JB

There seems to be many opinions on this topic. Has anyone considered what area this fish was taken from? I could be wrong, but I believe it was caught in the Norwegian sector. JB

Hello Clicker, Not sure you will get too many logical answers to your questions, seeing as prejudice never shows much reason. Anyway, good luck with your poll. Incidentally, with a name like that, do you originate from Staithes? JB

Hi Ken, Whit (Alan Smith) and his partner in the boats they had, "Frank Carson" (Barry Husband aka Barry Plug) were very good friends of mine from the mid-seventies onwards. In fact, I think Frank still owes me a fiver - or do I owe him one? We lost touch when they stopped fishing and I haven't seen either of them for a couple of years. You should have asked Whit to sing for you - he has a tremendous voice, which would have gone down well in your part of the world. As you say, small world indeed. John

Over the years, eight or ten a year; that one in the aptly-titled photo being the biggest, at 20+ pounds. It was caught east of the Dogger Bank, in the Clay Deep - about 134 miles ENE of Whitby. JB

Here's a grownup one! www.chieftaincharters.co.uk/TWO%20UGLY%20BASTARDS%202(1).jpg

Hi Barry, I am not completely conversant on fishing from the south coast ports, but I think you are correct in your assumption. Because we in the north east have only predominantly targeted cod, it could be for obvious reasons the cause of the massive decline of the charter fishing industry in our part of the world. It was certainly the reason that I chose the path I have over the last decade or so. It was a safer bet to go looking for fish in less- fished areas where I knew there were plenty of fish than to try and discover another species to fish for, and then have to market it to become a viable business. Whether there is another species which can be targeted and turned into a successful angling business in the future in our area, who knows? Hopefully so. JB Disclaimer: This comment is by no means a slur on any individual’s ability to catch fish. I believe it to be an accurate statement of the viability of a charter angling business in the north east.

Hi Barry, If you work it out, a drift of two knots equates to less than a meter per second. I would have thought it would be easy enough to deal with this once you understand the exact scenario. I have taught this method to many anglers and, once mastered, it gives them a greater confidence and control of their rod and reel in this particular situation. It’s all a matter of being in complete control of what is happening. There are many variations on this theme. Yours of pointing the rod directly at the fast then holding on tight is one of them. Occasionally jerking and slacking your line releases the fast. JB

I see where you are coming from. In fact, I have seen it coming for many years. Hence, the principle I have worked on for the last decade or so, which is that each wreck and piece of rough ground in the areas I work is its own ecosystem containing mostly resident fish. Once caught, residential fish take time to replenish themselves; and the general rule is that the less these ecosystems are hammered, the better they produce when you do fish them. You can only catch and keep it once. Of course, migratory fish come under a different rule. JB

Hello Wurzel, I was unaware of your title. Please forgive my ignorance. Are you a peer of the realm, a lord chief justice, or our saviour? My money’s on your being our saviour! JB

Hi Ken, I would love to agree with you; nothing would make me happier. But, no matter which way it is looked at, the British people just put up with the sh1t that our government continually rains on us from a great height. As much as I hate it myself, we do not have the mentality of the French. I have always been one who stands up to be counted, but on most occasions I find myself standing alone. These days, British people have a "feel bad factor". All we ever do is complain; in pubs, cafés and on forums. We don't act. Sadly for us, our government is very aware of this fundamental fact, and treat us accordingly. JB

A plain sort of a day! On the positive side, she wouldn’t take a lot of washing down at the end of the trip. JB

Hi Barry, It is more likely to be the same old story with a bias towards mainland Europe. I have not seen it for myself, but I have been told that there are thirty-odd French trawlers using smaller mesh nets than the UK fleet are allowed, working the Rough Field area and landing up to eight hundred boxes each into Grimsby every two days. Where they get the quota from, who knows? Maybe there is no ‘Q’ in a French dictionary. JB

Very possibly my friend.

Didn’t you know that both your father and myself graduated with honours from the Arkwright School of Economics? In fact, we were their two best students! JB

The cost of boat angling. When I first started to take anglers in the mid sixties, the cost to an angler for a fishing trip from Whitby was six shillings per hour. With beer at two shillings a pint in most pubs, the hourly cost of angling was the equivalent of three pints. In those days there seemed an endless supply of anglers. The NCB provided many boatloads of customers (all complete with NCB oilskins) each day, without counting anyone else. We crowded them all on at twelve to a boat, and at times some had to be turned away. Nowadays, the cost of angling at Whitby works out at approximately four pounds per hour. I’m not sure how many pints of beer you can buy these days for four pounds, but I do know you can’t get **** and buy fish and chips at the end of the evening for a pound any more. I would hazard a guess that the rate of inflation has overtaken the increase in charter boat fees. The cost of running a charter vessel has risen dramatically; the number of anglers going off boat fishing has dropped dramatically. JB

Hi Davey, The angling business is a hard one from an economical point of view and each year it is getting harder. However, with an attitude like that I predict that you will go far and do very well, my friend. Kind regards, John

--> QUOTE(Norm B @ May 14 2007, 10:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Most skippers rods I've seen seem to consist of rings held on by tape and reels that look like they'll fall apart at the first sign of a decent fish, half filled with various coloured line with knots in it. Hi Norm, Your post brought back fond memories for me. I realise I am digressing from the topic I started, but I thought I’d share this memory with you. Back in the late eighties, when cod stocks seemed to be inexhaustible and there was a great abundance of anglers coming to Whitby, I had a small boat named ‘Guide Me’. She was a coble with a wheelhouse and a small engine of 42 horsepower, giving her a maximum speed of six and a half knots. On the plus side, she was extremely economical to run. I was unable to burn five gallons of diesel, no matter how long a day I put in. At that time, I had a commercial licence. I would fish long lines in the winter months, take anglers during the days in summer, and then do light duty, soft ground trawling on the sandy bottom on fine summer nights. I say ‘light duty’ because the boat had a low horsepower engine and we had to haul the net by hand. Nevertheless, we caught our share of Dover soles and it was a worthwhile exercise. When we were taking anglers at that time, most days we would have a full twelve and it was a full-time job for me and my crewmember to look after them. But on the occasional day when we only had a few anglers on board, I looked after the customers’ needs while my crewman fished alongside them. We would land the fish he caught on the Whitby fish market, often landing in excess of two boxes of cod. It was a legal practice in those days. In fact it still is, if you have a commercial licence. The trouble nowadays is that DEFRA has imposed a quota which, if I am correct, only allows under-ten meter boats to land 50 kilos of cod per month. This is less than two boxes of cod per month. So, coming to the point: My crewman of that time was quite a character. The only way to describe him is that he was Whitby’s version of ‘Crocodile Dundee’. And his fishing gear was… well, it had to be seen to be believed. Someone gave him an old solid glass rod. The few rings it had on it were held on by plastic tape. I gave him a worn-out Scarborough reel, which he fastened to the rod with two old rusty jubilee clips. The reel squeaked and rattled and to make it turn he had to dip it in the sea every time, before he dropped down. His main line was made up of any old line he had been given. I’m sure there was a knot at least every 12 to 15 feet, and his terminal tackle was no better than the rest of his gear. One day an angler accidentally stood on the end ring of the rod and broke it. He was unperturbed and just got a hacksaw and cut the end of the rod off, just before the next ring down. But as for catching fish, he regularly out-fished every single person on the boat. Every time I looked up from my work, he was lifting another cod on board. And in those days, there was a good sample of large fish to be caught off Whitby. Anyway, thank you for reawakening in me the memory of those halcyon stress-free days of plenty, and of one of the characters I had the pleasure of having as my crew man. Regards, John

Hi, Newt! Michele again. I have just noticed that this post of John's has been edited by you. It now contains lots of †symbols where there were once speech marks. Could you please explain why you felt the necessity to edit John's post, and why all the †††††â€s now? Kind regards, Michele Michele - I normally don't let the 'edited by' thing show if I did a minor one and all I did was edit http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=63118&hl=whitby&st=260: to remove the : at the end to make the link display normally. If I do any substantive editing I leave a note like this one (although I have not changed your post other than adding this to it). No idea what made the strange symbols appear and leaving the 'edited' line there was an oversight. Newt

Hi, Newt! Michele here, in John's absence. I'm sorry you took offence at John's post - his sense of humour has obviously been misinterpreted, alas. Believe me, John would never be so stupid, naive and unkind as to actually name the skipper he believes was being talked about! I'm surprised that anyone - like yourself - would ever seriously think he would. I apologise on John's behalf, as I am sure he would be mortified to think his post was interpreted as being potentially malicious. Kind regards, Michele

Hi Iggy, Is there a prize if I correctly guess who you are talking about? JB

Hi Ian, I see your point and agree with it, especially with your set up, where you have a high ratio of skippers to anglers on your boats. Also, I understand that you put all your catch back in order for the anglers to be able to catch them again. This is very commendable, and may have to become the way of the future, but we are not that far advanced in Whitby yet; therefore our circumstances are quite different. What my friend was pointing out was that the skippers in question were hogging the fishing at the expense of their customers. I believe one of your customers had a similar experience at Whitby, according to what you posted on page 14, post 266, in the topic Is it the end for charter skippers and fishing clubs? No time to bury your heads http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=63118&hl=whitby&st=260 Presumably the skipper was also fishing to fill up his two boxes? Another point to bear in mind with this topic I have raised is a question I have frequently been asked, with regard to this basic scenario: You arrive at a wreck. On the first few drops, fish are coming to all anglers in abundance. However, on further drifts they become less frequent and finally stop altogether. An angler will ask, “Where’ve all the fish gone?†My answer is, of course, “They are all in your fish tubs.†The angler’s response is usually a look of disbelief, and the comment, “No, I can’t believe that!†The plain fact is that there is no longer an abundance of fish in the sea and angling does have some effect on stocks. Probably not as much as other methods of fishing, but nevertheless quite an effect on local frequently-fished marks. The number of fish to be caught on any given mark is limited; a finite amount. Therefore my friend’s point of view is that every fish the skipper catches and keeps for himself is one less for his paying customers to catch. None of this would be a problem if fish were as abundant as they were fifteen years ago, of course. I am sure that no angler would begrudge a skipper a fish supper for his family, but there is a definite difference between this and a skipper taking away two boxes of fish on a very regular basis. JB

Hi, Leon! Michele here. John read your post out to me just before he had to go out. Your comment made me smile, as I have been saying the same thing to John for a long time. In our six years together, he has entertained me so many times with his reminescences of interesting or amusing incidents at sea and his stories of the commercial fishermen and anglers who have joined him at various times on his life's journey. Now that he has retired, he has finally given in to my encouragement (or was it nagging?) and is starting to record some of his memories. I am enjoying reading them. Ten years ago, John's father, Jack, wrote and illustrated an amusing little book about anglers. Most of the incidents he related were events that happened on board John's boat when Jack crewed for him in the days before he had his own charter boat, the 'Mermaid'. Jack (who I've known for 32 years) sent me a copy when it was first published, and I found it very funny - even though I had never had anything to do with fishing, so it was all new territory for me. However, after I had been at sea with John for a few seasons, I re-read it - and found it even more amusing, as I could relate to the anecdotes through my own experience on a charter boat. Many of the anglers mentioned in Jack's book (mostly unnamed, of course) were still regular customers, so being able to link an incident to the actual person involved gave the reading an extra dimension. Jack's style of writing is very different to John's - it is very comedic. If Spike Milligan had written a book about charter anglers, it would read very much the same way as Jack's book. (P.S. I can actually boast of the fact that Spike Milligan has twice kissed me - but that's another story!) The title of Jack's book is 'The sea angler's reference book, incorporating the "folly" angler's guide to better fishing : a lighthearted inventory of sins and syndromes committed by "folly" anglers on North Sea charter boats'. Jack wrote the book under the pseudonym 'John Hancock'. The 'Sea Angler' magazine came across it and gave it a great plug, and he sold thousands of copies of it. He only has a small box of them left, and has passed them onto us - he is currently in the process of moving from Whitby to York, and it was one less thing to pack. Anyway, if you would like a copy, PM me your address and I'll send you one. Kind regards, Michele

Quite a response so far. Firstly, my friend’s issue was with skippers who CONTINUOUSLY fish on every drift, not skippers who fished now and again. Occasionally, over the years, on scarce days my crewman or myself have dropped a line over the side and caught a fish and given it to someone who has not caught. Or if someone has not caught, and needs a fish in order to spur them on in the interest of encouragement, I have borrowed his rod, caught a fish straight away, and handed it to him to wind in. Hi, Elton, I recognise your point when fishing at anchor because the rod can be left and the skipper’s time is not completely taken up by fishing. I can understand your scepticism, but this is a genuine topic based on truth; which I base all my posts - and indeed every part of my life - on. The only people who might object to this topic are skippers who CONSTANTLY fish throughout their charters. After so many years, as you say, many of my regular anglers are able to look after themselves. But a rod can be cumbersome when trying to deal with multiple fish or a large fish. I think it has become a tradition, and of course a service, to try and help my customers. When you do a job for a great length of time, 'you learn more and more about less'. When you have twelve men fishing one side of the boat (which is a practice I have used for many years now) you can spot tangles before they reach the surface. A few words to the anglers involved as to how to handle the situation can make the solution far simpler, and probably result in just two hooks locked instead of a macramé plant hanger. Also, a fatal mistake in dealing with more complicated situations is to lift everything onboard. If you try and clear the problem over the side, it is usually far simpler and considerably quicker. Once it is lifted onboard, and let go slack on the deck, the problem increases ten fold. Once slack, nylon and braid have lives of their own, and will twist and curl into every conceivable shape. But to clear it over the side takes a free man not holding a rod. When my customers frequently asked the question, ‘How do you get tangles out so quickly?’, the only answer I could give was, ‘When you start to understand all about tangles, maybe it’s bordering on sad… and is time for a change of career.’ On my many angling charters as skipper, occasionally I have seen steady fishing throughout the day, but more often than not the day has slow times and fast and furious times. What’s a good day’s fishing? Opinions vary. The only thing that seems to please most of the people, most of the time, is good service and a box of fish at the end of the day. With twelve anglers, I have seen many long slow periods, and then up to 100 stone of cod come onboard in an hour. In that hour, I see part of my job as quickly clearing tangles, quickly gaffing fish and unhooking them, and offering my customers as much help as possible in order for them to get their hooks back in the water in order to be as efficient as possible in the peak catching time. If at this time I was catching ten stone of fish, and ignoring my customers, they would be catching a lot less. On the other hand, if there were only twenty fish on a wreck, and I caught twelve of them, I feel I woulod be offering my customers a disservice. Especially if I kept all of them for myself. With regard to the issue of novices fishing on board, even on my multi day trips, with all due respect I cannot agree with your stand, Elton – and it certainly would never have made me consider giving up the job! To the contrary, I have always welcomed ‘new anglers’ on board. And we do get a lot of them, for usually parties are made up of groups with different levels of ability and competence; and often non-angling friends will join their mates just for the experience of being at sea on a ‘big adventure’. It was one of the real pleasures of the job to be able to help the novices and hopefully assist them to start out doing the job in the correct manner, and to become proficient at catching fish… and ultimately to get them ‘hooked’ on the joys of angling. After all, the novices of today are the regular customers – and friends – of tomorrow. I have always had a commercial viewpoint on taking anglers. It was my livelihood, not my hobby. Because I worked hard to give my customers the best possible trips and service, I have made a successful career out of the angling industry. I have never had to supplement my income by taking on other work. Now that I have retired, I would love to buy a small boat and ‘play’ at the job, but in the present economic climate it’s not a viable proposition. Personally, I don’t need to go fishing every day, so it’s much cheaper for me to pay for my fishing or to take up offers from friends with boats, giving them my help, information and experience in return. JB

While standing on the quayside at Whitby the other day, I was greeted by an old friend/customer, a man who has fished from Whitby for many years. Due to work commitments, he has been unable to take more than one day off work at a time; and because of the unpredictable nature of his work schedule, he cannot book a fishing trip in advance, so has to phone up the night before a possible trip in the hope of a short notice booking. Consequently, I had not seen him on board the Chieftain for quite a while. He has been going fishing with me since the seventies, when we were both much younger men. He has always been a good angler and caught his fair share of fish. We chatted about the old times in the ‘Guide Me’, and the boatloads of fish for all. Basically we agreed that, in the past, catching a reasonable amount of cod from Whitby was just a case of keeping your terminal tackle in good contact with the sea bed. Unfortunately, nowadays, as cod has become increasingly scarce, the rate of catch is less equal amongst anglers. So the better anglers by far out-catch the rest. Then he went on to tell me of his recent fishing experiences, on other local boats. Some of the boats had skippers who continually fished alongside their customers, some did not. His theory is that nowadays he catches many more fish himself when the skipper of his chosen charter boat DOES NOT fish himself. In fact, he became quite angry when talking about the skippers who constantly fished for themselves. I can understand his point of view. If a particular wreck or piece of rough ground has twenty fish available to be caught on it, the best angler may catch ten or twelve of them. If the skipper is the best angler - which is usually the case, given all the practice he gets - his customers suffer. My friend was not saying skippers should not fish at all, he was saying that if they fish constantly, on every drift, they catch fish their customers would otherwise be able to catch. In my long career as a charter skipper, I rarely had time to fish; neither did my crew. Positioning the boat correctly, so that all the anglers had equal chances of catching; looking after twelve anglers; gaffing, unhooking fish, clearing tangles etc., was always a full time job for myself and my crewmember (who also gutted, filleted, washed and placed all the customers’ fish in the chiller.) Because I don’t fish while skippering the boat, I have not had to deal with anglers’ possible disapproval of such practices. However, I cannot help thinking that if I was an angler booking a fishing trip nowadays, I would insist that the skipper did not continually fish for himself. I would be interested in your views and experiences on this subject. JB

Hi Iggy, Sometimes, when mackerel are about, you cannot get away from them, no matter where you go. With all due respect, the reason you were catching six mackerel at a time is because you had six (or more) hooks on. You could have put one hook on and only been able to catch one at a time. In the case of jigging, a plain lure (on its own, with no decoration whatsoever) sometimes goes through the mackerel and down to the bottom, where you stand a chance of catching something else. But then, the skipper (or person in charge, in your case) should have told you that. JB