They're all at it!

[Guest jay_con]

Flybynight.

 

What we have going on here is what a psychologist would call conformity to a majority. Check out some of the social scientific work done by Solomon Asche for an explanation.

 

The Media whipped up (by whoever) have got people thinking there is something terrible going on. Now despite the actual real evidence people darent say or think anything different.

 

Ok there will be those here who have had negative experiences, I dont deny what you say is true. But the rest of us shouldn't be dragged along by hysteria created by the press for whatever reason.

[Guest Flybynight]

Hi Jim - just wondering what your definition of non-British is? Is it based on language? So if these folks learned to speak fluent English would that do? And who defines what that is? Or should they have had 2 generations in the country? Or not be too brown skinned? Or be Christian? Or???? Or have a British passport? (Remember both Labour and Tories have sold British passports to foreign business men without hesitation...and often people with murkier pasts than would bear any kind of scrutiny)

 

Paxman wrote a book about Englishness (not Britishness - but....the points were relevant) which hit the nail: it is very hard to define these things in any meaningful way. And generally these terms are just used to support generalised complaints. I genuinely don't know of any useful definition...

 

FBN

[jim doyle]

I find it perplexing that we can scream and shout about economic migrants coming to britain but condone the number of brits who work in the bars of the tourist spots in spain. The same tabloids that spout indignation about people comming here to work would be up in arms screaming foul play if spain took the same attitude. If its ok for someone to buy a lake in france employ a couple of brits to run it, advertise it as frence carping holidays, why complain when some one comes here to pick berries or prepare fish? both parties are exploiting the situation. Rumor has iit that both parties take carp from waters illeagally(allegedly) so they may have more in common than they think. If the ability to speak fluent english is a pre requesite for staying in britain it takes out anyone who speaks with a local dialect, or the welsh,gaelic and scots speakers in these islands.

[Ken Davison South Wales]

I agree with you FBN, but there is a but.I worked abroad for more years than I care to remember.

 

There were very strict rules for employment, education and wellness being the leading contenders.

 

There were religious restrictions in KSA, which were beyond belief.

 

Bottom line: If you wished to work there you had to follow the principles laid down by that country.

 

All to often over here we are battered with the race relations laws, turn someone down for a job because they are not suitable, if they are British and white no problem, if they are of any other ethnic culture you are open to being labelled a racist.

 

This just one example of why the media has an audience to play to and there are many others.

 

I am proud to say I have many friends from different cultures, these people accept me for who I am and like wise.

 

There is however a large number who do not want to fit into British society and have things like arranged marriages to avoid integration.

 

In order for a society to run harmoniously these situations must be removed, after all this country does have a large majority indigenous population who should by human rights have the largest shout in their own country.

 

[ 19. April 2005, 01:41 PM: Message edited by: Ken Davison South Wales ]

[Guest Flybynight]

Ken - I can't disagree with you. There is a level of common sense required in all this. It's just that at the moment the balance has gone completely, and the common view is close to insanity. Truth and facts definitely have almost nothing to do with the debate. The Refugee Council published a survey they had commissioned recently: the average Brit believes that 23% of the world's assylum seekers come here. No wonder folks are scared!

 

I too have lived and worked (extensively) overseas (Central and W Africa, Eastern Europe, Indo-Asia and SE Asia, specifically, as well as various bits of Europe). What I found mostly was that as a relatively wealthy European (relative to the locals you understand ), I could generally hire someone to find a way of getting through irritating local laws. Reality was, I was always an economic migrant: working overseas generally in a job that could have been done by a local (though the argument made byt he local office was always, of course, that one couldn't be found).

 

In those situations, little clusters of ex-patriates would develop and live like gods, treating the locals appallingly (mostly - not always) - with no thought that they didn't have absolutely right to be there, paying no taxes in any country and rarely speaking the local language. Disgusting - but we don't complain about that here and that is a lot worse in my view than our own immigration problem...

 

FBN

[Guest stevie cop]

Get real.

 

If these people are coming here to escape persecution, if they are in fear of their lives, why do the cross several safe boarders to get here? When they are turned away, why do they keep trying to get back here? If I was in fear of my families lives, I would be grateful of any shelter in any safe country. Yet these people burned down a perfectly good centre because it meant that they couldn't disappear. There are some genuine asylum seekers, but the vast majority are opportunists taking advantage of the shambles that labour has made of our immigration system.

 

Why are most so called asylum seekers young men? They are here for themselves, not their families. Why do they leave their Mothers, Fathers, Sisters, Wives and Children in their country of origin?

 

In the area of London where I work, immigrants run a huge prostitution ring. The also run huge drug and arms rings. There are frequent running battles in the streets involving rival immigrant groups. They use machetes and carve each other up. They shoot each other and burn down their rivals houses. A lot of these people committed atrocities in their own countries. They burned women and children in their homes. Yet we welcome them over here with open arms and some people still insist on making excuses for them.

 

It makes me sick.

[Guest stevie cop]

By the way @spring@, who owned the coal? Who planted it and harvested it?

 

Or was it a commonly owned resource?

[Guest stevie cop]

And Ken. Who said there was a terrorist threat? Tony bLiar?

[Guest jay_con]

I get your point steve. But there was no law in place to protect it, the miners werent sneaking in to get a bit to earn some extra cash were they?. I dont think it was threatened with extinction, was it?????????.

 

It was a very very different situation that happened over 20 years ago.

[Guest jay_con]

The first you will know about any terrorist thraet Ken is when hundreds or even thousands lay dead in one of our cities (God forbid). Try telling the Americans or the Spanish there is no terrorist threat.