Martin Salter and Mark Lloyd fail to deliver again

[andy_youngs]

I think it would be very difficult to muster that many guys, unless it's something like sea fishing licences or bag limits, most won't give you any help,unless it affects them directly. From a personal point of veiw i would support you with your view of right of access, over secular selfish guys who havn't offered up any evidence to support their claim that damage is being done to the habitat or the contents within.

 

Well ok, so if the issue is sea fishing licenses or bag limits, then I'll probably get the 200. If not, then I won't and you and Bob will continue squabbling.

 

It does seem to me that the recreational sea anglers and the inland canoeists have a common cause though. Look on it as 'tactical voting'

 

As it stands, maybe I'd get 200 freshwater anglers, 200 canoeoists, and 20-30 recreational sea anglers. It's still enough to tilt the balance, so bring it on .....

Edited December 28, 2011 by andy_youngs

[andy_youngs]

Sadly I would agree with much of what Mr Luxton has to say about the support you’re likely to get Paul.

 

Shame, never mind. My name isn't Paul, it's Andrew

[Bob Shotter]

Shame, never mind. My name isn't Paul, it's Andrew

 

Sorry Andrew I stand corrected but don’t get down hearted over the Salter thing just do like me and keep on his trail and publicise all relevant comment the power of the net and all that means he won’t be getting everything his own way.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Deene'0

[andy_youngs]

Sorry Andrew I stand corrected but don’t get down hearted over the Salter thing just do like me and keep on his trail and publicise all relevant comment the power of the net and all that means he won’t be getting everything his own way.

Sure Bob. Don't worry, I won't get down-hearted over this. Martin Salter's email address : http://www.martinsalter.com/

I've sent him an email confirming that I have accepted his challenge for a public debate.

I suppose my question is, would the RSA like a voice on the panel?

My proposal is that the audience should be made up 35% Angling Trust, 35% Canoe England, 10% RSA, and 20% public.

4 members on the panel.

Salter has replied to my email, and I'm hopeful it will be game on (assuming he's got the balls to go through with it ...)

The difficulty is finding a good Chairman. I wonder if Jeremey Paxman is free?

Edited December 30, 2011 by andy_youngs

[Bob Shotter]

Sure Bob. Don't worry, I won't get down-hearted over this. Martin Salter's email address : http://www.martinsalter.com/

I've sent him an email confirming that I have accepted his challenge for a public debate.

I suppose my question is, would the RSA like a voice on the panel?

My proposal is that the audience should be made up 35% Angling Trust, 35% Canoe England, 10% RSA, and 20% public.

4 members on the panel.

Salter has replied to my email, and I'm hopeful it will be game on (assuming he's got the balls to go through with it ...)

The difficulty is finding a good Chairman. I wonder if Jeremey Paxman is free?

 

Why not go the whole hog get Benyon and Farage on and Keith Arthur as the joker in the pack

[Steve Walker]

I've just waded through the FM thread, and I'm struggling to see what the AT is doing wrong (and I'm not a big fan of the AT). It seems to me that you object to a pressure group acting on behalf of angling being partisan rather than willing to put the interests of anglers and paddlers on an equal footing? The AT favours local access agreements while the canoeing lobby favours a universal right of access - what else would you expect? If the AT were campaigning to give paddlers precedence everywhere, how would that be in the interests of its membership? I think it's a fundamental point that while the presence of paddlers sometimes ruins the fishing, the converse is not true - so the idea that both groups having simultaneous access is equitable is wrong.

[Dick Dastardly]

Wow Budgie settle down lad first up I have been called many things but an Angling Trust fan that has to be some sort of sick joke.

 

Reality check the ban on taking Eel while allowing a commercial take to continue was wrong, as was the way they supported a ban on taking Tope but let’s be fair who apart from a few gives a tinkers about it. Any big move to petition the trust or bombard the minister with complaints let alone any reports of salt water anglers being dragged off to court? Nah didnt think so.

 

Then your ranting on about alienating ALL anglers to the idea of a ‘’United Angling governing body’’ seems some actually believe that rubbish and have parted with twenty five quid and sing the ATs praises there are a lot on the site that has banned Andy and another site full of them that didn’t like me that much either. That proves one thing United Anglers is never going to happen not that is until the licence looms again.

 

Thing is Budgie I will ask you the same question as I have asked Barry and that is WTF are you doing about it just sitting behind a key board might make you feel better but the Trust has the ear of government and now with Salter on board like it or not they now have an even stronger voice.

 

Who is Deene’0 well that is my old screen name which I can’t change my real name? My real name well I'm sorry but I'm Bob Shotter.

 

Elton would you be so kind could you change my name screen name please from Deene’0 to ‘Bob Shotter’ Given only your admin can do this.

 

 

Bob "ranting" it seems you are the one that's ranting! I was purely answering your questions. What have I done for Angling? Then it proves to me that you are yet another who knows nothing about the subject they claim to. You have every right to your opinion re AT/Angling Unity/Angling politics in general and I respect that...........I just ask that you respect mine whether you know the history of my involvement in angling or not.

 

I have seen (and been involved in ) so many "angling bodies" all of which have failed miserably (often for the same reasons) that I dont have to be particularly bright to have recognised AT as just another in a long line (Christ its even got a lot of the same old sad want to be's!).

 

Have your opinion (and I believe learn the hard way) but how dare you and the many others who have come here preaching tell us we are the wrong uns for not supporting/joining/staying members of yet another (IMO) waste of rations vehicle for others ego's/promotion out fit!

 

Sad thing is us who "sit here behind keyboards and do nothing" would have loved nothing more than the AT to have been successful and provided the body they allude to being.

 

You say your not an AT supporter Bob so why do you defend them so vigorously? Where do you stand? what are your aspirations? I'm sorry but just as much as you have no idea of who I am/what I do/have done etc I equally no nothing of you so please educate me rather than having a pop because I have different views.

 

As I said to Mark Lloyd I'm quite approachable and allways prepared to listen just dont like being TOLD and not receiving the same courtesy.

 

I wonder if you (like indeed the AT) will be around in the near future or like them and the other Bob who kept lecturing us all on how wrong we were not to be AT supporters just fade away? Sorry that I'm so cynical but I have simply seen it all before and sadly so many times.

[Dick Dastardly]

Andy Young I know you are a keen paddler and angler.I remember that tale of woe you told us about the barbel police having a go at you for canoeing in "their" area.My sympathy was with you as I to believe that many anglers are selfish/fanatical BUT I have to agree with Steve Walker that you are possibly being a bit unrealistic expecting a body that is meant to be supporting anglers to be that supportive of canoeist's, would the Canoeing Union support anglers?

 

I personally would like to think that both with a bit of education and mutual respect could co exist and both be supporters of keeping our waterways clean and open to all..........but if anglers cant even get on with each other then I doubt I will ever see that day!

[barry luxton]

Bob "ranting" it seems you are the one that's ranting! I was purely answering your questions. What have I done for Angling? Then it proves to me that you are yet another who knows nothing about the subject they claim to. You have every right to your opinion re AT/Angling Unity/Angling politics in general and I respect that...........I just ask that you respect mine whether you know the history of my involvement in angling or not.

 

I have seen (and been involved in ) so many "angling bodies" all of which have failed miserably (often for the same reasons) that I dont have to be particularly bright to have recognised AT as just another in a long line (Christ its even got a lot of the same old sad want to be's!).

 

Have your opinion (and I believe learn the hard way) but how dare you and the many others who have come here preaching tell us we are the wrong uns for not supporting/joining/staying members of yet another (IMO) waste of rations vehicle for others ego's/promotion out fit!

 

Sad thing is us who "sit here behind keyboards and do nothing" would have loved nothing more than the AT to have been successful and provided the body they allude to being.

 

You say your not an AT supporter Bob so why do you defend them so vigorously? Where do you stand? what are your aspirations? I'm sorry but just as much as you have no idea of who I am/what I do/have done etc I equally no nothing of you so please educate me rather than having a pop because I have different views.

 

As I said to Mark Lloyd I'm quite approachable and allways prepared to listen just dont like being TOLD and not receiving the same courtesy.

 

I wonder if you (like indeed the AT) will be around in the near future or like them and the other Bob who kept lecturing us all on how wrong we were not to be AT supporters just fade away? Sorry that I'm so cynical but I have simply seen it all before and sadly so many times.

 

 

Ohh dear, i can feel a wrath coming on, ha ha ha, :clap: at present there is a poll regarding the mls issue on his facebook page re the bass. More than 60% support a larger mls, more and bigger fish, yet because they don't agree with his own opinion, they are also all wrong. He also wants them to beleive that a mucus membrane argument that is unproven and sounds bonkers in any event with regards to returning line caught bass. I agree with the quote below and have amended just slightly, as i think it is appropriate

 

........................ Budgie, don’t get down hearted over the shotter thing just do like me and keep on his trail and publicise all relevant comment, the power of the net and all that means he won’t be getting everything his own way.

[Bob Shotter]

Bob "ranting" it seems you are the one that's ranting! I was purely answering your questions. What have I done for Angling? Then it proves to me that you are yet another who knows nothing about the subject they claim to. You have every right to your opinion re AT/Angling Unity/Angling politics in general and I respect that...........I just ask that you respect mine whether you know the history of my involvement in angling or not.

 

I have seen (and been involved in ) so many "angling bodies" all of which have failed miserably (often for the same reasons) that I dont have to be particularly bright to have recognised AT as just another in a long line (Christ its even got a lot of the same old sad want to be's!).

 

Have your opinion (and I believe learn the hard way) but how dare you and the many others who have come here preaching tell us we are the wrong uns for not supporting/joining/staying members of yet another (IMO) waste of rations vehicle for others ego's/promotion out fit!

 

Sad thing is us who "sit here behind keyboards and do nothing" would have loved nothing more than the AT to have been successful and provided the body they allude to being.

 

You say your not an AT supporter Bob so why do you defend them so vigorously? Where do you stand? what are your aspirations? I'm sorry but just as much as you have no idea of who I am/what I do/have done etc I equally no nothing of you so please educate me rather than having a pop because I have different views.

 

As I said to Mark Lloyd I'm quite approachable and allways prepared to listen just dont like being TOLD and not receiving the same courtesy.

 

I wonder if you (like indeed the AT) will be around in the near future or like them and the other Bob who kept lecturing us all on how wrong we were not to be AT supporters just fade away? Sorry that I'm so cynical but I have simply seen it all before and sadly so many times.

 

Hi Budgie if my post came across as you describe I apologise, perhaps I have been on the defensive for too long and you are not alone in suggesting I’m ranting when that is simply not true. Trouble is I have yet to get properly to grips with the written word I tend to write as I would speak at a meeting, clearly and to the point. This often comes across as aggressive simply because the tone of the voice is not reflected in the written word.

 

I have defended Mr Mitchell for the work he has done at the Angling Trust he is new, young and a keen angler he is also very sharp much more so than myself, I’m just an average bloke from a working class background who happens to love sea angling. The Angling Trust has failed in my mind because it refuses to communicate with the membership and I would guess that folk join mainly because they have to.

 

Why I asked what have you done or, what are you currently doing, was in response to your quotes about the same old faces, damaged beyond repair, and how they have been around for all of your adult life etc. You see I hear this all the time these days yet find few wanting to do much about it. Shame really because unless people care then yes the current crew will ruin things, stand up to them and that wrong seems we just cant win.

 

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Hi Barry still having a pop at me I see, bless. Had a PM from an acquaintance of ours the other day Brian Carragher from up north, the title of his message was ‘Keep Going’ what a nice chap he is.