Big bream

[poledark]

One thought comes to mind here, I hope the "thin across the back" is not a sign of a large fish "going back" and declining in weight. The fish I have been referring to are like that.

 

The bite, as described, was a classic bream bite When carping, you can almost always tell if it is a bream that has got hooked......................

 

Den

Edited May 31, 2009 by poledark

[lutra]

One thought comes to mind here, I hope the "thin across the back" is not a sign of a large fish "going back" and declining in weight. The fish I have been referring to are like that.

Its not a good sign, but i wouldn't be to worried about it just yet as Ive often caught a thin/runtish fish mix in with better fish on other waters. I don't think all fish have what it takes to be giants.

[Dick Dastardly]

I wouldnt like to say if the fish you caught was "going back" or just a fish that didnt ever put it on in the first place! Not ever seen bream that have gone back enough to significantly notice to realy coment though.

 

As for Anderoos qestion,I regard a bream of any size that has grown in a SB water and behaved in an SB manner as one! I think that its probably just one fish out of the year class (due to its frame size I must presume its the same year class as the other similar length /framed fish that are heavier) that has simply not put the extra weight on for some reason.Fish going back tend not to look in good condition.

 

Article in this months (June) Coarse Fisherman about fishing for both tench and bream at the same time that people might want to read and comment on.........

[Kappa]

Its not a good sign, but i wouldn't be to worried about it just yet as Ive often caught a thin/runtish fish mix in with better fish on other waters. I don't think all fish have what it takes to be giants.

 

I doubt it is a fish in decline. The Wingham bream are still young and should be still growing. I had a 'smaller' bream last year after spawning and although it wasn't immaculate like Andrew's it looked like a young fish. I've also heard that a 4lber was caught a couple of years ago. It looks to me like the bream spawned successfully and the offspring are catching their stocked parents, like then tench did a few years ago.

 

Rich

[Guest tigger]

According to form a large bream isn't a breeding fish, it's usually smaller fish of several pounds that are classed as breeding fish. The big specimine fish are pretty usless as regards breeding.

[Kappa]

According to form a large bream isn't a breeding fish, it's usually smaller fish of several pounds that are classed as breeding fish. The big specimine fish are pretty usless as regards breeding.

 

I didn't know that! I was always under the impression that that the larger the fish the more spawn the more potential offspring until they eventually get too old and its the effort of spawning that finishes them off! That said if the smaller fish were born in Wingham they would have been born some time ago to have reached double figures thus perhaps back then their parents were smaller and better breeders.

 

Rich

[Guest tigger]

I didn't know that! I was always under the impression that that the larger the fish the more spawn the more potential offspring until they eventually get too old and its the effort of spawning that finishes them off! That said if the smaller fish were born in Wingham they would have been born some time ago to have reached double figures thus perhaps back then their parents were smaller and better breeders.

 

Rich

 

 

That's what I was told today off a friend who does the ecological studies for the Northwest water authorities. I must addmitt I didn't know the really large bream where/are usless for propagation. He seemed pretty sure there not though and he does lots of work with fish farms, catchers etc. I'm assuming they should know what there on about.

 

He reckond that the reason they can live so long after they've become redundant when it comes to spawning is because they're just to big for predation by the majority of the British predators so just keep hangin around. I suppose we humans are the same

Edited May 31, 2009 by tigger

[Anderoo]

In all the shock I forgot to get a scale for Steve, and I'm really annoyed at myself - that would have told us everything about it's age. For what it's worth, I am 100% sure it was a young fish. Comparing it to the bigger one, it's much lighter in colour, not quite as big in its frame as I first thought (comparing it to the bigger one), and has that 'fresh' look younger fish have. It may well have been the smallest in that group, but I don't mind - I just wanted to catch one this season!

 

Age aside, there are some very interesting points that come from this. It may be small for the water, but it still behaves in exactly the same way as a 20lber from there would. I also don't think that a 20lber is any more difficult to catch than an 11lber. (I hope that's true!)

 

The main ingredient in the groundbait was hemp. Others (like Rob Ward) have said before that, even if bream don't eat hemp, they've been caught over it lots of times. It doesn't repel them. Maybe in some other way it even helps.

 

Hookbait was a shelf-life tutti fruity boilie plus a bit of fake corn. I think the worries over hookbait are unfounded. Use what you like!

 

The rig was the good old semi-fixed flat lead and 4" soft braid. It was on my barbel rod, so the weight was only 1.5oz. Still enough to hook it.

 

The baiting was extremely light. I expect with a bigger bed of feed plus two rods on the same spot, there'd be a chance of a multiple catch. But if you want a single bream, there is probably no need to go overboard with feed. Plus you can get it done quickly and quietly then too. Because it was close in, it was also very tight, not a big spread.

 

Just two hours previously, I made an awful lot of disturbance, playing and landing that tench, rebaiting and recasting all 3 rods. Lucky timing perhaps, but if they're close by but not in your swim, some disturbance may not be the end of the world.

 

The spot was just 15 yards out. No need to aim for the middle of the lake. I'm looking again at fishing much closer in.

 

It was from an area where no bream has ever been caught, and where it was thought that the bream wouldn't even go through. I now believe that every swim has a chance of producing a bream - and in fact, I am now really confident that swims that have never produced bream are by far the best swims to try.

 

I've seen this, and I'm sure others have too - when carp fishing, you can watch a small group of carp (2 or 3 fish) go round and round the same little route. If you wait until they're out of the swim, you can bait a spot, wait for them to come round again, and catch one. Next time (even weeks or months later) you can see them travelling the same route, but every time they go through that bit, they speed up. There's no way they'll feed there again. I know it's not comparing like with like, but I reckon these bream are doing the same thing. This would explain why Steve had such a superb first year fishing certain pinch points and then hasn't had a bream from those spots since.

 

The conditions: it had been warm and muggy with a W wind, then switched to a NE and got brighter and cooler. The night of the fish was clear, mild and still. There had been a very large undertow all day, going against the wind, but this stopped at night. The edge of the undertow was about the same distance out as the spot (you could see it clearly because of the willow seed on the water). The spot was the deepest water I had access to and wasn't very near to any features. The fish was noticably warm to the touch. No full moon. The swim was halfway along the South bank (i.e. the E/NE wind had been blowing into it or along it).

 

It was very useful that Rob was in the next swim. He had lots of liners just before the fish was caught. I also had a couple of beeps on my left-hand rod before the fish. So they were travelling up the lake, near to the margins, against the day's wind direction. Perhaps they did move on the new wind, and were working their way back up? (Also, the amount of liners he had suggests several fish, so it wasn't just a loner.)

 

Anyway, I know what I'll be looking for next time - areas that either have never produced bream or large, featureless areas where one hasn't been caught for 2 years or more (that was the case for my bream last season). I'm not going to fish a pinch point unless it's never produced a fish.

[Kappa]

I am 100% sure it was a young fish. Comparing it to the bigger one, it's much lighter in colour

 

Mine too, it looked just like a skimmer only 10lbs bigger! Interestingly it was on the same bank a few swims down from your swim! I'm still really hopeful there is a new generation coming through!

 

Rich

[Rob Ward]

Mine too, it looked just like a skimmer only 10lbs bigger! Interestingly it was on the same bank a few swims down from your swim! I'm still really hopeful there is a new generation coming through!

 

Rich

 

Steve reckons the current crop of huge bream in Wingham are the ones he stocked as Fry so it will be interesting to watch the development of this year class.