BASS AND COD IN BEFORE OVER FISHING

[Jaffa]

Hi Chris

 

Yer there's definatley a cock up with figures

The TAC was set to 918000 tonnes in 2003 and to 826200 tonnes in 2004. There's far more than 750-1000 sandeel to a ton so even that doesn't add up

 

Surveys in April and early May showed that North Sea sandeel numbers were just half of the 300,000 million fish required to permit fishing to continue.

 

I'd imagine that this is no more than a "copy and paste" typo from a journalist that thinks he knows it all but does not bother with the detail.

 

I've yet to see any credible evidence that Sandeel numbers have crashed due to fishing (though so many "green" sites repeat this like some kind of mantra). On the other hand there is plenty of evidence that the zooplankton community of the North sea has switched; and big time.

[Leon Roskilly]

Steve (Gather)good gets a mention by Charles Clover in today's telegraph.

 

http://telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml.../06/nfish06.xml

[Ian Burrett]

Quote from Wurzel om another thread

 

Like JB says there is very little activity off shore these days, and what there is is done mainly by foreigners .

Inshore you can count on one hand the boats over 10 meters from Folkstone to Yarmouth, the rest are small boats mostly fishing for Dover soles or potting

 

.......................................................................

 

Looks like an own goal to me. If what Wurzel says is correct there will be very few commercials suffering with the BMP from Folkestone to Yarmouth

[Jaffa]

Hi FF,

 

Jaffa,

 

I would like to know what are your premises for this assumption. (I know I should ask steve the same question but I really cannot take more of his guff for some time). Do you only have steve's and a couple of other commercial's BMP anti-campaigning as 'evidence'? You seem a clever guy so I suppose you have examined how much water their postulates (I call them lies) can possible hold.

Unless you can show me otherwise, their "guff" seems to be the opinion of every commercial fishing body (including the handliners) and in the absence of evidence to refute what they say, yes I am listening to them.

 

Here some of the questions, which should be answered before one draw his conclusions imo:

 

- How many bass are taken today by UK versus other fishermen in UK waters 0-6 mile? 6-12 mile? And in the bordering international waters? All EU waters?

- How are EU TAC and quotas set and shared between nations for new and old 'presure' stocks?

- If bass was announced a presure stock tomorrow how many bass would there be to UK, France and other nations - specified for each area relevant for UK fishermen?

- Would this mean a bass tac to UK fishermen over, on or below what they (officially) catch now?

- If the bass biomass getting smaller (otherwise no presure stock I presume) and all fishermen's catches decrease equally would it influence the calculation and results concerning the question above?

- How many bass would swim from the UK 0-6 mile to the 6-12 mile and farther, now and later if the stock decreases? (you know what the scientitsts say and what steve says about the present situation and there is so much difference between the two that one of them must be 'lying'/totally wrong).

- If bass should become a presure stock (in UK waters) would EU allow other measures to be taken instead of that of a tac (e.g. a bass management plan)?

- If bass should become a presure stock (in UK waters) would a bass management plan secure more bass to UK fishermen than would a tac do? Short and long term?

- Why is it that steve only fish between the 6 and 12 mile 'in competition' with the French? Can we believe it? How many other UK vessels fish the 6-12 mile only, and how many could fish inside the 6 mile? Why is it that steve fish the 6-12 mile only instead of partly or fully inside the 6 mile where he could 'steal' all the bass before they swim out to the French and international waters? Is there more fishing presure within the 6-12 than the 0-6?

- Would a MLS increase give UK fishermen fishing for bass more or less income, now? After one year? two years?

- Would the bass stock be more vulnerable to climate change and overfishing with or without an MLS increase from 36 cm to 45 cm

 

Good questions, that should be answered by those proposing the radical change to fisheries management that the BMP means.

[wurzel]

Quote from Wurzel om another thread

 

Like JB says there is very little activity off shore these days, and what there is is done mainly by foreigners .

Inshore you can count on one hand the boats over 10 meters from Folkstone to Yarmouth, the rest are small boats mostly fishing for Dover soles or potting

 

.......................................................................

 

Looks like an own goal to me. If what Wurzel says is correct there will be very few commercials suffering with the BMP from Folkestone to Yarmouth

 

 

I suppose I should have mentioned bass as well,

so are you saying that those few don't matter?

How would you feel if you were one of them?

[wurzel]

Hello Jaffa

 

Thanks for the support.

 

Quote

Good questions, that should be answered by those proposing the radical change to fisheries management that the BMP means.

 

They should have been answered and the results published with the BMP.

 

Fishingsfine

 

Quote

you know what the scientitsts say and what steve says about the present situation and there is so much difference between the two that one of them must be 'lying'/totally wrong).

 

Well Steve is not lying.

[steve good]

Hi FF,

Unless you can show me otherwise, their "guff" seems to be the opinion of every commercial fishing body (including the handliners) and in the absence of evidence to refute what they say, yes I am listening to them.

Good questions, that should be answered by those proposing the radical change to fisheries management that the BMP means.

 

Hi Jaffa

 

I am glad that you and some others, are keeping an objetive open mind over the bmp.

FF and others are so anti commercial they cannot and don't want to see anyone else's point of view, for some reason they past it off as lies

I can assure you I have told no lies, have no reason to.

 

steve

[steve good]

Hello Jaffa

 

Thanks for the support.

 

Quote

Good questions, that should be answered by those proposing the radical change to fisheries management that the BMP means.

 

They should have been answered and the results published with the BMP.

 

Fishingsfine

 

Quote

you know what the scientitsts say and what steve says about the present situation and there is so much difference between the two that one of them must be 'lying'/totally wrong).

 

Well Steve is not lying.

 

Hi Wurzel

It is not a case that either the scientitists or myself are lying.

It is a only a lack of understanding from tne person who thinks that.

 

I know what I see when I am on the ground fishing and I have only ever told the truth about this, I have been doing it for 28 years and I am not blind.

 

Scientist are very good at what they do and know about. However, they don't do and know everything.

 

steve

[Ian Burrett]

I suppose I should have mentioned bass as well,

so are you saying that those few don't matter?

How would you feel if you were one of them?

 

Hi Wurzel

 

I have seen the fist stocks drop alarmingly round South West Scotland over the past 18 years. Judging from comments by other posters this is nationwide.

Many charter boats and tackle and bait shops have gone to the wall.

It's time for change

[Leon Roskilly]

Something for Steve and Wurzel et al to consider:

 

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1618278,0035.htm

 

 

 

We anglers (and especially mullet anglers) spend a fortune feeding the fish!!