How The Bass War Was Won ?

[glennk]

Ok Im not really interested in peoples perspectives of the situation but could someone supply me with the information the NFFO presented to Defra in order to get them to change their mind on the bass mls. Any articles etc ?

[barry luxton]

Ok Im not really interested in peoples perspectives of the situation but could someone supply me with the information the NFFO presented to Defra in order to get them to change their mind on the bass mls. Any articles etc ?

 

Good point.

 

I would equally be interested in the evidence. At the time i think they were crowing about it only took thirty five minutes of 'chat' to get the minister to change his mind.

[glennk]

But it must be based on something Barry ? theey must have presented him with eveidence that convinced the minister that the anglers argument was wrong.

[wurzel]

But it must be based on something Barry ? theey must have presented him with eveidence that convinced the minister that the anglers argument was wrong.

 

Hello Glen

 

Just type in "cefas bass discards" on your serch engine there is plenty of info there, I tried to attach one file but it failed due to it being to large.

[H.A.]

Meeting between Ben Bradshaw and the NFFO on bass minimum

landing size – Wednesday 14 March 2007

 

Attendees:

Ben Bradshaw Minister of State, Department for Environment, Food and

Rural Affairs

NFFO

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

With NFFO delegation

Fishing Industry Management Division, Defra

Fishing Industry Management Division, Defra

CEFAS

Legal, Defra

Press Office, Defra

PS/Ben Bradshaw

 

 

1. The NFFO delegation gave a short presentation to the Minister. [NFFO delegate] explained that there were very strong feelings about the decision to increase bass Minimum Landing Size to 40cm from across the commercial bass sector. The industry was not against recreational sea angling and understood that Ministers had to make unpopular decisions. However, they could not understand the basis for this decision and hoped Ben Bradshaw (BB) would reconsider.

 

2. [NFFO delegate] spoke about the science. The Scientific advice from ICES is that the current fishery is sustainable. He said that CEFAS studies have shown recruitment has improved since 1990, and abundance has improved since mid 90s, with no evidence of increased fishing effort.

[NFFO delegate] claimed that larger bass tend to go offshore anyway, so the numbers of larger bass are unlikely to increase for inshore fishermen. Discards will increase and fishermen will have to work harder to maintain their income, yet there will be no appreciable conservation benefits. [NFFO delegate] mentioned that CEFAS have agreed an up to date study on bass biology is needed. He suggested that such a study is likely to find that bass are maturing earlier, and that first spawning may happen below 40cm. [NFFO delegate] felt BB had been misinformed by the angling lobby.

 

3. [NFFO delegate] spoke about discards. He said this was near top of national and EU agenda. Commissioner Borg was just about to write a paper about eliminating discards and it was also a key Defra priority. [NFFO delegate] suggested that the bass MLS decision runs counter these objectives. Defra’s own RIA had stated that fishing patterns are unlikely to change and that discarded bass will probably die. There is limited scope for technical/gear measures to reduce discards in trawls.

 

4. [NFFO delegate] spoke about discrimination. He suggested the MLS measure will discriminate solely against the English commercial fishing fleet, forcing small pair trawlers to fish outside 6-12 mile limit. The French will still be able to land their catches in UK ports. He said the CFP was supposed to create a level playing field but this measure will just discriminate against the English fleet.

 

5. [NFFO delegate] gave his personal views, having fished bass since he left school. He suggested that the measures would mean that the public would be left with no choice but to buy small farmed bass rather than wild bass. He asked BB what his future would be if this measure was brought in.

 

6. [NFFO delegate] gave his experiences of fishing in the Bristol Channel. He said the bass measure was the thin end of the wedge, with many family businesses struggling to stay afloat already. He also asked how a 3 tier system (with one MLS for the EU, a different one for England and a different one for Wales) would work.

 

7. [NFFO delegate] represented various sea angling clubs in the South West. He was anxious that recreational anglers and commercial fishermen should be working together and looking at each other’s needs. Recreational anglers needed to have a say in the management of the stock, but not to the detriment of commercial fishermen. There was a particular worry about recreational anglers who catch fish and sell them on from unlicensed boats, creating a black market.

 

8. [NFFO delegate] spoke about markets. He suggested that the new MLS will detrimentally affect every fish market that handles bass. [NFFO delegate] summed up the presentation and asked BB why he decided to implement the MLS.

 

9. BB explained that he had not laid the regulations to implement the bass MLS yet, as he wanted to have this meeting first. He said that if the NFFO had further evidence e.g. about the spawning size of bass, they should provide it to Defra as soon as possible and gave a commitment that he and officials would consider it. On the discard issue BB said he thought there was already a discard problem in the fishery (NFFO delegation disputed this, saying the current discard problem was minimal).

 

10. BB went into further detail about the historical context. He explained that there have been discussions about the possibility of a 45cm MLS for a long time. The Strategy Unit’s report recommended exploring designating bass as a recreational stock (something the Irish have already done). BB explicitly rejected that option because he knew about the commercial interest. He wanted to create dialogue between the commercial and recreational sectors. He had been advised that 42cm was the minimum size for female bass to spawn and that although there would be short term problems with an increased MLS, in the medium term everyone would benefit. BB said he didn’t like taking unilateral action, but thinks we should be prepared to take measures which we think will benefit the industry in the long term, rather than moving at the pace of the slowest.

 

11. The NFFO claimed that French bass pair trawlers were fishing within the 6-12

mile limit (with seven pairs off Salcombe) and suggested that the MFA were well aware of this. They said this was the problem with unilateral action – if there were any conservation benefits to be gained these will be lost if French vessels are allowed to fish in the 6-12 mile zone. BB said it was likely that bass pair trawling would soon be illegal in any case when the Birds and Habitats Directives were extended out to 200nm.

 

12. The NFFO reiterated their claim that the scientific evidence for the measure was not there and that there would be a huge discard problem. They also suggested that recreational anglers claims that there had been a decrease in large bass over the last 2030 years were unfounded. They

were also concerned that a move to a 40cm MLS will ruin fishermen’s track record if a TAC for bass is ever introduced. They said they could still not understand BB’s decision on this and that it was perceived by many as a voter issue.

 

13. BB concluded the meeting by saying that just because a fish is in good shape doesn’t mean you shouldn’t do more to put it in better shape. Fishermen often criticise Government for being in the straight jacket of the CFP, but hate it when the Government takes unilateral action. BB refuted the claim that the decision had not been made in a rational way, pointing to the consultation and the RIA. BB also mentioned that one of the proposals in the Marine Bill was to regulate the recreational sector. BB said he would write the NFFO on the points they had raised and would not lay the MLS regulations until he had received their reply and considered any evidence they put forward.

[glennk]

Could anyone point me to the specific research where it is proven Bass are on the increase and being fished sustainably, and also where can I find information on the claim that the larger bass tend to live offshore and smaller bass live inshore ?

[barry luxton]

Could anyone point me to the specific research where it is proven Bass are on the increase and being fished sustainably, and also where can I find information on the claim that the larger bass tend to live offshore and smaller bass live inshore ?

 

Well if anyone did it certainly would be a fabrication in any event. Boring and a repeat i know but i have to put the link up as proff.

 

http://www.sacn.org.uk/Opinion/Bigger_Bass_Better_Days.html

 

Don't really need to open it as we all know what is in it. Yet again they might be sustainable if you like tiddlers.

 

2nd thought lets see the research then for a laugh.

 

Just read H A's post regarding the minutes of the meeting, don't know if this is a true record or not. lies and inuendo regarding the rsa have been placed before the minister obviously he believed them the twatt.

Edited March 2, 2008 by barry luxton

[Ian Burrett]

But it must be based on something Barry ? theey must have presented him with eveidence that convinced the minister that the anglers argument was wrong.

 

Hi Glen

 

I am not getting involved in the bass argument but i don't think for a minute the minister made his own mind up. The more i get into this angling politics the more i realise how true the comedy programme Yes Minister was.

 

If we write to the fisheries minister in Scotland, the Marine directorate (Defra equivalent) intercept the letter/email and write the reply, the minister then just rubber stamps it.

[steve pitts]

Hi Glen

 

HA's post covers the decision to delay implimenting the increase in the bass mls by Ben Bradshaw.

 

The decision not to increase the mls and reject the majority of consultation respondants, who were in favour of an increase and the scientific advice at the time to increase to 45cm, was taken by the current minister - Jonathan Shaw

 

You might like to have a look at a recent issue of the BASS newsletter, which gives the overall history and the reasons why the mls was not increased.

http://ukbass.com/downloads/news8.pdf

 

Nothing to do with economics, or science, biology, equality or what is best for the long-term benefit of the fishery - just backing down to the inshore commericals who were having to face quota cuts was the reason.

 

Cheers

Steve

Edited March 2, 2008 by steve pitts

[ColinW]

Ben Bradshaw achieved exactly what he intended to as fisheries minister. That was to do nothing controversial during his tenure and not mess up his chances of moving to a better job. This is of course the object of all fisheries ministers. His gutless successor is making it even more obvious that he certainly won't be making any waves!