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I fail to see any difference betwen a small shoal of 9lb Breams behaviour (small by your reckoning) and a small shoal of bigger one of 14 lbs.

 

:thumbs:

 

Having fished over very large shoals of good sized bream i don't see why a few solitary fish should be any problem.

 

A tiger does not lose sleep over the opinion of sheep

 

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Well I can assure you it is! Mainly because you dont get massive shoals of 15lb bream (sorry Lutra no where in the world holds shoals of bream averaging 15lb simple as that or have I misunderstood you?) you do however get big shoals of low/scraper doubles where there will be an occaisional fish of 12-13 (ish).

 

I tried to explain that it seems that these sizes are the cut off sizes for shoal bream.

 

Ive now fished four waters that hold bream of over 15lb (these are fish that have been caught and weighed).They are not plentifull in any but niether are they one off fish.

 

Ive fished a lot more waters that have massive shoals of 8-10lb fish where the ocaissional fish of up to 13lb has been caught.

 

The main reason once again is the fact that in one case you are fishing for a shoal of fish and in the other just single fiosh or very small groups.

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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Maybe true Budgie, but a line bite will end when the line tightens and the line slips off the fish. this will happen whether you have a long or short drop. If it is a real bite it will keep going. Just because you have a 24" or 36" drop, it makes no difference...either it keeps going...a bite, or it slips off and drops back...a liner. At what point in the rising of the bobbin do you decide it is actually a real bite?

 

 

Den

 

Den its not so much about differentiating between line and true bites but the scare effect that can happen. Hopefully with the longer drop light bobbin set up the line will simply slide off the fishs back (often seen by the way the bobbin moves as you say) without there being enough resistance to scare the bream.With a short drop or swinger the range of movement not being enough will cause everything to go solid and the resulting extra tension on the line scare the fish.

 

I see what you are saying about long or short drop making no difference as the line will only pull off the fishs back once its gone tight.I would have thought though that the most likely time for the fish to be scared (due to moment of most resistance) would be as its pulling up over the front of the fish? Theories aside though in actual practice it apears that they spook less with long drop light bobbin.

 

As for determining the correct height of the bobbin to strike.You can get all technical and guestimate the amount of movement that a bream of a certain size goes through when it up ends I suppose! but In more practical and just guestimate the extra distance I need from previous bream caught.On a good night yo get enough liners to see the max extent but of course on waters with few fish you may not.Back to guestimating and making adjustments till you get it right. Most start with over long drops (such as 3') not really worrying if the "proper" bite travels an inch or a foot more than the liner.

 

Ive watched bream up to low doubles feed and they dont seem to keep their heads down and tilted for as long as carp.Even over beds of particles or breadcrumb they right them self after each large mouthfull.

Edited by BUDGIE

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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I fail to see any difference betwen a small shoal of 9lb Breams behaviour (small by your reckoning) and a small shoal of bigger one of 14 lbs. Does this change occur at around 13.5 lbs? :)

 

Den

 

No change Den its just that I believe that bream that have aquired this size have simply never behaved in the same way as there smaller bretheren.The fact they have never had to compeat with others in a shoal is why they have reached mid to upper double figures.

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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Guest tigger
No change Den its just that I believe that bream that have aquired this size have simply never behaved in the same way as there smaller bretheren.The fact they have never had to compeat with others in a shoal is why they have reached mid to upper double figures.

 

 

 

 

Off topic........Budgie are you an insomniac as you have been posting all night ;):D

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Guest tigger
No change Den its just that I believe that bream that have aquired this size have simply never behaved in the same way as there smaller bretheren.The fact they have never had to compeat with others in a shoal is why they have reached mid to upper double figures.

 

 

 

It's funny as I've found Rudd seem to be loners when they get to 1lb and above. They seem to feed on the bottom a lot as well. I've had my biggest Rudd fishing on or near the bottom whilst fishing for Tench.

Edited by tigger
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(sorry Lutra no where in the world holds shoals of bream averaging 15lb simple as that or have I misunderstood you?)

 

Probably, as i didn't use the word averaging.

 

A tiger does not lose sleep over the opinion of sheep

 

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15lb+ shoal bream off Castle loch, Long town, one Lancashire lake and at least two Cheshire meres that i know of in the north-west alone.

 

No sorry it was this that I misinterpreted.So you are saying that on Castle Loch you can catch 15lb+ bream amongst shoals of smaller bream?

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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OLD bream do seem to become more salutary and require a different approach. But i wouldn't recommend large patches of bait especially ground bait for bream over 6-7lb anyway, as they tend to be very reluctant to settle over this. "Been seen and done that" i think you would hear them say.

 

 

I beleive the bream Im talking about have always (to a certain degree/in comparison) been solitary simply due to the small numbers of them that have been in the water for the greater part of their lifes.

 

I agree on the big beds of groundbait.Very effective for big shoals of bream up to 12lb tops but after that not good as therec simply aint enough fish in a group/shoal to eat it.

And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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