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French to increase bass MLS?

Elton

By Elton
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barry luxton Member

barry luxton

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Posted
Nope, the Angling Trust is fairly new on the scene, and hasn't (yet) had much effect on the engagement of sea-anglers, which remains largely as it always has been.

 

(A good (but tired) attempt at an excuse though Barry, but it doesn't really wash).

Unfortunatly it worked for me Leon, the eel gate affair, instead of the trust coming clean, at the end of the day there was a blog post issued finally, still as contrite as ever, with no one willing to put their hands up and say yup we did that and no we didn't do that as the rsa were previously informed. The same sort of arrogence happend with the reaffimation of the tope take ban, absolutly no consultation. Even if the outcome of asking the anglers was the same as the trust's reafirmation, it still happend because they thought they could do it and no one would notice. When is it going to stop, i ask. They have had enough time to start a communication chain. Instead all received is dated, edited info. Once just recently they pre-emted and issued just one of the trusts agenda, blimey.

 

To date the communication to and from and info coming out from the trust to the rsa in gerneral is rubbish. They started off on the wrong foot and it continues, good guys have joined and left just as quick. Sanitised. The trust only had one chance with them, it could have been a lot different. Just my opinion btw.

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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Worms Member

Worms

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Nick let me be clear about a few things RSA-UK was removed from just one committee, the Cefas steering group because the org set out to derail Angling 2012 with the ‘Tell them Nothing’ campaign.

 

It has nothing to do with my attitude at meetings as I DO know how to behave at them, it might be more to do with the fact that I would not sign off the minutes of the first meeting that gave a completely false view of what happened but was the only one with the balls to say so, clearly Cefas knew our participation was not going to be the typical yes man attitude that they wanted. It was also obvious that had we not been removed then we would most defiantly have had to resign or be classed as supporting the data collection which we do not.

 

RSA-UK has remained active consulting with everyone from the minister down and right now has put some very serious points to both the MMO and Cefas.

 

If I have upset some of the misrepresentatives then you should realise I have achieved some of what we set the org up for and on that score I’m more than happy to be judged.

 

You are a premium member of the org and have not resigned to my knowledge and I have on numerous occasions asked you to put up or shut up and you seem content to do the latter even though I have made it quite clear that if the membership want me to stand aside for the benefit of sea angling then I would happily do so. There is a right way to address your criticism and that is to put your case to the members something I have been waiting for you to do for some time. Like you say ‘sad but true.’

Nice cherry picking Bob. What about the RSA that you have upset? What about the charter skippers you have upset, what about the other fora that you have been banned from because of your attitude. Put up or shut up Bob? What's the point, there's nobody else to talk to on the RSA-UK forum...except yourself. The hints and direct suggestions on your own site suggesting that you step down seem to whistle straight over your head. I've been waiting for you to do the decent thing as have others.

 

As for putting serious points to MMO and CEFAS, what's the point if you don't have a functioning .org to carry the point across? i.e. the support of RSA...

 

Don't get me wrong Bob (but you probably will), you have some good ideas, you are knowledgeable about angling and angling politics and you have made a huge commitment, both financially and time-wise. For that I respect you....however, until you stand aside and let a more tactful and diplomatic person take the reigns, RSA-UK will not achieve the goals it set out for.

Eating wild caught fish is good for my health, reduces food miles and keeps me fit trying to catch them........it's my choice to do it, not yours to stop me!

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barry luxton Member

barry luxton

Posted
Posted (edited)

Quote MrShotter:

 

Nick let me be clear about a few things RSA-UK was removed from just one committee, the Cefas steering group because the org set out to derail Angling 2012 with the ‘Tell them Nothing’ campaign.

 

RSA-UK has remained active consulting with everyone from the minister down and right now has put some very serious points to both the MMO and Cefas.

 

If I have upset some of the misrepresentatives then you should realise I have achieved some of what we set the org up for and on that score I’m more than happy to be judged.

 

end.........

 

 

 

ohh dear, yet more contriteness. You alone adopted the poster campaign without consulting any of the members or even your partner at the time, it was your idea and not the org's whatsoever.

 

Yes you are still talking to the ngo,s sad that you do that through the freedom of info act. Who's fault was that, not the org's.

 

And it's not just the 'mis-reps' that have been wound up. I can't put up the org's origional ideas for working with fellow anglers etc (copyright warning), but contary to the origional ideas the org was set up to do, you have done the opposite. just my opinion btw. backed up by the lack of membership.

 

totally off topic, must apologise to the french :D

Edited by barry luxton

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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Bob Shotter Member

Bob Shotter

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Posted
Nice cherry picking Bob. What about the RSA that you have upset? What about the charter skippers you have upset, what about the other fora that you have been banned from because of your attitude. Put up or shut up Bob? What's the point, there's nobody else to talk to on the RSA-UK forum...except yourself. The hints and direct suggestions on your own site suggesting that you step down seem to whistle straight over your head. I've been waiting for you to do the decent thing as have others.

 

As for putting serious points to MMO and CEFAS, what's the point if you don't have a functioning .org to carry the point across? i.e. the support of RSA...

 

Don't get me wrong Bob (but you probably will), you have some good ideas, you are knowledgeable about angling and angling politics and you have made a huge commitment, both financially and time-wise. For that I respect you....however, until you stand aside and let a more tactful and diplomatic person take the reigns, RSA-UK will not achieve the goals it set out for.

 

I hear what you’re saying Nick but and it is just a little ‘but’ I talk to the few who seem interested in doing anything and they all say the same. Little enthusiasm coming from any of their members or the people who they represent it is not just an RSA-UK problem. Talk to any of the reps and you will get the same story they enter the ring full of get up and go only to meet a wall of resistance and abuse and decide the better option is to say little and when it comes to forums to say even less and rely on posting info via links. Tom Pinborough and Les Weller will back me up I’m sure as will Leon I suspect. Yes I have upset the PBA skippers, well a few of them and over what ‘misrepresentation’ they and we are aligned when it comes to policy but if they want to put personality before angling interest then what hope have we.

 

I have said it before and I will say it again find the org a new leader who the members will accept and is prepared to give it a go and I will stand down and will have no problem in doing so.

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barry luxton Member

barry luxton

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I have said it before and I will say it again find the org a new leader who the members will accept and is prepared to give it a go and I will stand down and will have no problem in doing so.

 

 

:clap2: :clap2: :clap2:

 

Well done to you Sir, best thing i have read on behalf of all rsa and charter boat skippers, small boat owners, fishing forums, for ages.

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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Bob Shotter Member

Bob Shotter

Posted
Posted
:clap2: :clap2: :clap2:

 

Well done to you Sir, best thing i have read on behalf of all rsa and charter boat skippers, small boat owners, fishing forums, for ages.

 

 

Um Barry I said this a long time ago and I meant it then just as much as I do now but I wouldn’t get YOUR hopes up if I were you, old friend.

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barry luxton Member

barry luxton

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Um Barry I said this a long time ago and I meant it then just as much as I do now but I wouldn’t get YOUR hopes up if I were you, old friend.

 

thought there had to be a con somewhere. so there's caveats, restrictions and conditions attached to your statement, no supprise there then, what a waste of an org and i feel sorry for many hundreds of rsa. Other rsa orgs, charter boats, blahdy blah. All your acheiving is sending guys to the trust, a true rsa hero you are. The 3000 sounds appealing. :rolleyes:

 

Do us all a favour then, shut it down, get off the pot.You can't even get the members posting let alone talking, what happend, why did you go totally against the orgs mission statement in your quest to rubbish other orgs, anglers, boat owners. You failed your members and hundreds of future ones mate.

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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Bob Shotter Member

Bob Shotter

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thought there had to be a con somewhere. so there's caveats, restrictions and conditions attached to your statement, no supprise there then, what a waste of an org and i feel sorry for many hundreds of rsa. Other rsa orgs, charter boats, blahdy blah. All your acheiving is sending guys to the trust, a true rsa hero you are. The 3000 sounds appealing. :rolleyes:

 

Do us all a favour then, shut it down, get off the pot.You can't even get the members posting let alone talking, what happend, why did you go totally against the orgs mission statement in your quest to rubbish other orgs, anglers, boat owners. You failed your members and hundreds of future ones mate.

 

 

Barry mate what I meant by my comment yesterday was don’t get your hopes up in that you might get to run the show because I don’t believe you will get the support nor do I think it likely anyone else will put their hand up. If you were to get the support or anyone else for that matter then I would happily stand down, I never wanted to be the boss or chairman as well you know because I know my failings.

 

Now please note this is Elton’s site and the topic is not RSA-UK if you want to discuss RSA-UK further then go to the org and do it I will not respond here again.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Now where was I oh yes, you know how you can sleep on a thought and wake up with a clear picture, well with that in mind I would like to make a further comment on what Leon had to say yesterday Quote ‘I did tell Benyon that as both a coarse and game angler I was much happier than as a sea-angler, constantly being led up long blind-alleys by DEFRA then abandoned without delivery of anything of significance.’

 

Now I don’t want to get into the fresh water side even though I think some might say how fed up they are with all the regulations and the poor fish on offer but it’s this DEFRA thing that I’m thinking about and having now had the pleasure of meeting with you Leon I have to admit I found a very nice chap who was as expected quite well clued up and while our views may well be miles apart you like all of the reps I have meet so far was both passionate and dedicated to the cause.

 

My point is the ‘Nice guy’ bit, it’s one thing to sit a chat with the minister or DEFRA they need people to do that so they can tic boxes but if they don’t deliver could it be because you are so nice, politics is not a nice peoples game it is full of power maniacs and control freaks who may well appear to be nice but would have no trouble shafting you. Just look at the last big push by B.A.S.S. to up the Bass MLS during the last administration, B.A.S.S. looked to have a deal on the table until the money men in the NFFO world stuck a spoke in the wheel ( See http://www.rsa-uk.org/rsafiles/SeaBassRegs.pdf )

 

At the first Cefas steering group meeting last summer Iain Matheson (DEFRA) asked me to tell him what anglers wanted from DEFRA I told him a few days later and never heard another word. Iain has now moved on from DEFRA so that’s the end of that one.

 

The thing is it should not be that way these people are public servants and have a duty to deliver it is something we all seem to forget these days, how on earth did they get away with overturning a regulation after a consultation process was complete. I don’t know I wasn’t involved so can’t be sure if the NFFO took part in the consultation or not but it does not look that way to me.

 

I firmly believe DEFRA needs to give rather than take I said as much at the Cefas meeting and angling reps need to get together and find a common goal and see to it DEFRA takes note, they work for us it is not the other way around and being nice to them gets you nowhere.

 

Nick I believe we have had this conversation before you as a scientist and often need work from them so you have to be nice we on the other hand pay the wages of these people and should start to demand something in return even if it is only to tell them to naff off and leave us alone.

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barry luxton Member

barry luxton

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As regards to the org, i believe that you have ruined it with your secular ideals and it may well prove to be impossible to get it back on track in any event, thats why i suggest drop it, get rid of it. Not doing you or the rsa any favours mate. I won't go into your org's web site as i am not a member, remember. A time ago, i gave you a proposel, attempt to get it back on track, the only one that the rsa received, remember, you filed that in file 13 just because i wrote it. No where in that proposel did i link it with i,me. It was genuine, you failed to give your members a chance with that one.

 

As for defra, i happen to agree with you after many consultations, to realise, they all came to nothing, all it acheive's is their money train management trundles on. A prime example is the amount of money that went into the mcz project and now they are looking at different directions because the main players, commercially feel that they got the rotten end of the stick, thats without anything being set in stone. However if the org had worked, especially with the power of other orgs, clubs, organisations, influence could have been put on the likes of defra and co, just like the nffo, you lost sight of that, down to you mate. I will also not comment further on this topic, unless it's to do with the bass issue, based on the french proposels put forward, some back tracking by ifca's could be in order, that for the rsa is worth a look don't you think.

Free to choose apart from the ones where the trust poked their nose in. Common eel. tope. Bass and sea bream. All restricted.


New for 2016 TAT are the main instigators for the demise of the u k bass charter boat industry, where they went screaming off to parliament and for the first time assisting so called angling gurus set up bass take bans with the e u using rubbish exaggerated info collected by ices from anglers, they must be very proud.

Upgrade, the door has been closed with regards to anglers being linked to the e u superstate and the failed c f p. So TAT will no longer need to pay monies to the EAA anymore as that org is no longer relevant to the u k . Goodbye to the europeon anglers alliance and pathetic restrictions from the e u.

Angling is better than politics, ban politics from angling.

Consumer of bass. where is the evidence that the u k bass stock need angling trust protection. Why won't you work with your peers instead of castigating them. They have the answer.

Recipie's for mullet stew more than welcomed.

Angling sanitation trust and kent and sussex sea anglers org delete's and blocks rsa's alternative opinion on their face book site. Although they claim to rep all.

new for 2014. where is the evidence that the south coast bream stock need the angling trust? Your campaign has no evidence. Why won't you work with your peers, the inshore under tens? As opposed to alienating them? Angling trust failed big time re bait digging, even fish legal attempted to intervene and failed, all for what, nothing.

Looks like the sea angling reps have been coerced by the ifca's to compose sea angling strategy's that the ifca's at some stage will look at drafting into legislation to manage the rsa, because they like wasting tax payers money. That's without asking the rsa btw. You know who you are..

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Bob Shotter Member

Bob Shotter

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As regards to the org, i believe that you have ruined it with your secular ideals and it may well prove to be impossible to get it back on track in any event, thats why i suggest drop it, get rid of it. Not doing you or the rsa any favours mate. I won't go into your org's web site as i am not a member, remember. A time ago, i gave you a proposel, attempt to get it back on track, the only one that the rsa received, remember, you filed that in file 13 just because i wrote it. No where in that proposel did i link it with i,me. It was genuine, you failed to give your members a chance with that one.

 

As for defra, i happen to agree with you after many consultations, to realise, they all came to nothing, all it acheive's is their money train management trundles on. A prime example is the amount of money that went into the mcz project and now they are looking at different directions because the main players, commercially feel that they got the rotten end of the stick, thats without anything being set in stone. However if the org had worked, especially with the power of other orgs, clubs, organisations, influence could have been put on the likes of defra and co, just like the nffo, you lost sight of that, down to you mate. I will also not comment further on this topic, unless it's to do with the bass issue, based on the french proposels put forward, some back tracking by ifca's could be in order, that for the rsa is worth a look don't you think.

 

Couldn’t agree more re the Bass this move has to come first and while I’m not holding my breath if it does happen and other adjustments are made inc the MLS then we might well see more and bigger Bass. On the down side if the CF are restricted then the effort will simply move to another species like the Turbot and Brill that brings anglers like you to the Channel Islands year on year.

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