The prospects look grim!

[steve pitts]

Hi Stavey

 

I don't blame Sam for feeling the way he does.

As Steve C says, it is the management system that should bear the blame - it has let sea anglers down big time.

 

But once again, to be honest, less than 10 years ago Defra and FSCs didn't know sea anglers existed (or chose to ignore us) and the representation that sea anglers did have was heavily linked to grants from the Government, which was hardly condusive to a robust challenge to the established fish management heirachy.

 

I've said before, that bag limits and licences have been on the cards for years and inshore fish stocks have been deteriorating for even longer.

This is nothing new and some people have been individually hammering away at the establishment for years, sometimes with little support from their fellow anglers.

 

If there is a positive side to all this, it will certainly get a few more sea anglers to take notice of what is being proposed and maybe they will wake up to the fact that they should be supporting those who do represent them - be that their local club, federation or national organisation. I think that even the tackle trade is waking up to the realities of supporting their trade organisations with better levels of funding.

 

I fully agree with Steve and those who oppose the introduction of bag limits and licences - let's see a dramatic turnaround in the emphasis given to improve our sport by Government and some tangiable results, before we even think about these latest restrictions and charges.

 

Either way - sea fishing as we knew it 25 years ago has changed imeasurably and we either accept that 'free' fishing means crap sport, or we put our hands in our pockets to fund the NFSA or whoever is best placed to represent sea anglers and get some results in our favour.

 

Cheers

Steve

Edited December 29, 2006 by steve pitts

[frankthebass]

I was baught into angling by my Dad and spending every day I could on his charter boat or by a pond somwhere.

 

Now days 9 times out of 10 I choose to fish alone to get time away from the real world. Angling for me has always ment freedome. And the thought of having my angling restricted without a restriction in commercial effort would take a lot of the magic out of it and we would have given our rights away for nothing.

Edited December 29, 2006 by frankthebass

[stavey]

Hi Stavey

 

I don't blame Sam for feeling the way he does.

As Steve C says, it is the management system that should bear the blame - it has let sea anglers down big time.

 

But once again, to be honest, less than 10 years ago Defra and FSCs didn't know sea anglers existed (or chose to ignore us) and the representation that sea anglers did have was heavily linked to grants from the Government, which was hardly condusive to a robust challenge to the established fish management heirachy.

 

I've said before, that bag limits and licences have been on the cards for years and inshore fish stocks have been deteriorating for even longer.

This is nothing new and some people have been individually hammering away at the establishment for years, sometimes with little support from their fellow anglers.

 

If there is a positive side to all this, it will certainly get a few more sea anglers to take notice of what is being proposed and maybe they will wake up to the fact that they should be supporting those who do represent them - be that their local club, federation or national organisation. I think that even the tackle trade is waking up to the realities of supporting their trade organisations with better levels of funding.

 

Hi steve

 

Well it seams everything is set in motion so to speak for the next couple of years as regards this rsa strategy along with those that are in place as reps on these various committees, i am not going to knock leon or any of the other guys for putting themselves forward, as i would not have the inclination time or money to do myself, like i have said things here are so ballsed up with the lack of any sort of decent sized fish available, that having any sort of say in how fisheries policies are put forward in the future is a start i guess in the right direction for area's like mine, in others i dont know if this is wanted so much maybe? cheers..........

Edited December 30, 2006 by stavey

[steve pitts]

Hi steve

 

Well it seams everything is set in motion so to speak for the next couple of years as regards this rsa strategy along with those that are in place as reps on these various committees, i am not going to knock leon or any of the other guys for putting themselves forward, as i would not have the inclination time or money to do myself, like i have said things here are so ballsed up with the lack of any sort of decent sized fish available, that having any sort of say in how fisheries policies are put forward in the future is a start i guess in the right direction for area's like mine, in others i dont know if this is wanted so much maybe? cheers..........

 

Hi Stavey

 

I'm not so sure that things are as cut and dried as that.

As you'll see from my recent response to Glenn (Thanks Glenn) there are 'new' people coming onboard all the time and I know for a fact that those who have been up at the front line would welcome anyone else who has the abilities and time to become more involved at local and national level.

 

Money is another issue altogether - some clubs and organisations are able to cover travel expenses, because they have dedicated funds to support their reps, others are not able to do this and the reps pay for their own ex's out of their pocket. I for one, admire such commitment.

 

You've mentioned your area, as being somewhere that the fishing is ballsed up a number of times now.

Could I ask - Where abouts are you and what where your preferred species and why do you think that the fishing has gone downhill?

 

Do you know if there is an RSA rep on your Sea Fisheries Committee and if so, who he is?

 

Cheers

Steve

[JRT]

I don't think it's fair blaming BASS and the BMP for the crass decisons and policies that DEFRA make up. The whole point of the BMP is to restrict and police the commercial effort rather than just restictions on RSA's. The commercials have simply turned this around in their favour.

Also if people unite behind a single plan instead of bickering then we are far more likely to succeed. I agree it just sucks the ethusiasm for angling when local beaches are awash with nets. I want a 1 mile inshore netting ban.

 

JRT

[glennk]

Money is another issue altogether - some clubs and organisations are able to cover travel expenses, because they have dedicated funds to support their reps, others are not able to do this and the reps pay for their own ex's out of their pocket. I for one, admire such commitment.

 

how would we get an invite to attend the next meeting where the rsa strategy is discussed ?

[Steve Coppolo]

Also if people unite behind a single plan instead of bickering then we are far more likely to succeed. I agree it just sucks the ethusiasm for angling when local beaches are awash with nets. I want a 1 mile inshore netting ban.

 

JRT

 

The trouble is, we don't have a single plan worthy of everyones support. The bass management plan is/was excellent, but it now seems dead in the water since the it fell at the first hurdle. That is a great shame because it could have lead the way for the rest of RSA. The current RSA strategy I woudn't give you tuppence for and I can't see it getting much support from anyone other than those who wrote it. For example, somewhere near the beginning of the document it states "Adopting an ‘ecosystem based approach’ will be the ultimate aspiration for RSA. When in fact the ultimate aspiration for RSA should be more and bigger fish in the sea. Without that nothing else matters, unless you happen to be more of an environmentalist than an angler.

 

If we have a single plan it should be to put more and bigger fish in the sea.

 

Apparently DEFRA knocked back RSA's initial strategy plan and told them to come back with something that would be acceptable to all stakeholders, ie, commercial fishermen. Therefore it has been admitted that the "revised" RSA strategy would aim for what would be achievable, ie, bag limits and licences, rather than what would be nice to have, ie, fish.

 

In my opinion this RSA strategy should be opposed until such a time as fisheries managers have given us more and bigger fish. If they impose bag limits and licences, so be it. At least we can keep arguing against them. If we follow the current strategy plan and agree to bag limits, licences and a host of other stupid restrictions such as hook sizes, (Yes! It's in there!), we will never again be able to complain or try to change anything in the future because we would have signed up for these measures.

[Steve Coppolo]

how would we get an invite to attend the next meeting where the rsa strategy is discussed ?

 

I don't think you can Glenn. The only thing you can do is write to Nicola Clarke at DEFRA and tell them you are totally opposed to the RSA strategy as it is, and that it doesn't represent the wishes of the UK's sea anglers. Make sure you mention more and bigger fish, because they seem to have forgot that's what we want. If a secretary of a club wrote saying he represented X amount of anglers, that might add a bit more weight.

[glennk]

Cheers Steve.

 

I was talking to Paul on the phone this morning and he said he would possibly take a day off and come down to London to take part in the debate. Sounds like it's a closed shop though which is a shame. We will be writing to Nicola and anyone else we can think of. We are currently trying to engage the northern federation of sea anglers which has a substantial membership. Does anyone reading this have a number for Michael edwards who is the head gadge at the federation ? If you dont want to give me his number I could pm you mine to pass on.

[stavey]

Hi Stavey

 

I'm not so sure that things are as cut and dried as that.

As you'll see from my recent response to Glenn (Thanks Glenn) there are 'new' people coming onboard all the time and I know for a fact that those who have been up at the front line would welcome anyone else who has the abilities and time to become more involved at local and national level.

 

Money is another issue altogether - some clubs and organisations are able to cover travel expenses, because they have dedicated funds to support their reps, others are not able to do this and the reps pay for their own ex's out of their pocket. I for one, admire such commitment.

 

You've mentioned your area, as being somewhere that the fishing is ballsed up a number of times now.

Could I ask - Where abouts are you and what where your preferred species and why do you think that the fishing has gone downhill?

 

Do you know if there is an RSA rep on your Sea Fisheries Committee and if so, who he is?

 

Cheers

Steve

 

Hi steve

 

If you check out one of many of the late john darling's books or articles about the bass fishing around an area famous for people jumping off a shear cliff edge in sussex, you will know where i am, the amount and size of those fish that jd and local anglers used to catch are all just distant memories now slightly to the east the sandy beaches were just as prolific with cod catches not today though steve, and have not been for a couple of decades or more, i dont buy in to the global warming theory for the dissapearance of cod here being the only factor as this would not explain the dissapearance of the decent sized bass at the same time, so what are we left with, could it have been the introduction of the cheap mono nets that have been strewn and drifted extensively through out this area over the decades? i think this more likely dont you? or maybe i am wrong and all the large bass and cod for that matter have gone north with the global warming? people like glenk and others in the north east are catching cod by the score but i dont see many bass being caught there though.

 

As for rsa reps on the local sfc, well i know alan brothers is one of them and i do try to keep in touch and indeed had a meet with him (along with my local club members) and the chief fishery officer a mr daplin sound familiar? and his clerk a couple of summers ago when rsa reps were first installed, a few things were said about illegal nets but as far as i know nothing was done we did touch on a golden mile type of proposal but that was poo pood and almost looked on in never in a million years type attitude, so we was not very encouraged much to think what might have been possible for the future.

 

I have asked the ssfc for info like what percentage of the 400 plus boats in our tiny area use gil nets and how many fleets each boat may use? but they say they dont have that kind of info (if they are half serious about what they propose on their website i believe they should know such information) i also put in a proposal for a very slight change in a bylaw that they said would not even get to be considered to be even looked at unless i backed it up with very strong scietific evidence, they know as well as i do the copious amounts of money that would cost so that put an end to that.

 

You see steve individuals backed up by their clubs have tried to do things in their areas but as you know it is a complete waste of time under the present regime of sfc's and this will be no different at these inshore working group meetings either, i would rather see the rsa reps stick to a proper conservation proposal like the golden mile hook or by crook! and threaten to all walk out of all future meetings and not attend any future ones( including rsa reps on sfc's) if the golden mile is not part of the final stradegy put forward, and licenses/bag limits are, because as far as i can see we have not been given anything to lose, and after all, the government have now!! according to the drew report so we are told, cheers........

 

ps on the golden mile issue i would like to ad that if anglers opposed this in their area fair enough ie, not wanted not needed then licenses and bag limits should not apply but in areas where it was asked for by their rsa, then i would have no objection to bag limits and a licenses in those areas.

Edited December 30, 2006 by stavey