Mass intentional (?) lead poisoning of swans - any thoughts?

[philocalist]

Hmmm ... a thought just occurred to me that may be extremely relevent to this, and it's likely info that at this stage the authorities concerned are unaware of as it's something VERY specific, geographically, although maybe no more than a couple of miles away from the incident site ... IF a new overnight roosting spot had come into effect - any thoughts upon what sort of stuff the birds may be ingesting there (on well-flooded fields that are normally little more than grassland close to the river - the flooding being a product of precipitation rather than river flooding)?

[Steve Walker]

OK, so we now know it isn't you but that leads to a trail of thought - poisoning swans with lead by design is not easy.

 

If it Is a deliberate act, consider what the person(s) concerned might use

 

They would be constrained, firstly by whatever knowledge they have, secondly by what form of lead they could lay hands on, and thirdly by how it might be administered. If there is any suspicion of deliberate poisoning, then those constraints could narrow the field of investigation - think profile and opportunity.

 

Soluble lead salts are not readily available - in fact, any form of lead apart from the metal itself is not easy to come by. Issues include cost, finding a source, and answers to "what do you want it for?" questions .

 

Amongst nasties that used to be readily available from your local ironmonger were ..

 

"Sugar of lead" (lead acetate) which is soluble, and (amongst other uses) was once used as a sweetener (!!) It has been banned for that and most other uses.

 

Insoluble "red lead" ( triplumbic tetroxide) used to be available in commercial quantity and quality, but I don't think it is readily available these days.

Lead nitrate is relatively easy to make, though.

 

Actually, if it is deliberate poisoning, it does raise the question of "why lead?". There are lots of more easily available poisonous substances. Perhaps because environmental exposure to lead is a known issue in swans, so would not be immediately suspected as deliberate?

[lutra]

Just found this on the pages of a 'Swan Rescue' in the area, r eferring to birds from this incident - may put into perspective the levels of poisoning that are being encountered:

 

' ..... have received via the R.S.P.C.A. two swans from recovering from lead poisoning. They have been treated by vets in Morpeth and have come up to us to continue their recovery. They are both poor looking birds but have now started eating a bit more and although it may take quite a long time we hope they will eventually regain full health. To give an indication of the lead levels in the swans, the normal level for lead in the blood is 0- 1.21 umol/l. One of the birds from this incident with us now had a level of 15.56 umol/l. This shows the seriousness of this incident which has already killed at least .... '

This "normal lead level" is for swans that live on the Wear with its rich lead mining history or one for swans that live elsewhere?

[gozzer]

I can't believe it's deliberate, as it's been said, it's an awful lot of trouble to go to, when there are other easier ways to get rid of them. Unless it's a poor attempt at throwing the blame onto others, such as anglers, or shooters.

I would assume that samples of all the wildlife, and plant life in the area had been tested for lead levels. Are there many geese in the area? Geese graze on land, and can reach most places that the swans can. Do we know if any geese have shown signs of lead poisoning?

 

 

John

[Phone]

gozzer,

 

We don't - you have assumed wrongly.

 

I agree it is not likely an intentional act. Seems to me anyone who would kill swans would not be selective in the first place. Collateral damage wouldn't be an issue.

 

Lutra,

 

I believe the second number represents swans in a normal environment.

 

Phone

[philocalist]

A little bit more info here, courtesy of a chat with the EA, who are investigating.

Examinations on several swans indicate lead poisoning, with associated symptoms being present in other (living) swans. No evidence whatsoever of solid lead (i.e. lead shot etc) found in any swan, so categorically no finger of blame being pointed in the direction of anglers ... and the belief that this may be intentional poisoning of the swans is actually no more than s[peculation by a local vet who carried out examinations (and is not officially supported, though not refuted either at this point).

Environmental checks local to the event are so far giving no clues, i.e. all appears to be OK there, though further investigation into the possibility of lead sediment from (very much) higher upstream, in the catchment areas, being carried down and deposited during flooding, is ongoing; evidentally, it cannot be discounted, though simple logic would seem to indicate that as this incident is below a weir (and the water above the weir is VERY slow, even in heavy flood), heavy (lead) sediment would tend to fall upstream of the weir, rather than downstream of it.

During the conversation, I've passed on the info that to my knowledge, an additional overnight roost (other than the usual, expected one) has been in use for a few months on a flooded field, on a private estate adjacent to where I live ... complicated to explain in detail, but it's a fact that very few would be aware of apart from a few neighbours close by ... was news to the EA and ties in with a train of thought they were pursuing, so will be investigating that location in due course, possibly even initiated earlier today.

May be a red herring, but equally, it may offer some answers, as the problem is evidently ongoing, unfortunately.

[Phone]

philo,

 

On a scale of 1 - 10 how urgent does/did EA seem to be?

 

Phone

[Tony U]

¨Environmental checks local to the event are so far giving no clues, i.e. all appears to be OK there, though further investigation into the possibility of lead sediment from (very much) higher upstream, in the catchment areas, being carried down and deposited during flooding, is ongoing; evidentally, it cannot be discounted, though simple logic would seem to indicate that as this incident is below a weir (and the water above the weir is VERY slow, even in heavy flood), heavy (lead) sediment would tend to fall upstream of the weir, rather than downstream of it.¨

Exactly as I posted.

 

 

 

[philocalist]

philo,

 

On a scale of 1 - 10 how urgent does/did EA seem to be?

 

Phone

 

In fairness, the biggest problem I had was establishing who it was I needed to talk to, and then getting transferred.

Apparently, 'local' offices, like mine in Newcastle, no longer have their own telephone number or switchboard - everything goes through Leeds, who perhaps understandably have no local knowledge of the issues current 100 miles north of them. Eventually, I persuaded them to transfer me to a 'generic' extension at Newcastle, where they were able to quickly identify a contact for me.

Unfortunately, they were at that point unavailable, but a promise was made of a return call, which happened well within the hour, at which stage I had a chat of maybe 15 minutes over the phone with the guy in charge of the local investigation team, who seemed very keen to listen to what I had to say --- I actually saw an EA vehicle roadside at the location I had identified, later that day, but I'm unaware of any further development, as the land in question is part of a large private estate, where there is zero public access, though I'm guessing that perhaps the EA would be able to gain access quite simply, under the circumstances?

[philocalist]

Regrettably, yet more dead and dying swans have been found - 'based' at the original location, some were subsequently found at a lake approx 6 miles away ... and in a straight line, the location mentioned above is almost exactly mid-way between the two points

Evidently, concerns are mounting to the degree that there are daily visits to the affected site now, though no real progress yet in identifying the cause.