set ups all allowing me to change tactics or methods without breaking down the one rod and retackling up with new terminal gear. The maximmus rod I use has main line of 22lb Storm mono and its a bit thinner in diameter than normal monos so I'm presuming its been pre stretched if only a bit but the rod has enough give in its action to compensate for any lack of stretch in the mono. Some of my stuff is loaded with braid and some with mono but the heaviest mainline in mono I use is 30lb

 

Anything with lower stretch wil give better bite detection, so the low stretch mono's will be better than normal mono with regard to bite detection. I have never used it, so can't speak from expreience, but I've heard of issues with knot strength and breakages with low stretch mono.

 

One of the bigest problems with the pre streched stuff (hi tech lines) is'nt that the knots fail, its in that you have to test and experiment with different knots to see which ones work on the line you're using, not all knots work the same so you have to find out which ones give you the desired knot strength by trial and error, but doing it in front of the telly is best. The other big failing of pre streched is that there is no give in the line at all and the knot absorbs all the force and coupled with the wrong type of rod, one thats too stiff in the tip, the kinetic force just pops the knot, if force or weight is applied gradually instead of instantly then in most cases the knots survive even a stiff rod but the best combination is a braid type rod and the right knots and you'll have no bother at all

[Worms]

One of the bigest problems with the pre streched stuff (hi tech lines) is'nt that the knots fail, its in that you have to test and experiment with different knots to see which ones work on the line you're using, not all knots work the same so you have to find out which ones give you the desired knot strength by trial and error, but doing it in front of the telly is best. The other big failing of pre streched is that there is no give in the line at all and the knot absorbs all the force and coupled with the wrong type of rod, one thats too stiff in the tip, the kinetic force just pops the knot, if force or weight is applied gradually instead of instantly then in most cases the knots survive even a stiff rod but the best combination is a braid type rod and the right knots and you'll have no bother at all

Ah, good thinking! I may get one of the lighter low stretch lines for my winter barbel and chub 'snag' fishing that might also give me an idea on bite detection and final answers to knot strength. I already have a suitable setup in the workshop that I use to test old silk fly lines for strength!

[Sharkbyte]

Hi Worms

 

When you say lightweight rod, how light are you talking?

 

Most anglers still seem to consider 12-20lb class lightweight. If you're going the braid route, you can go much, much lower than that without risking losing a lunker.

 

 

With a decent low diameter braided line (XDS, Whiplash, Power Pro....) you can dramatically cut down on the lead, still have double the breaking strain of a regular mono, and get away with nothing heavier than a spinning rod.

 

 

Obviously, a great deal will depend on the boat you are fishing from. If it's a busy charter boat you may as well forget it in most situations. Your gear will not sit in the tide anything like the other punter's lines, and headaches usually result.

 

 

However, if you are fishing from your own boat, or one with plenty of space to enjoy the many benefits of braid, go for it! You will not look back.

 

 

 

 

Personal favourites include Kenzaki 6lb class rods for downtiding big baits (easily good enough for Blonde Ray to 26lb in 3 knot tide), Free Sprit Pike tamers (1-3oz 8'6) good enough for accidental 20lb+ Congers, big Bass, very respectable Cod, double figure Turbot etc. and the new Savage Gear Boners (20-60g 8' 6) that have so far caught me mid double Smoothounds without breaking sweat.

 

 

I say, play the fish, not the tackle hanging off of it's lip.

Edited October 23, 2009 by Sharkbyte