Catch and release.

[Worms]

I would vote Labour.......unfortunately there is no Labour party any more, only the Tories, the Liberal Dismalcrats and New Labour.

 

Comparing New Labour with "The Labour Party" is like comparing Darth Vader with Mahatma Gandhi.............mind you Darth Vader was probably slightly less destructive than New Labour!

Edited January 6, 2010 by Worms

[big_cod]

I just cant help thinking back to when the tories were in a lot of people forget if you were out of work under the tories you were out of work bad luck at least with a labour goverment they introduced working tax and family tax credits which actually gave people an incentive to go to work the poll tax summed it up for the tories think of the working man you pay the same rates as a multimillionaire who is looking after who it was only a public outcry what got the blue briggade to change there mind but belive me if they hadnt been pressured into it they wouldnt have.

 

paul.

[Worms]

I just cant help thinking back to when the tories were in a lot of people forget if you were out of work under the tories you were out of work bad luck at least with a labour goverment they introduced working tax and family tax credits which actually gave people an incentive to go to work the poll tax summed it up for the tories think of the working man you pay the same rates as a multimillionaire who is looking after who it was only a public outcry what got the blue briggade to change there mind but belive me if they hadnt been pressured into it they wouldnt have.

 

paul.

I don't think parties have much to do with it at all these days though. Look at the recent expenses thefts, they were all guilty............It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in!

[Steve Walker]

Labour have done nothing to benefit me personally over their term, and none of the other parties are currently offering me anything either. The best I can hope for is to be left alone and not be any further taxed, regulated or bossed about.

[Guest challenge]

Politically I have always had socialist views and have been a great believer in socialism. Why? Well simply because I have always believed that Capitalism's abject failure to provide the vast bulk of humanity with the material means for a dignified existence is not only due to the greed of individual billionaires or the failure of politicians. If it were, changing society would be a far simpler question of reforming the excesses of capitalism and dealing with the bad apples. But inequality and poverty are part of the fundamental nature of capitalist society.

Today the capitalists are a far wealthier and a far smaller class than they were in Victorian times. Capital has been concentrated in fewer and fewer hands at the same time as it has grown beyond the wildest dreams of the Victorian capitalists. In the last 50 years the wealth gap between the richest 20% of humanity and the poorest 20% doubled. Individual multinational companies have become richer than entire countries.

The world’s 100 biggest companies now control 70% of global trade. Any one of them sells more than any of the poorest 120 countries on the world export market, while 23 of the most powerful sell more than even semi-developed countries such as India, Brazil, Indonesia or Mexico.

The working class sells its ability to work to these people who maximise their profits by paying as little as they can get away with. As far as the capitalists are concerned, as long as we have enough to live on and can ensure that our children -future generations of workers - survive, we have plenty. I know that new labour in reality will never totally agree with my thoughts publicly but I certainly can guarantee that the Tories would agree and say that the world is a better place because of it.

I believe we are going to be stuck with this weather for a few days yet Barry, so this thread could turn interesting after all.

Regards.

[barry luxton]

Hiyer Challenge,

 

just as white here so i'm thinking i won't be going anywhere tommorow. You are aware that me and you couldn't be further apart on politics , apart from i ain't rich, i agree with you could be interesting and fun, shall we start another topic instead of bogging this one down. You go first. See who can offer up the best political insults,

 

 

i luv maggie

Edited January 6, 2010 by barry luxton

[big_cod]

My father screamed at the top of his voice to turn the tv over every time she came on she might as well have lined all the miners up against the wall and shot them she called scargill his biggist mistake was not haveing a ballot but he was right she was all out to shut the mines and manged it in the end she cleverly split the notthingshire miners away giveing them false hope but the knifes were ready shocking.

 

paul.

Edited January 6, 2010 by big_cod

[barry luxton]

oh go on, you start one big cod.

 

 

fwiw, i thought scargill was maggies bested friend in a political sence.

[Guest challenge]

Barry

It is true that the working class has not made its strength felt in Britain over the last few years. However, this does not primarily stem from an objective weakening of its latent power. It is more a result of subjective reasons that can be summed up as a temporarily debilitating lack of confidence.

This followed the defeats that the working class suffered during the 1980s and 1990s internationally, and specifically in Britain where the Tory government inflicted a number of blows against the workers’ movement. These factors resulted in a low level of class struggles over the last decade.

This has had some objective effects. Sections of the older generation have been affected by the memory of bitter defeats. The younger generation has, in general, no experience of struggle and so is, as yet, inexperienced, raw and untutored. At the same time, right-wing trade union leaders took advantage of the situation to try and entrench their power and detach themselves as far as possible from their members.

But like a natural athlete who is a little out of shape through lack of practise, the British working class has not lost its capacity to fight. It only needs to experience its strength in struggle to regain confidence.

It is true, however, that the most powerful sections of the working class - that is, the industrial working class whose strength stems from the fact that it is largely responsible for the creation of new value - are a smaller proportion of the workforce now than they were 20 or 30 years ago. The major reason for this is the chronic weakness of British capitalism combined with the conscious policy of Thatcher and her cohorts of moving away from manufacturing to services to undermine the strength of the British working class.

paul

The defeat of the 1984-85 miners’ strike and the closure of the pits have left previously strong communities suffering the ravages of unemployment, poverty and drug addiction.

As long as we live in a capitalist society then, "brutalisation" and "moral degradation" will remain. However, future action by working-class people – both in the workplaces and communities – will to a degree counter the current trend. A new generation will see the point of collective struggle.

One strand of future mass campaigns will undoubtedly be the struggle to strengthen our communities and to prevent anti-social crime. These will have nothing in common with Blair’s empty moralising about being "tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime", whilst simultaneously exacerbating the causes of crime with cuts and more cuts. On the contrary, campaigns against anti-social crime in working-class communities should be linked to demands for decent jobs, facilities for young people and the right to claim benefits.

regards

Edited January 6, 2010 by challenge

[wurzel]

Politically I have always had socialist views and have been a great believer in socialism. Why? Well simply because I have always believed that Capitalism's abject failure to provide the vast bulk of humanity with the material means for a dignified existence

 

 

Hello Challenge

 

One problem with socialism is that "you can't help those that won't help them selves"

 

To socialism profit is a dirty word and one reason why Great has been taken away from Britain

Socialism broke the ship building industry, steel industry and car industry, jobs for the boys was the name of the game (still is) never mind that there were 3 men doing one mans work mustn't invest in new technology might mean less workers, use the money to employ more people instead, go on strike force the bosses to conform, mean while the rest of the world has leapt a head producing better cars cheaper steel and better ships with no strikes holding up delivery dates.

The miners dug their own graves by backing Arthur Scargill and his Russian backers , the mines were going no where being hugely unprofitable and good old Maggie was not going to let them hold the nation to ransom. Even the odd profitable mine that stayed open probably run by a capitalist for a small profit have become unprofitable and closed.

Your forma employer John Brennan invested in modern technology that made a profit that enabled you to be employed, same as big Cod if he ran his boat at a loss by employing three unwanted crew he would soon be bankrupt, same applies to Uk Ltd.

You mentioned that in theory you took a pay cut because your wage rise was less than inflation, you are working for a firm that is making a loss so you should not have had any rise at all, in fact I would also take the keys away and make you row the bloody thing.