immigration

[Guest Brumagem Phil]

Phil, I`ve spoken to you on PM about the Severn enough times to have been surprised with the agression from you on this post.

 

I don`t go into personal attacks or slurs on forums but do quote lines from posts rather than have people thinking I`m basing my comments on supposition.

 

Immigration and racism are only viewed as the same if people are too small minded to come up with constructive reasons for opposing immigration and just use colour as a weak excuse. Yes, it does go on and will do long after we`ve shuffled off this mortal coil. Those people are to be pitied not condemned, they probably think Eastenders is real......................

 

I don`t suppose much I say won`t go without being picked up on so in the interests of harmony I`ll draw my contribution to this thread to a close.

 

 

No mate, peoples whole attitude toward immigration is tainted by the same ignorance and sterotyping that brings about racism..........is all much of a muchness mate.

 

Bottom line is this country has spent the past 50 years being built on immigration but because the GOVERNMENT are too lazy to stop the illegals or are too generous to those who do come in, its now easy pickings for people to slag off the immigrants. Its about time people pointed the finger where it shouldnt be pointed rather than at the easy targets.

 

I wasnt being aggressive toward you...........I just debate hard. No offence or personal slight intended.

[Peter M]

interesting points by peter maccue, however, even those figures show that overall there is a need in this country for immigration the following quote sums it up for me:

 

 

"The IPPR says most are "likely to be doing jobs that could be characterised as dirty, difficult and dangerous", including work in construction, agriculture, cleaning and residential care. It concludes that deporting hundreds of thousands of "irregular migrants", as it describes them, is "simply not feasible".

[peter mccue]

Peter this tread is so 'thead- bare' now I dont no for sure what was said when and to who. If I got it wrong Peter I apologise. However just to clear things

up, just what is your stance on Immigration to the UK?

 

Apology accepted Rabbit you got it very wrong.

 

However, I did ask you a question first, what points out of that list did you find misleading?

[peter mccue]

interesting points by peter maccue, however, even those figures show that overall there is a need in this country for immigration the following quote sums it up for me:

"The IPPR says most are "likely to be doing jobs that could be characterised as dirty, difficult and dangerous", including work in construction, agriculture, cleaning and residential care. It concludes that deporting hundreds of thousands of "irregular migrants", as it describes them, is "simply not feasible".

 

Quite agree Peter, there can be little doubt that this country of ours has reaped the benefits of immigration for hundreds of years & WILL continue to do so. The Migration watch list I posted readily accepts the need for immigration, or so it appeared to me.

 

However, any government policy no matter what the potential benefits, will invariably implode causing serious problems whilst doing so, if not controlled & regulated. This, I think is the problem, immigration is not being regulated it is seemingly out of control.

 

It is interesting that a recent poll, had 60% of Asians wanting immigration either stopped altogether or radically reduced.

[Guest rabbit]

Apology accepted Rabbit you got it very wrong.

 

However, I did ask you a question first, what points out of that list did you find misleading?

Peter

 

Like I said if I am wrong then I apologise. I also asked you a question as to what was your stance on Immigration into the UK, perhaps you be kind enough to reply.

 

As far as what I felt was misleading fron the document, well mainly its sets out the argument for the one thing it denies that Britain should be a fortress, and one of the arguments for, that runs throgh the document is population increase in this country as a direct result of immigration.

 

The world as a whole will have a problem with population, and it is already a problem be it in China, India wherever. Britain as with any other country in the world will not be able to isolate herself from this problem by merely resricting access. It may stall the inevitable problems that an over populated planet will have, but for only a matter of time. It is a frightening scenario, and we are now just seeing the first problems that are taking hold, we need to look beyond our own shores as to solutions, as do all other countries. Perhaps we should start with the Vatican as to its beliefs in contraception?

Edited April 1, 2006 by rabbit

[peter mccue]

Peter

 

Like I said if I am wrong then I apologise. I also asked you a question as to what was your stance on Immigration into the UK, perhaps you be kind enough to reply.

 

As far as what I felt was misleading fron the document, well mainly its sets out the argument for the one thing it denies that Britain should be a fortress, and one of the arguments for, that runs throgh the document is population increase in this country as a direct result of immigration.

 

The world as a whole will have a problem with population, and it is already a problem be it in China, India wherever. Britain as with any other country in the world will not be able to isolate herself from this problem by merely resricting access. It may stall the inevitable problems that an over populated planet will have, but for only a matter of time. It is a frightening scenario, and we are now just seeing the first problems that are taking hold, we need to look beyond our own shores as to solutions, as do all other countries. Perhaps we should start with the Vatican as to its beliefs in contraception?

 

Got to be honest Rabbit I didn't feel any conflict in the fortress statement. They are not suggesting a complete cessation of immigration, but a controlled & regulated policy where numbers can be managed, as in the past.

 

If I've read your post right & you are suggesting that the overpopulation problem is worldwide, & as such the solutions should be arrived at by the world at large not just dealt with on our own shores, then we are in complete agreement. However, we need to make sure our own society is not damaged beyond recovery whilst we wait for the rest of the world to catch up.

 

As for my views, I am in full support of immigration at a level where society can handle the influx without threats to the very fabric of our democracy, as has been the case for most of our history.

 

Migrants to this country have enrichened, enlightened & strengthened our society for hundreds of years because we have managed the numbers to maintain stability. Now we have the insane problem of a multitude of subcultures conflicting with the established culture & creating serious tensions within the country at large. In my view a totally avoidable problem brought on by abysmal management.

 

It doesn't help when you have a section of society obsessed with PC that makes a debate involving all views virtually impossible.

[Snatcher]

Christ! a few raw nerves touched here Good border control might help a tadge

[Guest rabbit]

Got to be honest Rabbit I didn't feel any conflict in the fortress statement. They are not suggesting a complete cessation of immigration, but a controlled & regulated policy where numbers can be managed, as in the past.

 

If I've read your post right & you are suggesting that the overpopulation problem is worldwide, & as such the solutions should be arrived at by the world at large not just dealt with on our own shores, then we are in complete agreement. However, we need to make sure our own society is not damaged beyond recovery whilst we wait for the rest of the world to catch up.

 

As for my views, I am in full support of immigration at a level where society can handle the influx without threats to the very fabric of our democracy, as has been the case for most of our history.

 

Migrants to this country have enrichened, enlightened & strengthened our society for hundreds of years because we have managed the numbers to maintain stability. Now we have the insane problem of a multitude of subcultures conflicting with the established culture & creating serious tensions within the country at large. In my view a totally avoidable problem brought on by abysmal management.

 

It doesn't help when you have a section of society obsessed with PC that makes a debate involving all views virtually impossible.

Yes the belief that the over poulation of the world will impact no matter what steps are taken to limit immigration. These Islands are truly multi cultural in diversity and yet we are as a nation divided. We Brits are and have been very tolerant of new cultures that find a home here. Unfortunately the very cultures that we accepted have not fully accepted our herritage and culture, and further some have undermined it. Yes we have been naive in thinking that the more religious driven sections would somehow become 'British', but they have not, and have no wish to. Previous Governments have not understood the immigration impact, perhaps we should swallow some pride and look to Australia New Zealand, or Canada for direction, for those countries seem to have managed the problem rather well. No theres irony.

[Jim Roper]

I can't see that we are better off for having loads of Brits on benefit while all the foreigners are sending most of their wages home.

Poland has a scheme whereby someone can come here for 6 months to earn Sterling and know that their job is kept open for them back home.

[kleinboet]

Fact is we as a nation need immigrants to feel the jobs that the English will not do.

 

 

 

Agreed - But don't you think it would be cheaper to use the American system whereby they offer you job interviews according to your education and if you turn down three in a row, your money is stopped.

That way we would not "need" illegal immigrants.

Australia has a good policy, they only allow those who can pay their own way or can fill a skills shortage, to enter their country as an immigrant!