Big bream

[Anderoo]

A couple of thoughts from the last session.

 

In windy conditions I'm now pretty convinced that the spodded groundbait doesn't reach the bottom. In calmer weather, it does, even if it takes a while, but even then I'm unsure how far the finer particles drift. So, in water more than 5-6ft and in anything other than a flat calm, I don't think it works like I thought.

 

So, I reckon what you need is a spod that sinks, so that it plunges down to at least mid-depth before the groundbait comes out. I'm going to modify a couple of spare spods I have and see what can be done. That would mean that surface drift becomes irrelevant and your bait should end up where you want it. Kind of like a big swimfeeder I suppose.

 

The other thing is undertow. Where I was fishing at the weekend there was a very strong wind blowing towards me. Very strong surface drift but hardly any undertow. It was very strange. There was some undertow close in and round to the left (where the water ended up being very coloured) but to the right there was none and water remained completely clear. It's still baffling me...

 

But I reckon the 'sinking spod' could be a good way to get the fine groundbaiting done.

 

I had a look through all the odds and ends in the shed this evening and found an old spod that's ideal for making into a slow sinker. It's a real cheapy with a solid plastic bouyant nose held in place by a couple of nails (quality!). With them removed, all the bits came apart and would you believe it, there's a perfect little space ready and waiting for some lead!

 

 

The lead came from a feeder and was shaped so it just squeezed into the hole:

 

 

 

Nailed back together - job done!

 

 

Empty, it just about floats, but with fine soil (I didn't want to waste groundbait) it sinks. Hopefully once the groundbait comes out it'll be fairly easy to bring it back to the surface. If not, I'll adapt it so it comes in nose first.

 

I'll let you know if it works or not...

Edited May 20, 2009 by Anderoo

[poledark]

You could count a feeder down to depth and strike to empty it. A sinking spod with Den's design to connect to the nose would do the same thing and probably fly better, though.

 

1&1/2" dia plumbing waste pipe, a FEW holes, and a weighted nose to suit your rod. Get the mix right by experiment, chuck it in some water where you can see the result,let it sink to the bottom, and "strike" to shake the bait out. It will probably spread about a yard at least.

 

It will definitely cast well

Den

[Will Wilkinson]

Out of interest too (not just directed at Budgie), what size baited spot would you try to achieve for these big bream?

 

I'm aiming for an area 15' on its short side - this could mean 15x15' for an otherwise fairly uniform area such as a margin swim or a small gap in a bar or, as was the case last weekend 15x60' where I was laying out a bed of bait across the ends of 3 bars and gullies.

 

With a similar spod to the one you were using and a fairly dry mix I found that retrieving as soon as the spod landed allowed the groundbait to come out in a line over around 3-5', hopefully giving a better spread.

 

My mix for 2KG of dry groundbait incorporated a pint of caster, 1/2 a tin of corn and about 250gm of micro pellet (possibly a bit more, but certainly less than 500gm). I also used the liquid from the corn in the mix plus half a packet of Brasem powder (half the groundbait was Sensas Bream 3000 which already has some Brasem in it).

 

Will

[tincatinca]

After rummaging around I managed to find an old Gardner spod from many years ago which I am sure many will remember and surprisingly on checking the net, they are still available. They will cast a fair way but as they are quite large and with a full payload you would need a powerful rod. As a point of interest regarding baiting up, a few of my friends and myself have had some success in the past using boiled rice in the mix instead of maggots and indeed I had a few tins of creamed rice pudding at the fish in but was unable to use due to the prevailing conditions. I have added a few pictures of the spod plus a link.

 

 

http://www.anglingdirect.co.uk/store/carp/...particle-bullet

[Dick Dastardly]

I'm aiming for an area 15' on its short side - this could mean 15x15' for an otherwise fairly uniform area such as a margin swim or a small gap in a bar or, as was the case last weekend 15x60' where I was laying out a bed of bait across the ends of 3 bars and gullies.

 

 

When fishing for big shoal bream I do much the same Will,15'x50-60' being the norm.Exact amounts ofd feed being in relation to the amount of fish I expect in the swim at any one time.But with the SB's seemingly not shoaling I keep the area of the feed a lot smaller.

 

The exact size really depends on the size of the area (and its features) that Im trying to cover.A pinch point only needs a small amount of feed to create the "lets have a look and see whats to eat" situation we all seem to think best. Acurracey is the big thing here.Acurate location,acurate baiting and acurate casting.

 

I still use the classic "diagonal line" baiting technique if Im fishing a large feature (or sometimes as it is at Wingham several close features) I try once again to keep the amount down and allthough will have the line long enough to cover the features I try to keep the width of it down (or should that be depth?) to reduce the amount of feed.

 

Keeping the amount of food down but still giving maximum attraction is always my aim.

[Anderoo]

When fishing for big shoal bream I do much the same Will,15'x50-60' being the norm.Exact amounts ofd feed being in relation to the amount of fish I expect in the swim at any one time.But with the SB's seemingly not shoaling I keep the area of the feed a lot smaller.

 

The exact size really depends on the size of the area (and its features) that Im trying to cover.A pinch point only needs a small amount of feed to create the "lets have a look and see whats to eat" situation we all seem to think best. Acurracey is the big thing here.Acurate location,acurate baiting and acurate casting.

 

I still use the classic "diagonal line" baiting technique if Im fishing a large feature (or sometimes as it is at Wingham several close features) I try once again to keep the amount down and allthough will have the line long enough to cover the features I try to keep the width of it down (or should that be depth?) to reduce the amount of feed.

 

Keeping the amount of food down but still giving maximum attraction is always my aim.

 

When you had your big bream from Wingham Budgie, did you bait with just a couple of handfuls of corn and nothing else?

 

I keep going round in circles about baiting. I really want that attractive, fine, even carpet but perhaps with all the disturbance it causes is counterproductive. Maybe (especially if the water is calm) it is best to very quietly throw or catapult a few handfuls of goodies out, or if fishing further out make a couple of discreet casts with a large feeder, on the basis that the eventual outcome won't be as good but at least you haven't sent them down the other end of the lake.

 

Maybe it's a good idea to choose swims based entirely on the wind - if it's windy and there's a decent chop, an hour's spodding is probably fine, so you can fish further out, but if it's calm you're better off picking margin spots that you can bait quietly and quickly?

Edited May 21, 2009 by Anderoo

[Dick Dastardly]

Yes the rod that the fish came on was positioned over a small break between the bank and a bar.No more than 5' or so across (at the base anyway). It was baited with around 5-6 pouches of corn and I fished a worm/corn cocktail over it.

 

It was some 35m along the bank from my main baited area where I had put out a diagonal line of crumb.

[lutra]

The amount of groundbait going out is quite a lot, but there's virtually nothing in it to eat - a handfull of micro-pellet, a tin of corn, and a pint of maggots. And that's split between 3 or maybe 4 areas. The only real thing to eat is my bait and the contents of a PVA bag.

 

So, quite a lot of 'bait' but no real 'food'. I want them to come in and be convinced the bottom is think with food, only to find they have to really look for anything worth eating.

A little while a go in this thread it was suggested that the Wingham bream may visit your swims more than you thought but didnt settle (did you say you had some line bites last weekend?). Why do you think this may be? Of coarse there could be a number of reasons, but i know what i would look at.

The amount of groundbait going out is quite a lot

 

I think there is something a little odd going on in this thread. Was it not me who didnt like the idea that SB's didn't behaved like bream? Yet who is it that doesn't like the idea of using ground bait and big beds of feed (traditional bream fishing tactics)?

[Anderoo]

A little while a go in this thread it was suggested that the Wingham bream may visit your swims more than you thought but didnt settle (did you say you had some line bites last weekend?). Why do you think this may be? Of coarse there could be a number of reasons, but i know what i would look at.

The amount of groundbait going out is quite a lot

 

I think there is something a little odd going on in this thread. Was it not me who didnt like the idea that SB's didn't behaved like bream? Yet who is it that doesn't like the idea of using ground bait and big beds of feed (traditional bream fishing tactics)?

 

No, there's nothing weird, at least not from my point of view. I hold the view that a really huge bed of feed is the best way to get the bream feeding if they pass through, but that if that happened you're very unlikely to catch one - too much feed for too few fish. On the other hand, a small amount of feed may not get noticed if they pass through - there's so much natural food, they have no reason to stop. They're still a shoal fish, it's just that the 'shoal' is very small - but the same principles of shoaling apply, i.e. if one feeds they all feed.

 

I think it was Richard who suggested that they're in swims more than we think. Personally, I don't think that happens. The lake is too big and they are so few (I think there are fewer than I first thought, too). I'm fairly sure that most of the time I'm nowhere near a bream!

 

I did have liners at the weekend. It was about 10.30pm and I had two short lifts and one long lift of the bobbin, and that was it. So I'm sure there wasn't fish feeding on the bait, just moving through and not stopping. If they were feeding I'm fairly sure I would have caught one, as there wasn't much out there worth eating. It may not have even been bream, it could have easily been a carp in that particular spot. I've had liners once before (in January last year), and they lasted all night long - almost certainly bream in the area but not feeding.

 

It's a big bed of attraction, rather than feed. It's mostly flavoured 'dust'.

[lutra]

No, there's nothing weird, at least not from my point of view. I hold the view that a really huge bed of feed is the best way to get the bream feeding if they pass through, but that if that happened you're very unlikely to catch one - too much feed for too few fish. On the other hand, a small amount of feed may not get noticed if they pass through - there's so much natural food, they have no reason to stop. They're still a shoal fish, it's just that the 'shoal' is very small - but the same principles of shoaling apply, i.e. if one feeds they all feed.

 

I think it was Richard who suggested that they're in swims more than we think. Personally, I don't think that happens. The lake is too big and they are so few (I think there are fewer than I first thought, too). I'm fairly sure that most of the time I'm nowhere near a bream!

 

I did have liners at the weekend. It was about 10.30pm and I had two short lifts and one long lift of the bobbin, and that was it. So I'm sure there wasn't fish feeding on the bait, just moving through and not stopping. If they were feeding I'm fairly sure I would have caught one, as there wasn't much out there worth eating. It may not have even been bream, it could have easily been a carp in that particular spot. I've had liners once before (in January last year), and they lasted all night long - almost certainly bream in the area but not feeding.

 

It's a big bed of attraction, rather than feed. It's mostly flavoured 'dust'.

I will start by reminding readers i have never been to Wingham never mind fished for its bream, so I may well be talking out of my a....... I can only hope Anderoo doesn’t mind me digging at his fishing techniques, its just he is being the most open about them so he is easy to pick on and it is his topic.

 

Anderoo I wouldn’t doubt huge beds of feed (taking it that you can get them in without spooking fish) are the best way of getting your swim noticed by the bream, but I’m just not so sure about them being “the best way to get the bream feeding”.

 

I’ve had the pleasure of fishing for bream on a lot of big waters that it is the norm for anglers (inc. myself) to put carpets of feed down to fish over, but I will no more. It’s not just the size of bags, it’s been the getting fish going in the first place that has impressed me.

 

The real trick is to use a light sprinkling of high leakage things like chopped boilie, liquidised sweat corn, micro pellets scalded in flavoured water and other baits. See how match anglers chop worms and crush casters for feeding. I think one of the reasons it seems to work well is you are not sending out the same warning signs as when you put down a heavy carpet of ground bait and the lake bed looks more natural. You really don’t need a lot of feed and even with chopped boilies you can make a tenner go a long long way.

 

When it comes to location I think if you fish the right weather and seasonally known pegs for bream around the N/E end of the lake you will never be that far away from bream even on Wingham. If things aren’t to their liking I wouldn’t doubt Richards suggestion that bream may be in or pass by your swims more than you think.

 

You fished Wingham in January? I most have missed that.

 

October has been the kindest month for bream fishing to me.