Fish ID required

[Vagabond]

Just out of interest does anyone know what baby Bronze Bream look like? In years gone by I used to catch tiny bream on the Thames near Oxford whilst catching livebaits at that size it was difficult to tell which species. By tiny I mean 2 inches long.

 

Now you come to mention it, I can't recollect ever catching bream that small - about 3" is my lower limit.

 

One test might be - how slimy were they?

Obvious slime = probably bronze

Barely dectable slime = probably silver

 

... unless bronze bream don't get slimy until several inches long - possible but IMHO unlikely - they seem born to slime-up anglers' gear.

 

That might be an interesting project - how small a bream can one catch and still tell if it's a snotty ?

[Dick Dastardly]

Now you come to mention it, I can't recollect ever catching bream that small - about 3" is my lower limit.

 

One test might be - how slimy were they?

Obvious slime = probably bronze

Barely dectable slime = probably silver

 

... unless bronze bream don't get slimy until several inches long - possible but IMHO unlikely - they seem born to slime-up anglers' gear.

 

That might be an interesting project - how small a bream can one catch and still tell if it's a snotty ?

 

 

Smallest Ive seen are around 3-4" as well. Often see and ocaisionally catch perch and roach fry of 2". Maybe they are like tench and stay in cover untill a certain size? Ive seen and netted (but never rod and line caught) Carp fry of around 2 1/2" as well. Smallest pike are around 5". Never really thought about it till now.

[Mark Wintle]

I've had tiny silver bream and bronze bream. Silvers are like silver tinfoil bottle tops (rounded in shape) whereas tiny bronze bream are like razor blades (more angular).

[Phone]

Vagabond (or others who've fished over here),

 

Why couldn't it be a Gizzard Shad? Sure looks like one. Do you have them?

 

Phone

[Kappa]

Silvers are like silver tinfoil bottle tops (rounded in shape)

 

A good description! I was going to use the old 50p piece as my comparison!

[dant]

Hello Anderoo..

Interesting thread this. I'm sitting on the fence a bit as I've never been totally 100% sure about Silver Bream myself apart from a shoal of fish years ago that always used to settle over a baited area on the approaches to Hickling Broad about an hour or so before you started picking up decent sized Skimmers and the larger Bream. I presume they were hounded off the bait by the larger species..

The largest I ever had I weighed at 14 oz's.

These fish had all the characteristics of the fish in your photo but the eye was or at least looked appreciably larger almost to the point of looking a tiny touch bog eyed. So the only thing I wonder about with your fish is the size of the eye..

Edited January 24, 2012 by dant

[Anderoo]

Hello Dant old chap! Too late, I've claimed it as a new PB now

 

I did actually try to get a good close-up of the eye but it wouldn't focus at such close range. It may look smaller on the pic as it's kind of looking downwards?

 

On a different note, are you still bothering those enormous Waveney chub?

[dant]

Hello Dant old chap! Too late, I've claimed it as a new PB now

 

I reckon that's fair enough!

 

No Waveney Chub bothering for me for a fair while now. Without planning it I seem to be on a what is now, a fairly lengthy Coarse fishing hiatus. No real reason and can't really put my finger on why.

I have been bothering a fair few 3 inch whiting and similar sized Rockling and Dabs on the beaches though on occasions..

All is not lost as I'm going to dust off the rods for a Piking trip on the Broads before the seasons out and have been given access to a trout lake in deepest darkest Norfolk that's never been coarse fished but apparently contains some huge Perch so we'll see how that one pans out..

 

Back onto the Silver Bream. Is there a record for them now as I remember when growing up, frantically weighing those Hickling fish in the hope I could sneak into the record books as I remember, probably incorrectly that the record was either 1lb something or open at 1lb??

Wonder how many Silver Bream records have been chucked back as average Skimmers?

[Mark Wintle]

Back onto the Silver Bream. Is there a record for them now as I remember when growing up, frantically weighing those Hickling fish in the hope I could sneak into the record books as I remember, probably incorrectly that the record was either 1lb something or open at 1lb??

Wonder how many Silver Bream records have been chucked back as average Skimmers?

 

The old 4-08 record got chucked out in 1968 along with many other records. They set the qualifying weight to something like 2lb but no takers, gradually reduced the qualifying weight and eventually Denis Flack held it with 15oz but once Mill Farm started producing that record has got up to about 2-14. My Thames best last season was 1-10 (know of a genuine 2-0-8) but back in the days of the 15oz record Martin Hooper and myself had several fish of 1lb from the Dorset Stour but reckoned the bother of claiming plus the chance of rounding down meant that it wasn't worth it - we'd have probably had to have killed the fish then to claim (1988).

[dant]

The old 4-08 record got chucked out in 1968 along with many other records. They set the qualifying weight to something like 2lb but no takers, gradually reduced the qualifying weight and eventually Denis Flack held it with 15oz but once Mill Farm started producing that record has got up to about 2-14. My Thames best last season was 1-10 (know of a genuine 2-0-8) but back in the days of the 15oz record Martin Hooper and myself had several fish of 1lb from the Dorset Stour but reckoned the bother of claiming plus the chance of rounding down meant that it wasn't worth it - we'd have probably had to have killed the fish then to claim (1988).

 

That would all tally up with roughly how I remember it. 1988 or a bit after would be round about the time we found that shoal of Silver Bream on Hickling.

What we would of actually done if managed to get one over a pound I don't know as I don't think we would of knocked it on the head either...

It's funny when I saw this thread I goggled 'Silver Bream Dennis Flack' as I remember him holding the record in his reign of mini species king..

Edited January 25, 2012 by dant