Rsa versus Commercial

[glennk]

Seems like wars are beginning.

 

The NFFO calls for Bass managment plan MLS to be scrapped.

 

Bass managment plan is put on hold by the minister amidst claims from NFFO of massive discards.

 

Earlier in this week NFSA make a statement calling for the government to sort out commercial fishermen before they will support the governments licence plans (is this in anyway linked to geovernments backtracking on BMP MLS ?? certainly is a coincidence and would confirm thoughts of some anglers that the licence is linked to bass fishing).

 

Then the commercial fishermen through the angling news alert the commercial fishing community that they have come under attack from angling representatives.

 

Now the commercials and the eu come under attack from wwf. The NFFO load up the big gun Barry Daes and they fire back saying peacetime is over.

 

Seems to me we are finally getting to the crooks of the matter - The finger points at the commercials from several fronts. Will there be a cod ban ? will anglers be banned too ?

 

It will be interesting to see how this one pans out.

[barry luxton]

The NFFO calls for Bass managment plan MLS to be scrapped.

 

Bass managment plan is put on hold by the minister amidst claims from NFFO of massive discards.

 

These few words really get up my nose, It's total tosh from nffo and bradshaw has been sucked in. What a way to run a fishery. Next on the list will be a bass shortage, along with the cod, that will be good. Not.

[wurzel]

These few words really get up my nose, It's total tosh from nffo and bradshaw has been sucked in. What a way to run a fishery. Next on the list will be a bass shortage, along with the cod, that will be good. Not.

 

Hello barry

 

Why is it total tosh? the discards was only one part of the nnfo's case, If I remember correctly there was also some input from some sw anglers to the nnfo's case, Bradshaw is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Why should there be a bass shortage? and if there was the UK only accounts for about 20% of all bass landings, so will what ever is forced on the UK fishermen make that much difference?

[barry luxton]

Hello barry

 

Why is it total tosh? the discards was only one part of the nnfo's case, If I remember correctly there was also some input from some sw anglers to the nnfo's case, Bradshaw is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Why should there be a bass shortage? and if there was the UK only accounts for about 20% of all bass landings, so will what ever is forced on the UK fishermen make that much difference?

 

Wurzel it is the trawlers who are hanging on and relying on the 36cm bass to the detriment of the quality of the bass stock. why? What is the problem with regards to trying to increase the value of the stock for all? There are two kinds of commercial in my mind, i have no problem with the likes of gill netting for example as the discard is negliable, compared with trawling. The nffo have rightly said that they are concerned about discard, in my mind this is were they are so intransigent. If it would cause damage to the stock as they say why wont they consider netting as apposed to trawling to reduce the discard? You have even said that the bass fishing is sometimes on a mixed basis, fine, then there will be discard to an extent, but to just target bass alone is the problem i have based on the discard. What is the actuall value of these 36cm bass, commercially very little, let them grow.

 

I am concerned for the bass stock as there is no real restriction on it, i agree that is is only a very small value to the uk ltd commercially, but when it's gone it's gone, i would hate to take a chance. The nffo have said that they want the mls increase totally scrapped, i don't.

I don't know where these sw anglers are, even the chairman remains elusive. All of us need the bass stock, what is the problem with moving the mls up to forty? I challenge anyone to read the BASS proposel summitted to defra at the time of the bass consultation and comment on that afterwards. I'm off fishing, see you monday.

[steve pitts]

Hello barry

 

If I remember correctly there was also some input from some sw anglers to the nnfo's case, Bradshaw is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

 

Have to agree with you on Bradshaw's position - he could not sign off the Statutory Instrument to increase the bass mls, given that the NFFO deligation presented new 'evidence' on potential discards.

 

If he had pressed ahead, he would have risked a legal challenge (bear in mind the bass action group have all that lolly behind them - wonder what will happen to the donations if there is no legal challenge. Must remember to ask for a refund ).

 

On the subject of the SW anglers rep - well, his comments fly in the face of recent research on behalf of the Invest in Fish South West initiative, who's aim is to encourage sustainable use of marine resources -

 

Invest in Fish work package 10 (a)

The motivation, Demographics and Views of South West Sea Anglers…….

 

Research conducted by Nautilus Consultants and Plymouth University

 

Survey of sea anglers’ attitudes - 92% of whom living in the South West

 

Extracts–

 

4.2.1

Species caught and species targeted –

The favourite species to target is bass, by a large margin….

 

5.2.1

The catch of the angler’s favourite species is extremely important attribute

 

5.2.3

Size of fish -

Anglers will pay £13.27 for a 50% increase in the size of individual fish, making this a very important attribute

 

Management policies should aim to increase the size of fish, as well as the numbers of fish caught, as this has a major impact on the angling experience. (authors’ bold text)

 

6.1.2

By Species -

As bass is the species that anglers like to target the most, there is a large value derived from bass angling in the region. This value could be increased substantially by increasing the stocks and individual sizes of fish.

 

Table 7.3

Increased minimum landing sizes was the joint- most popular management option when applied across commercial and recreational sectors; tying with closed areas to all fishing.

 

7.3.2

Anglers’ own suggestions –

By far the most common response from anglers, when asked about their favoured management option, was restrictions on commercial fishing.

Anglers also favoured gear restrictions, minimum landing sizes (perhaps linked to gear restrictions), seasonal closures (particularly to protect spawning stock) and protection for specific species. Another clear theme was the need for improved enforcement.

 

Maximum Landing Sizes

The was some support for Maximum Landing Sizes (as well as Minimum Landing Sizes), in recognition of the importance of large individuals to the reproductive capacity in the stock. It is clear that anglers derive disproportional benefit from catching larger fish, but may well be receptive to returning them alive.

 

7.4

Summary-

Many sea anglers are supportive of measures… including minimum landing sizes

 

The change in the quality of sea angling can effect the value of sea angling through a number of mechanisms: it can attract new entrants to the sport: it can change the level of participation of existing anglers; it can change the value that anglers gain from their sport.

 

Results derived from the choice experiment indicate that a 50% in the size of fish would result in existing anglers making 43% more trips; a 50% increase in the catch of the favourite species would mean 33% more trips

 

 

 

 

Based on this independently conducted research of a cross-section of SW sea anglers, I would suggest that Mr Alcock's declaration, that SW anglers don't want an increase in the bass MLS, is all cock.

 

Cheers

Steve

[glennk]

Hypocrites the lot of them. The NFFO bring down the BMP on the issue of discards yet every autumn off the Yorkshire coast there are discards of juvenile cod which would by far outweigh the bass discards in this instance.

 

In the words of a top CEFAS scientist

 

If the results of this project are seen as typical of cod fishing in this area in all

years, the Yorkshire coast fishery would be regarded as predominantly an

immature fishery, providing information about the recruitment of cod to a very

localised area. Repeat of the survey in spring using an 80 mm mesh might be

useful for warning of a large year-class about to become vulnerable to the fishery,

thereby permitting measures to be taken to reduce wastage due to discarding.

 

 

The NFFO don't seem to be complaining about this. Wonder if it has anything to do with the boats of one of the NFFO exec committee being involved in this fishery.

[wurzel]

Hypocrites the lot of them. The NFFO bring down the BMP on the issue of discards yet every autumn off the Yorkshire coast there are discards of juvenile cod which would by far outweigh the bass discards in this instance.

 

In the words of a top CEFAS scientist

The NFFO don't seem to be complaining about this. Wonder if it has anything to do with the boats of one of the NFFO exec committee being involved in this fishery.

 

 

 

 

Glenn

 

I am getting fed up with you wheeling out that out dated peace of crap.

 

For a start there is no cod fishery any where on this planet where they use 80 mm nets, 120 is the minimum size.

It is a very localized fishery.

 

Quote

Repeat of the survey in spring using an 80 mm mesh might be

useful for warning of a large year-class about to become vulnerable to the fishery,

thereby permitting measures to be taken to reduce wastage due to discarding.

 

Those measures are in place and have been for several years.

[glennk]

If that's the case wurzel why bother replying because what I just said wouldn't be an issue - would it ?.

 

re 120 mm codend - If you read the actual research wurzel it clearly states they are using 100mm codend in addition to 120mm.

 

They are hypocrites, the fishery does exist and the spring survey doesn't. How can they complain about bass discards when they allow this to continue ? Like I say possibly something to do with whose boats are involved in that fishery.

 

I notice they are also complaining about pair trawling techniques being used off the Yorkshire coast by the French. It was all very different when the local boats were utilising this method (but that was just to save fuel in these hard times wasn't it - nothing to do with multiplying the catching potential.) Another case of hypocrisy.

[wurzel]

If that's the case wurzel why bother replying because what I just said wouldn't be an issue - would it ?.

 

re 120 mm codend - If you read the actual research wurzel it clearly states they are using 100mm codend in addition to 120mm.

 

They are hypocrites, the fishery does exist and the spring survey doesn't. How can they complain about bass discards when they allow this to continue ? Like I say possibly something to do with whose boats are involved in that fishery.

 

I notice they are also complaining about pair trawling techniques being used off the Yorkshire coast by the French. It was all very different when the local boats were utilising this method (but that was just to save fuel in these hard times wasn't it - nothing to do with multiplying the catching potential.) Another case of hypocrisy.

 

 

Hello Glen

 

If they are using 100 mm cod ends they are not targeting cod. whether they are juveniles or not. like I said it's out of date.

 

You keep having a dig at a certain successful fisherman from Whitby, it is unjustified.

 

The French always seem to have all the quota they need to do what ever they want where ever they want no matter where ever they turn up. Probably to do with their government thinking their fleet is an asset to their country.

That is what complaints are about.

Edited March 24, 2007 by wurzel

[glennk]

Hello Glen

 

If they are using 100 mm cod ends they are not targeting cod. whether they are juveniles or not. like I said it's out of date.

 

You keep having a dig at a certain successful fisherman from Whitby, it is unjustified.

 

The French always seem to have all the quota they need to do what ever they want where ever they want no matter where ever they turn up. Probably to do with their government thinking their fleet is an asset to their country.

That is what complaints are about.

 

 

Not having a dig Peter just pointing out the hypocrisy of complaining about discards then discarding yourself and hoping none will notice. Or the hypocrisy of complaining about pair trawling then using the method yourself.

 

Its one thing being successful but quite another being successful if it impacts negatively on fish stocks and other users of the sea.