Big bream

[Angly]

Earlier in the thread Budgie spoke of using a 5lb low-dia mono hooklength, was this in relation to SuperBream, and would that also apply to large tench? Seems a little light to me, or did I misunderstand?

Edited March 19, 2009 by Angly

[Dick Dastardly]

Yes indeed I did mate. Coupled with an 8lb mono mainline this is my standard set up for SB.Cant do it with braided mainlines/hook lengths though.

 

I have caught many tench also on this set up (by mistake) and have landed them no problems. Dont think it gives you any advantage for tench though.

 

So I suppose why do I use it- Well most of my "normal" bream fishing had been done "match angler" style with size 14 hooks to 2lb bottoms being the heaviest I had ever used even on the big European rivers where the fish averaged 4lb and they were often found in strong flows. When I first tried for "specimen" bream back in the UK I thought I should scale the tackle up a bit.Kind of settling on my present set up.

 

When I fished other big bream waters I was quite supprised to find many using much lower hook lengths.Most (including my self at the time) did this purely to use a "thinner" line so it couldnt be so easily seen............but after many years of doing this it "suddenly"!!! dawned on me that nearly all my captures of big bream were in the dark or very reduced light to say the best!! I then also fished several waters that recieved little or no angling pressure (well for the bream any way). So up to 8lb hook lengths........and my results dropped off! As I had never had any problems using the lighter hook lengths I went back to them and my results returned to what they were before. So if it wasnt visability what was it?

 

Well after a lot of thought and later disscusion with other big bream/SB anglers I/we came to the conclussion that the heavier hook length must change the way the hook bait behaves.Recent disscussion on here re SB feeding has only confirmed this for me.An HPPE braid would be the obvious choice for hook length but Ive yet to find a sinking one Ive any confidence in.The ones Ive tried are all to easily damaged. Mind you that said no longer being able to get Tortoue Narcrita (the mono I used to use) Ive not really found a high tech hook link mono Im 100% happy with either.I suppose I should ask the commercial carp water match guys what they reccomend.

[Dick Dastardly]

Ive not really spoke about hook length choice with the other Wingham members who have caught SB there but as we catch so few I should imagine (even if its just for the confidence factor) I will stick to what Ive clearly seens best on other waters. Be interesting to know though.Mind you the type of rig may also have a bearing on the best material.I say this as I dont suppose it matters with short "bolt rig" style set ups.

[Angly]

Hmm, interesting, thanks for that Budgie.

 

Even though I'm moving further away form Wingham soon, so unfortunately no point in me putting my name down for membership, still nice to keep up with SB techniques on the remote off-chance I get to an AN Fish-In there. Plus it's all good thought provoking stuff that comes in useful in other areas of angling.

[Dick Dastardly]

Might also be of interest that one water I fished had a massive head of bream that averaged 8lbs (despite having a lot of doubles from the water never had/saw one bigger than the 12lbr I had there and that was a one off as 11 was normally the tops even on a good year so a "big bream" rather than a "SB" water I suppose) I caught these mainly between 1900 and 2300.

 

I decided to try to catch them during the day.I used my normal heavy groundbaiting tactics with bread flake/worm or corn on the hook.No good at all untill I scaled down to 2lb hook lengths then caught on the float quite close in reasonably well.These fish were certainly not pressured as other than a few of my mates as guests I was really the only one who bothered with them.

 

Incidently when just general floatfishing I never caught a bream there unless I did bait heavily (with bead feed as opposed to loose fed maggot) and in the known bream areas as well.

 

What does it all mean? blowed if I know!

[lutra]

Mind you the type of rig may also have a bearing on the best material.I say this as I dont suppose it matters with short "bolt rig" style set ups.

Bolt rigs/method feeders need a lot heavier hook length than running rigs or float fishing. Sorry if thats a bit obvious, but i remember well the first time i fished the method feeder for good bream (up to low doubles). I started off with 5lb hook length and was getting seen off on the take so i upped it to 7lb and the same thing was happening. Luckily i had some 10lb braid hook length in my bag that i use for barbel, that worked and Ive used that ever since.

[Angly]

That's what I wondered, especially with the reduced elasticity of typical low-diameter monos. However, if using a plain old mono mainline (in my case Sensor), then wouldn't the give in that compensate enough?

[Anderoo]

I use 10lb Drennan Sinkbraid, same as I use for tench. Same rig as well, in fact. About 4" of it to a size 10 or 8 hook, depending on bait. This is with a bolt rig. The sinkbraid is very fine, nice and strong, and extremely supple, so the hookbait has plenty of freedom. (A little PVA bag is needed to stop it tangling on the cast.) Mainline is 10lb mono.

 

I'm not sure it matters either, as long as you're confident in it, and know its limitations. The Wingham bream have been caught on all kinds of stuff, as long as you're happy with what you're slinging out there, that's got to be the only important thing.

 

Andrew B mentioned he didn't like the sinkbraid because it frayed. I haven't really noticed that, probably because the hooks I use blunt so easily I'm forever swapping hooklengths!

[lutra]

That's what I wondered, especially with the reduced elasticity of typical low-diameter monos. However, if using a plain old mono mainline (in my case Sensor), then wouldn't the give in that compensate enough?

No, They snap you against your feeder or lead and nothing beyond that comes into play. You just get a quick bit and if you bring your rig in your hook length has gone. It amazed me that they can do it given that they aren't the hardest fighting fish in the world and Ive had 1 or 2 doubles on the pole and light hook lengths with no problems.

[Angly]

My previous notes on the subject with regards to braid show tangling as the only negative, any special knots required?

 

Also, is a large hook mandatory? Would you not still match hook size to bait, so say a 14 for sweetcorn? Or does the fact that the bait will be hair-rigged change that old guideline?

 

I actually had an idea for a new swimfeeder, I was going to call it the Trojan Feeder, maggot feeder on a flat method feeder...but it's almost been done (maggot feeder in the middle of a method feeder, Fox Maggot Method Feeder).